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Old November 10, 2008, 02:35 PM   #1
imp
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Walther P22 for concealed carry

My girlfriend has decided that she wants to take the class and start carrying a concealed pistol, and I think thats wonderful. However, she is hung up on the walther p22 because "its cute" and because its a .22 that dosen't offer much recoil.

I've tried to talk her into a larger caliber, not only because the .22 is small and weak, but it is also not nearly as reliable, in any package that I know of, than a centerfire auto.

But...she is a woman. I've tried to talk her into a small .38 revolver, but she will not consider a revover. They're not cute..and all the .380's I look at are too small and will be almost as snappy as my small to midsize 9mm's.

At this point, I'm about to give up and buy her the P22, because I can't think of anything else that is "cute" and has very little recoil in a size small enough to fit into her purse.

If anyone has a suggestion, let me know.
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Old November 10, 2008, 02:48 PM   #2
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The P22 is a fun little plinker but don't think it would be very good for concealed carry, other than the fact that it's small size would make it quite easy to conceal. The P22 is not too accuarate and it's .22lr has minimal, if any, stopping power.

I'd look at some of the .380s or even some of the small 9mms. At least get her to try shooting some of them at a local range.
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Old November 10, 2008, 02:56 PM   #3
OldMarksman
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I know of a number of recent examples of women selecting the P22 for concealed carry. In one case the woman was the significant other of the store salesman.

I'm with JWT. Bigger caliber for SD.
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Old November 10, 2008, 03:24 PM   #4
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My problem with a P22 as a SD weapon has to do with it's penchant for FTFeeds and FTE's. This is based on my experience with the one I bought a couple of years ago.

I think it's light weight and trigger make it difficult to shoot accurately as JTW alluded to.

It is very comfortable in the hand, seems to fit like a glove, and is fun to shoot. But the empties fly all over the place. It is best if the shooter wear a ball cap and a buttoned up shirt.
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Old November 10, 2008, 03:30 PM   #5
David Armstrong
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If that is what she likes, get one for her, make sure it is as reliable as possible, get good ammo for it, and let her carry it. I never understand why guys think they need to do everything in their power to run gals away that are interested in this stuff. If she think she needs to get a bigger caliber after a while, she will let it be known. If the gun is too unreliable for her after a while, she will decide that. The .22 is quite adequate for most DGU incidents, and it is certainly better than something bigger that she would not carry with her.
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Old November 10, 2008, 03:34 PM   #6
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If you force her to carry a gun she doesn't like, she won't carry it. If the Walther P22 is the one she wants, then get it and make sure she becomes a dead shot with it.

That being said, see if she'll look at the Bersa Thunder .380. Not much kick and a lot more stopping power. The Taurus PT138 Mil-Pro, also .380, is also a good choice, and looks a lot like the Walther. My wife loves hers!
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Old November 10, 2008, 04:07 PM   #7
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I did it for a year, but wouldn't usually recomend it as choice #1 for a carry gun. She can always upgrade later if she gets comfortable with it though.
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Old November 10, 2008, 04:09 PM   #8
Keltyke
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Quote:
but wouldn't usually recomend it as choice #1 for a carry gun.
I'd sure recommend it over nothing.
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Old November 10, 2008, 04:15 PM   #9
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True enough. And I would recomend it over one of those NAA mini revolvers or derringers some of the folks here carry, so she could do worse.
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Old November 10, 2008, 07:39 PM   #10
nutty ned
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Some times I carry a P-22, some times one needs a small gun; but, one big enough to hold on to.
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Old November 11, 2008, 12:30 PM   #11
raimius
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Has she tried a P99 or PPS? Sure, they are 25% larger (the P99 anyway), but you get much more powerful calibers in a VERY similar pistol.
I'm thinking she might like a P99 compact...but that is a guess.

