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Old March 19, 2008, 01:36 PM   #51
Brick
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Airsoft guns, the good ones, are excellent training and plinking tools.

The funny thing is how many folks here would like to be able to go about your daily duties with an AR15 or subgun on your shoulder and have nobody complain, yet wince at the thought of an airsoft replica.

Federal law requires a 6mm (1/4") for transport at the miniumum. A number of folks remove the paint, I do not. I consider it a violation of law and ethics.

It's one thing to conduct shooting practice, and it is another thing when someone is shooting back at you. The easiest and most cost-effective replicas today to safely mimic real gunfighting is airsoft.

You'd be suprised how fast "target acquisition", "shot placement", "tactical manuevering", etc magazine buzzwords goes right out the window when someone is popping off rounds at you...and all you see is a head, an arm, and a replica...
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Old March 19, 2008, 01:53 PM   #52
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I have far more faith in mi guns than in 911.
Faith has nothing to do with it, its the difference between netboard ramboism and mature, responsible gun ownership.

I would go so far as to say that your first obligation as a mature responsible gun owner is to call 911 (tactical circumstances permitting) before "engaging"

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Old March 19, 2008, 02:20 PM   #53
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When I was a kid, the _best_ cap guns were the ones that looked real, and which had some heft to 'em... And the best plastic guns were the ones that looked kinda real...

And we shot darn near anything with 'em... Usually while yelling at it.

We grew older. Got BB guns. Learned that you can't shoot just anything with 'em. And that yelling doesn't have the same effect.

Then we got real guns... And behaved with them.

I think it's more around the movies, media and games than anything else... We'd play good guys and bad guys, and the bad guys HAD to lose. Today? The bad guys win...
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Old March 19, 2008, 02:41 PM   #54
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My wife came in the house one day screaming get your gun there are kids in the street with guns.

I first looked outside. Yup kids with guns next thing I know they are shooting eachother. I said they are airsoft. Wife went out and took them away. The parents came over and started yelling at us for stealing their kids toy gun. I said "look your luckyyour kid did not get shot or the police called" Which the police sometimes shoot first.
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Old March 19, 2008, 05:21 PM   #55
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Actually, I DO live in the sticks...

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not trying to be rude to the people who think that this situation could never really happen but you must live in the sticks
My wife and I had just moved into our current home 10 years ago. Our town has only 385 year-round residents, but we probably get up to three times that number in the summer. We are 20 miles from next closest town to have a police or sheriff's department. Moose sometimes wander up our driveway, and we are well out of sight of any neighbors.

When I asked the chief of the volunteer fire department who did the law enforcement for the town, wondering if the area was covered by the troopers or the sheriff, he looked at me strangely and said "Law enforcement? Don't you have a gun?" (I don't tell strangers about my gun collection, so I was circumspect in my response). Most emergency aid can be 30 minutes away under good conditions, and double that in winter.

It was a very cold and snowy December, and the boxes we'd used to move weren't even unpacked yet. I was alone one dark evening (in Down east Maine in mid-December, that's anytime past 3:30 pm) trying to get walls painted before the furniture was moved in, when four cars pulled into my driveway, and several people (maybe a dozen) exited the cars rapidly began running toward the house through a foot of snow.

I had my 1911 in a kitchen drawer, and opened the drawer to take the gun in to my hand. The attacking mob turned out to be enthusiastic, early-season Christmas carolers.

The gun went back in the drawer with no one the wiser, and I went to the door with a smile rather than a frown.

Perceptions of events do vary. Trust, yet verify.
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Old March 19, 2008, 06:55 PM   #56
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most of the time people paying visits around here are burgalars, looting for meth cash.
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Old March 19, 2008, 09:56 PM   #57
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there is a time and place for everything, playing with an airsoft in public is not a good idea. if that was me, and if he had the airsoft on someone and it looks like he was about to shoot.... bad idea.. very bad.
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Old March 20, 2008, 09:25 PM   #58
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I guess I just grew up a different time and place but as kids we only had real looking toy guns. Dont recall them making unreal looking ones, not sure anyone would buy em. Heck we use to buy near full size M16 toy rifles, tie shoelaces(slings) to them, spray paint them black, then we would use electrical tape to attach small black flashlights to the carry handles. This was in the early 80's keep in mind. We would play SWAT at night with flightlights a'shining. We would be in everyone frontyards, sideyards, everywhere. Sure beat playing Rainbow 6 on some game consule. My kids play with their airsofts out front and run around every now and then. Fortunately my neighbors are observent enough to realize they are kids, laughing and smiling and yelling " I got you!, I got you first!", the tiny plastic bb's are visible as they fly thru air and most noticibly no gun shots. So far no complaints, no police, no police responding to calls that is, as i have 4 LEO who live on my block. I dont know how many here have actually witnessed real shootings and kids playing with toyguns/airsoft, but there is a difference and its immediately noticeable. My first reaction would probably be to grab my m4 airsoft ,slide out the side door, flank around and unload till i ran dry.
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Old March 20, 2008, 10:27 PM   #59
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The only real problem here is that you pointed a loaded, real weapon at him BEFORE you knew it was a threat. That is a violation of not pointing at something you do not wish to shoot. Normally it might be reasonable except that you stated you suspected an airsoft from the start. Perhaps you should wait until he comes to your house, or else invest in some binoculars. Using your AR with a round chambered as your spy glass wasn't real switft.

