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Old February 20, 2008, 01:53 AM   #1
croc4
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Large pistol primers...why?

I have thought about getting a .45 or even 10mil, but one of the reasons for not taking the plunge is needing to stock a whole other set of primers. And I can't help but wonder why couldn't magnum primers be used? and toss the need for large pistol primers?, or is it just a legacy thing?

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Old February 20, 2008, 02:05 AM   #2
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I don't think it will hurt to use them and will give good ignition. In fact Winchester says their Large pistol primers are for standard and magnum loads.
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Old February 20, 2008, 02:16 AM   #3
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In 10mm, for instance with power pistol magnum primers are recommended for more consistant ignition and lower SD.
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Old February 20, 2008, 02:24 AM   #4
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I would not use a mag primer when a standard one is called for but that is just me . If you want to use one primer for both standard and mag loads a winchester large primer may be a good choice. I use both mag and standard large primers and it has not proved to be a headache just look at the package when you prime.
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Old February 20, 2008, 02:32 AM   #5
croc4
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come on!

maybe I wasn't clear enough.........

There is a physical difference between small pistol and large pistol primers, my question is why couldn't a small pistol magnum primer be used instead of a large pistol primer (aside from the physical size)?
If you had a .45 acp case that took a small pistol primer (size wise) would using a magnum primer work just as well as a large pistol primer?

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Old February 20, 2008, 02:57 AM   #6
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So you're letting stocking a primer size stop you from buying a .45?
Dude.
I have CCI small pistol, CCI small pistol magnum, Winchester small pistol, CCI large pistol, CCI large pistol magnum, winchester large pistol, CCI small rifle, CCI small rifle magnum, etc..........
The small and large pistol primers are different in physical size. Small primers are, umm, smaller. Around.
Rifle and pistol primers are different physically, as well.
Rifle primers are deeper. not much, but they are slightly deeper.
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Old February 20, 2008, 02:57 AM   #7
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Well croc4 a magnum small pistol primer might ignite a .45 acp as well as a standard large pistol primer however its getting pretty hypothetical since the 'size' of the primer hole is too large to hold a small pistol primer.

Unless you get some special .45 acp cases made up with small pistol size primer pockets we will never know.
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Old February 20, 2008, 03:20 AM   #8
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Most NT cases are small pistol in .45, should you check around and find them.
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Old February 20, 2008, 03:32 AM   #9
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Quote:
Most NT cases are small pistol in .45
I forgot about those Non-Toxic cases, now your set croc4.
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Old February 20, 2008, 03:37 AM   #10
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Unless you're seriously made of money, or have some awesome connections, that ammo is exceedingly expensive. Therefore, the brass will be tough to locate. On the upside, people who must use NT ammo most likely don't reload it.
Maybe someone here has a stash of it they sorted out of their brass, as it will jam up progressive presses. A commercial reloader?
Maybe you would have luck if you posted a WTB: WIN or FED NT .45 brass in the reloading FS/FT section. Who knows.
IIRC the FED cases at very least are crimped in and must be swaged before use.
Not sure about the SC WIN NT cases.
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Old February 20, 2008, 04:07 AM   #11
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Quote:
If you had a .45 acp case that took a small pistol primer (size wise) would using a magnum primer work just as well as a large pistol primer?
And IF a frog had wings, he wouldn't whomp his butt everytime he jumped.

Some things are just the way they are. If you don't like it or can't accept it, best to move on down the road 'cause playing the what-if hypothetics game is just a waste of gray matter.

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Old February 20, 2008, 08:20 AM   #12
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I think this is more a philosophical question than a serious one.

I would imagine that if you go back a hundred-plus years when centerfire cartridges were going in to production, there were probably legitimate concerns about sending a proper flame in a cartridge with a much larger physical diameter than the smaller cartridges of the day.

Today? Probably not a big factor. But it has been that way for a long, long, LONG time and change doesn't come easy.

We still call them ".38 specials" but nobody is too upset that it's not .38 of an inch diameter. It's called this because the cartridge evolved from a heeled bullet round where the bullet diameter was larger than the case and sat on the outside of it. Not the other way around like we do it today.

To sum it up--they probably could very well use modern primers to ignite all cartridges across the board. In fact, if every cartridge used a small primer size, everything on the market could probably be properly ignited by a small rifle magnum primer. The problem with the idea is that a hundred years of load data built around smokeless powder and the cartridges for it would have to be scrapped and re-worked from scratch so nobody was out using faulty data meant for old primers. Also, all brass with large size primer pockets in existence would have to be relegated to the scrap pile and new brass produced. All the stocks of non-mag and large size primers would have to be tossed out. All the tooling set up to build large primers would be useless.

That would make no logical sense whatsoever.

It would also make no logical sense to avoid buying a slick new .45 auto because you'd then have to stock a different size of primers which you can pick up (even at a lousy price) for $30/1000.
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Old February 20, 2008, 10:47 AM   #13
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Thanks

Thanks Seven, thats what I thought, and if I didn't have an excuse, even a lame one, I would have an even smaller bank account than I do now ;-/

And if hypotheticals were not thought about, modern society would not exist, at some point in history every invention was hypothetical
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Old February 20, 2008, 10:57 AM   #14
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Ahhh-- if you are looking for legitimate reasons to buy or not buy your next handgun, I'm sure you could find better ones in short order. Do you have extra cash not earmarked for something else? Do you fear the upcoming presidential regime change could harm your chances of buying what you'd like in the near future? Do you simply love the idea of adding a new horse to the stable? All are terrific reasons to go find yourself a fine .45 auto.

Now then-- do you have outstanding loans or credit card bills nailing you with interest on a daily basis? Do you drive a big truck that sucks fuel and $4 a gallon gas scares you? Do you have kids that'll be heading to college in a dozen or less years? Those might be fine reasons to pass on a new .45 right at the moment.

But to a clear thinker--having to add a new size of primer to the component stock of the load bench just really isn't part of the equation. (that's still giving me a smirk over here!) You know, you'll need different brass-- different bullets, too, and maybe if you keep trying new recipes, different powder as well? Makes the primer thing seem even sillier!

One other thing that seems relevant to me. Anyone who intends to purchase their next handgun... but doesn't yet have a nice, thick, 500+ pound safe in their house that's bigger then their fridge needs to take a long hard look at priorities. I waited 11 years after I began collecting and shooting to get my safe. Waited until I got a house. It's still one of the favorite parts of my collection -- honestly.
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