The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: The Revolver Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old May 18, 2015, 06:27 AM   #1
Targa
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 20, 2014
Posts: 149
Single action help

Hi all, I have had the itch for a single action revolver longer than I can remember and would like it in .44 mag. I am looking at the Uberti 6", 1873 Cattleman and a 5.5" Ruger Super Blackhawk. My knowledge of these firearms is limited to the couple of times I have shot a single action so feel free to dumb it up for me, I will not be offended (and who cares if I would be right?). What would you go with? Is there any stand out issues with either one? I am leaning towards the Ruger simply from a reputation standpoint but I really like the looks of the 6" Uberti. Thanks Darrin
Targa is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 07:01 AM   #2
UncleEd
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 13, 2013
Location: N. Georgia
Posts: 429
I'm surprised Uberti even makes a .44 Mag, especially for the Cattleman SAA design. I wonder just how beefed up it is.

Now, for the king, the Ruger Super Blackhawk, it's got a 60-year track record of excellence and in handling the hottest .44 Mag loads. And although it's classic configuration is the 7.5 inch barrel, the SBH is also offered in 5.5 and 4 7/8 inch barrels.

Others may jump in and suggest the Freedom Arms but that wasn't in the original question.
UncleEd is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 07:39 AM   #3
Targa
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 20, 2014
Posts: 149
Ok thanks for the info, thats exactly what im looking for. I am certainly open to other suggestions such as Freedom Arms, like I said I have limited knowledge of single actions at best.
Targa is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 08:19 AM   #4
KEYBEAR
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 11, 2012
Location: Indiana
Posts: 198
If you are buying a 44 Mag to shoot a Super Blackhawk is it . If just to say I have one anything will do .
KEYBEAR is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 08:47 AM   #5
Targa
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 20, 2014
Posts: 149
I definitley want it as a shooter.
Targa is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 09:11 AM   #6
Bultaco
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 25, 2013
Location: Western Co.
Posts: 116
.44 mag lends itself to adjustable sights due to the variety of bullet weights and velocities available. I have found the Bisley grip frame on the Ruger SA to work the best in handling recoil. Best of luck with your purchase.
Bultaco is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 10:08 AM   #7
g.willikers
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 28, 2008
Posts: 6,171
During my formative years, from watching way too many Western movies and tv shows, all my handguns were SA revolvers.
Ruger Blackhawk in 357/38, Ruger Super Blackhawk in 44M/44spl, Hawes/ JP Sauer in 44M, and Pietta 1858 in .44.
The Rugers were sturdy and mostly trouble free, except for the center pins always trying to follow the bullets downrange.
Easily cured, though.
But the best shooter and best handling of them was easily the Hawes.
I had two in 44Mag.
Mostly because they followed the design of the original Colts.
So, maybe in today's market, you might want to take a look at those that still do.
__________________
Lock the doors, they're coming in the windows.
g.willikers is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 10:17 AM   #8
Colt46
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 25, 2002
Location: Campbell Ca
Posts: 1,062
Uberti does make a .44 Mag

Think they call it the Callahan(?) Never seen one.

The SBH is pretty much the definitive Single Action .44 mag.
Colt46 is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 10:27 AM   #9
Bob Wright
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 10, 2012
Location: Memphis, Tennessee
Posts: 2,090
I'd say go with the Super Blackhawk:



I've had the brass-butted gun for over forty years, and its odometer (my log book) reads over 17,000 rounds fired. Its been fed everything from fire-snortin' loads to mild mannered stuff.

As a matter of interest, I set up some gun with Bisley grips to investigate recoil and came back to the Dragoon style of the Super Blackhawk where heavy recoiling stuff is used. Tamed recoil better, for me, anyway.

Bob Wright


Augh! I just realized used the wrong photo. The one above are three screw Rugers. This is one I meant to use:

__________________
Time spent at the reloading bench is an investment in contentment.
Bob Wright is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 10:27 AM   #10
HighValleyRanch
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 15, 2005
Posts: 1,921
I have a JP Sauer Hawes in .357 and that is built like a tank, shoots like a dream. Didn't know they came in .44!