Quote:
well, it isnt a rule carved in stone... a guy in black with what looks like an AR can be a threat... sure you can point at him. but if you point at guy in pink holding flowers... that a no no
That's why I said the part about "normally it might be reasonable" and "you suspected an airsoft from the start."

Last edited by ssilicon; March 21, 2008 at 11:35 AM.
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Old March 20, 2008, 10:57 PM   #60
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The only real problem here is that you pointed a loaded, real weapon at him BEFORE you knew it was a threat. That is a violation of not pointing at something you do not wish to shoot. Normally it might be reasonable except that you stated you suspected an airsoft from the start. Perhaps you should wait until he comes to your house, or else invest in some binoculars. Using your AR with a round chambered as your spy glass wasn't real switft.
well, it isnt a rule carved in stone... a guy in black with what looks like an AR can be a threat... sure you can point at him. but if you point at guy in pink holding flowers... that a no no
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Old March 21, 2008, 02:38 AM   #61
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I worked at a gas station the hoot owl shift; I had a lot of officers come in for coffee. I was talking to a captain and he told me when he was on patrol they received a call of two suspects "car shopping". When he got into the area 12:00 a.m. or so he saw two "dark" individuals breaking into a vehicle. They booked; He exited his patrol car and began chasing on foot. One of them stopped and pulled out a hand gun and pointed it right at him. He drew his gun and ordered him to drop the weapon. (I would have probably open fired at this point). But the kid put down the gun and was soon in custody. I don’t remember if they caught the other one... But it turned out to be a BB gun and all the captain could say was he couldn’t believe how someone could be so stupid he could have blew that kids sh_t everywhere! But what do you do?
All over whatever money you had in your cars middle council, or maybe a stereo?????
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Old March 21, 2008, 03:02 PM   #62
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Blank guns are even worse, the only orange on most of them is inside the barrel. So unless the gun is pointed right at you, you might not even notice it. About 4 years ago I walked on my front porch to kinda clean my blank 1911 Replica, A little bit later a cop car pulled up, my dad just told them it was a blank gun and they left.

So what would you do if you saw someone walking around firing a gun but it just turns out to be a blank gun? Tricky situation.
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Old March 21, 2008, 04:46 PM   #63
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Guy in black with AR

I haven't seen too many of those. The few I have seen were either SWAT or SEAL teams.

So.... I can't agree that a guy in black with an AR can automatically be considered a threat. Judgement is still required.
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Old March 21, 2008, 05:31 PM   #64
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About 4 years ago I walked on my front porch to kinda clean my blank 1911 Replica, A little bit later a cop car pulled up, my dad just told them it was a blank gun and they left.
So what if it would have been real? It was your own porch! Or are they outlawd where you live?
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Old March 21, 2008, 05:45 PM   #65
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Well I was young, around 14 maybe.. But its not like I was running around the neighborhood pulling the trigger. lol
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Old March 21, 2008, 06:27 PM   #66
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I would hazard a guess that a large portion of armed robberies involving firearms where I am are perpetrated by people with Airsoft guns.

I mean it is a pretty easy way of getting cash, just walking into a place with an airsoft gun and demanding cash. Most people will take you very seriously.

In the UK the cops shoot a lot of innocent people because they have items that may look like a firearm. Over here it is more likely the guy with the airsoft gun will get shot because he doesn't put down the gun in an attempt to escape.

That actually happened a few years ago in a bank heist. Three men all with airsoft guns attempted to hold up a bank and armed cops stormed the building. Two of the guys surrendered their airsoft weapons while another one used his to try bargain for a way out. He was shot dead.
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Old March 21, 2008, 06:35 PM   #67
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Kid got killed in central Florida last year

I don't remember whether it was airsoft, but he had a Beretta 92 replica at his middle school. Threatened students and teachers with it, then barricaded himself in a restroom across the hall from a classroom.

Unfortunately, everybody thought it was a real weapon.

SWAT team responded. The kid (14yo 8th grader, I think) was killed by a single shot.

Of course, all the usual letter writers complained that the cops shouldn't have shot the kid, since the gun wasn't real. But you have to wonder what they'd have written if SWAT hadn't responded, the gun had been real, and the kid had started firing into the classroom across the hall.