If the P22 is the pistol she ultimately decides upon...it sure beats a pointy stick! As they say, a .22 in the hand beats a .45 back home.
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Old November 11, 2008, 02:04 PM   #12
imp
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Well....she read this thread last night, and after some discussion, I think I will get her the P22, at least to start with. To paraphrase many of you, the .22 is not exactly the best thing in the world, but it sure beats the nothing that she carries now, and I would rather her be comfortable with a .22 than not so comfortable with something else.

I'm not giving up entirely though. Between my small aresnal and guns my friends own, I'm hoping to get her some trigger time on something more potent, that will also be comfortable to her.
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Old November 11, 2008, 02:14 PM   #13
Keltyke
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Quote:
I think I will get her the P22, at least to start with.
You are a wise man. Use GOOD ammo, something like CCI Mini-Mags or Velocitors. I'm sure others will have other suggestions. Get her to practice, practice, practice. The tiny caliber will make shot placement and volume even more important than in the larger guns. Have her practice firing the entire magazine and reloading. When she can stitch her initials in the target with it, then let her take it out. LOL!
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Old November 11, 2008, 03:26 PM   #14
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I agree heavily with David and Keltyke (#'s 5&6). The most important thing is that she feels comfortable with the weapon and therefore has confidence in it. My wife carry's a .380 Bersa Thunder. They're very nice, very inexpensive, and I shoot better at mid-range with her Bersa than any of my pistols. I'm not a big fan of the .22 for H/SD either, but it's certainly better than nothing. I would say get her the P22 and let her put several hundred rounds through it. A hit with a .22 is always better than a miss with a .50AE
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Old November 12, 2008, 03:19 PM   #15
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Go to the gun range and RENT her a volume of guns. Rent a P22, .380, 9mm, etc. I personally don't think the P22 has all that much less recoil than a 9mm midframe Glock (G19). The G26 might have a bit more, but would be smaller than the P22 as well.

If you could, I'd have her close her eyes, put one in her hand and have her squeeze off a round downrange - this takes the anxiety of hitting the target out of the way - and she can just judge recoil.

My ex-wife carried a G19 9mm. She wasn't very big, but it was comfortable in her hand and the recoil didn't bother her a bit. Everyone is different. Carrying something is better than nothing, but that 10round .22lr doesn't pack the stopping power or capacity of a 9mm.
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Old November 13, 2008, 03:06 PM   #16
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That pastor in SC last year killed his home intruder with a P22. The Israeli's are reported to have used .22s as secret service assassination weapons. You hear all the time in the news about people being killed by .22s. Apparently they work better than we give them credit. :-) I'd carry one and feel fairly confident with it as long as it is reliable. I don't know anyone who would dare me to shoot them in the face with a .22.
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Old November 13, 2008, 03:20 PM   #17
Shadi Khalil
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The P22 is not a good choice of carry, not for a woman or anyone else, IMO. In order to safely carry it she must lower the hammer by hand, despite the firing pin block I think its still unsafe. The gun is accurate enough and doesnt have any reliabilty isssues, at least mine does not. My mom wanted to take the P-22 and carry it but 3 out of the 5 times she tried to lower the hammer (on a snap cap) it slipped. Its even happened to me on a live round, saftey engaged.
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Old November 13, 2008, 07:27 PM   #18
dchi
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my 2 cents. Mine is not reliable enough, Tried lots of ammo. It needs to be clean and well oiled. The mag pops out by accident several time because the mag release is too soft also the safety has gone on when the gun is being carried in a holster. I've had happen before on the range pulling out of the holster pulling the trigger and clcik! Because the safety engaged when I did not have it on.
BTW I have nothing against carried a .22 for self defense. Its better than a miss with a .38 or 9mm. Not everyone can handle a center fire pistol.
My wife shoots 5 times better with a .22.
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Old November 13, 2008, 09:22 PM   #19
PawDaddy
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How about this?

http://www.taurususa.com/products/pr...ategory=Pistol

Ten rounds of .25 acp. in a very "cute" pistol!
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Old November 13, 2008, 10:13 PM   #20
Mr X
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I agree with all the above postings about learning with the P22. As far as carry, with the above noted limitations,

1) Keep it clean, very clean. One may practice with a centerfire and take it right back out in the holster. The P22 is less forgiving, especially when "practice" can involve 300 rounds... ask how I know that...