OTOH, I had a friend who, as a deputy in southern California, ended a real school shooting by tackling the kid (shooter) in the rest room. He didn't want to shoot a kid, and it turned out well. No deaths. But my friend took a major risk.

I had another friend, a marine who was working as a reserve cop in Riverside, who didn't think the gun a kid was pointing at him was real, until it went "bang." Luckily, the vest stopped the bullet, but my friend still took some liver bruising. The kid was 13, but was a junior member of a gang, and my friend and his team were arresting some of the gang members when this happened.

Cool as they may look, realistic looking toy or airsoft guns are a fatal accident waiting to happen.
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Old March 21, 2008, 10:31 PM   #68
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In this day of kids with REAL guns committing REAL crimes, youngsters with toy weapons playing shoot-em-up is a recipe for disaster. It's just a matter of time. Should it be that way? No. But it's like the motorist who just got creamed in the intersection that had the right-of-way. He was right... dead right. It is better to be safe than sorry.
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Old March 22, 2008, 12:10 AM   #69
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But it's like the motorist who just got creamed in the intersection that had the right-of-way. He was right... dead right. It is better to be safe than sorry.
He was right, dead right as he sped along.....but he's just as dead as if he'd been dead wrong.
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Old March 23, 2008, 11:32 AM   #70
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Wild, I dont know how well 911 is up in your neck of the woods, but around most parts of the continential US, 911 is not a reliable source of help. There are numerous incidents in wich people call 911 and get put on hold for obscene amounts of time while they or people they know are raped and killed.

Its the type of thinking your advocating that keeps people from acting to save others, they just dont get involved. People need to be responcible for their protection and be good decent people and help others when they see some imminent threat. That kid was a threat, he was carrying a realistic looking gun.

Its this horrible POS attitude of dont get involved, dont grab your gun and defend someone, dont do the right thing that is screwing the American people of the very morals that defined us as apeople for over 2 centuries.

Wildalaska, fact is, 911 is not reliable. Period. Its gotten to the point, thanks to understaffing and underfunding that people need to take care of themselves and to help those around them. Cuase they cant expect the police to do it for them. Besides, the gov't has already said they have no real duty to protect individuals, only society as a whole.
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Old March 23, 2008, 11:41 AM   #71
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Just to add to the post, I really dont know how i would have reacted since i dont have a long gun. If it had happend around here, i would have drew my pistol, and had it down at my side while i figure out *** was goin on. Now if i had a AR with some form of magnifying glass, i would have considered using the optic to get a better view of the kid. Weather or not i would load it would depend on the situation, or if it was already loaded and chambered with the safety on when i put it in the closet.

Lets look at this from another angle, if those guns had been real, we would be hailing him as a hero for shooting down 2 urban shooters. Had they been real, he would not had time to call 911 and be put on hold and hope someone answeres intime to save the neighbors and himself. He would have been the only person who could have acted. He would have been a hero.

All things considered, he did ok, he did what every American should do when faced with a potential threat of him self and his neighbors. Good people help others, and saving someones life is one of the greatest acts of love and kindenss one can have.
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Old March 23, 2008, 01:05 PM   #72
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There are numerous incidents in wich people call 911 and get put on hold for obscene amounts of time while they or people they know are raped and killed.
There ar numerous instances of lightning killing folks but we dont wear lightning rods.

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Its the type of thinking your advocating that keeps people from acting to save others, they just dont get involved.
Total misinterpretation of what I and others have posted.

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People need to be responcible for their protection and be good decent people and help others when they see some imminent threat.
Is that a rule of strategy or tactics. And isnt the issue here "threat"?

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hat kid was a threat, he was carrying a realistic looking gun.
OK...lets make this clear...in your view, anyone carrying a gun is a threat? I hope you don't support open carry

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Wildalaska, fact is, 911 is not reliable. Period.
I think you are missing the point in this entire thread.

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Old March 23, 2008, 01:06 PM   #73
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All things considered, he did ok, he did what every American should do when faced with a potential threat of him self and his neighbors.
Id hate to have you living near me, especially when I cant find my AR case on range day

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Old March 23, 2008, 06:29 PM   #74
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Bad call pointing a gun at him! call 911 and get the family to cover. You did nothing to protect your family
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Old March 23, 2008, 07:37 PM   #75
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Here is my take on it a threat presented itself, said person armed himself with a loaded weapon(good on you) and from there reassessed situation found that it was no threat( family is safe and protected) there was no need for 911 but if threat was real I believe 911 would have been dispatched and the family would have been moved to a safer location.

If someone enters your yard or that of a neighbor and they are armed then personally you should get a weapon and go to condition one until you have identified them as friend or foe.

My take is if **** really hits the fan then call 911 and put up resistance to bad guy(s).

Well done sir on not shooting the perp with the airsoft.
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