2) An added plus is the DA/SA nature of the P22. It will offer a good opportunity to learn the controls and behavior of SA vs DA trigger pulls and hammer position. Big advantages for future expansion.

Similar "cute" smallies that I think could be logical extensions in time may be

1) PPK/s - classic but does not fit all hands.
2) Single stack Sig like P239s - can have better feel for some
3) Beretta .380 - classic again and still small

I recommend against the PPS because it has pretty snappy recoil. And it did not inherit the superb feel of the P99. I think P99s can be a little big for some hands, even with the smallest backstrap. Worth a try in the future certainly but actually functionally very different from the "learner" P22.

Back to the original question of carry, while discussed above I would suggest mini-mag or velociters from CCI.

Thank you for being proactive in asking about the P22 for carry and I wish you the best of luck with instructing safe carry etc.
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Old November 14, 2008, 06:40 AM   #21
Ozzieman
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My wife has a safe full of guns to choose from. From a tricked out Glock 26 to what ever, but what she likes to carry and shoot the most is the P22.
The fact that she is comfortable with it and likes the gun will get her to carry it and that is the most important thing.
Not accurate?
So what, were talking about a self defense gun and it’s more than accurate for the ranges that were talking.
As far as reliability, we have shot thousands of rounds through the one we have and yes it had a couple of FF’s but that was in the first couple of mags and with cheep crap 22’s.
The gun loves Stingers and if you pop a couple of those into some one they are going to leave you alone.
The big thing here is get her to practice with the gun as much as you can, and get GOOD leather for her so that she can carry it correctly,,, which means not in a purse.
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Old November 14, 2008, 12:32 PM   #22
David the Gnome
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If she likes the P22 then my suggestion would be:



or



They're both just as "cute" as the P22 and pack a 9mm punch instead of .22lr.
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Old November 15, 2008, 10:32 AM   #23
White Rice
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Hmmm. 10 rounds of .22 will go into someone very fast and accurately due to the lack of recoil and the typical distances involved in SD carry.

10 rounds of anything is very effective.

My wife is reading this thread with me and she thinks most of you need an attitude adjustment. "Let her...." etc, etc.

Women are not possessions. Most of them have more common sense than the men they pick to "Let him...." have input into their choices in life.

The P22 is a nice pistol to get started with and when, if, perhaps SHE decides to change to something else, she just might do it.

Women know they are weaker physically than almost any man. This isn't a surprise to them. But mentally, I'd say they are equal. Treat her with respect. Be happy she carries you as well as a P22.
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Old November 15, 2008, 11:12 AM   #24
Smaug
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Bad Plan for carry

It sounds like you have made up your mind. Letting her pick the gun was a good choice, but that gun is a bad choice for carry.

Caliber issues aside, it has had reliability issues.

It isn't just Walther, Sig seems to have failed with their Mosquito too.

For a 22 carry gun, I'd recommend one of the following:

S&W 317:



Ruger 22/45, 4" barrel:



Either of these will at least be reliable and fun to shoot. (because not frustrating, because you're spending all your range time clearing her jams)

If you do decide to get the P22, good luck!
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Old November 15, 2008, 11:15 AM   #25
Smaug
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BTW - Where is she planning on carrying this? In the purse, I suppose?

That isn't a good plan, but if she does, a larger gun is back in the picture.

David is right on the mark when you can get her to accept some recoil, and practice up.

But having tried the same thing with my own wife, I know it has to be just so for the woman to buy into it at all. Better a 22 than nothing, and better a reliable 22 than a Jam-O-Matic.
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