My brother had the Uberti Cattlemen .44 mag.
Very nice looking and looked more like a Colt SSA than the blackhawks.
Can't say much about how durable, but did shoot a few .44 mag out of it and it felt great.
__________________
From the sweet grass to the slaughter house; From birth until death; We travel between these two eternities........from 'Broken Trail"
HighValleyRanch is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 10:54 AM   #11
GeauxTide
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 20, 2009
Location: Helena, AL
Posts: 3,183
Bob Wright is right on target

With comments on the Bisley grip handling heavy loads. I can shoot top 44 Mag loads very comfortably with the SBH. My Bisley 41 Mag is quite comfortable, but my 44 Special and 45 Colt Bisley have been relegated to mild loads. I do have one 45 Colt load with a 275 LFN under 10gr of Unique for 1057 that recoils mild but hits with authority. That load hit a hog in the face from my son's Blackhawk at 20 yards and put a beer can sized hole next to his bhole.
GeauxTide is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 02:50 PM   #12
John D
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 24, 2000
Location: California
Posts: 272
Super Blackhawk is virtually indestructible. If I ever find some grips that feel comfortable, I might be able to shoot it well....
John D is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 03:22 PM   #13
44 AMP
Staff
 
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 12,898
To keep things simple (as if), basic question, Five shots? or Six?

The Colt SAA action (and copies) are safe to carry with 5 rounds in the cylinder, with the hammer down on the empty chamber. They are not safe to carry with the hammer down on a live round.

In 1973, Ruger introduced the "New Model" lockwork, using a transfer bar, and new model Rugers are safe to carry with 6 in the cylinder.

The manual of arms for both are DIFFERENT.

The Colt system (and copies, including unconverted pre-73 Rugers) have a half cock position on the hammer that frees the cylinder to turn for loading and unloading. The proper method of loading one for carry is to load a chamber, skip the next one, then load the next four. Then bring the hammer back to full cock and ease it down on the empty chamber.

New model Rugers do not have a half cock position. Opening the loading gate (alone) frees the cylinder to rotate. Load all six, close the gate, and carry.

Personally, I'm not crazy about the Super Blackhawk, but that's a personal matter. 30+ years of shooting the (new model) Blackhawk just leaves me with a couple gripes about the Super. I don't care for the Dragoon triggerguard. I don't like the grooved trigger, and the hammer spur is in the wrong place, compared to where I feel it ought to be.

All personal issues, and can be changed, if desired, I've just never bothered, since I don't shoot my Super very much. I do shoot the Blackhawk in .45 Colt, and Vaqueros in .45 Colt, and like them very much.

There are purists who feel that if is single action revolver doesn't look and work like a Colt, its not worth having. I'm not one of them, and don't have any Colt Single action revolvers, or clones.

I do like new model Rugers, and have several, .22, .357, .44Mag (SuperB) .45 Colt (two Blackhawks and 4 Vaqueros, and a New Vaquero)

Ruger also uses coil springs, the original Colt design does not.

Hope this helps
__________________
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.
44 AMP is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 03:32 PM   #14
gwpercle
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2012
Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana
Posts: 161
Shooter....Get the Ruger and adjustable sights. Nothing more frustrating than a revolver that doesn't hit where the sights point. Also handy when you want to shoot 44 specials, can sight it in for those.
Gary
gwpercle is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 04:03 PM   #15
Targa
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 20, 2014
Posts: 149
Thanks everyone, great information.
Targa is offline  
Old May 18, 2015, 04:28 PM   #16
Bob Wright
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 10, 2012
Location: Memphis, Tennessee
Posts: 2,090
To elaborate on 44AMP's statement above:

Quote:
Personally, I'm not crazy about the Super Blackhawk, but. that's a personal matter. 30+ years of shooting the (new model) Blackhawk just leaves me with a couple gripes about the Super. I don't care for the Dragoon triggerguard. I don't like the grooved trigger, and the hammer spur is in the wrong place, compared to where I feel it ought to be.
As to the trigger guard, it matters not to me either round or square, I do prefer the longer grip. Most of my SBHs have smooth triggers, and from my photos elsewhere, the hammer spurs are those of Blackhawks, which I prefer.

As to Three Screw vs. New Model, once loaded, the handling of the gun is the same. I only load five in either one.

Both Three Screw and New Model guns can be made to have very good actions and excellent trigger pulls. The only problem I have had has been with converted Three Screw models which, to me, never acheive that smooth action.

Bob Wright
__________________
Time spent at the reloading bench is an investment in contentment.
Bob Wright is offline  
Old May 19, 2015, 01:27 PM   #17
BigJimP
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 23, 2005
Posts: 11,643
It comes down to what model ...and grip style, size and length fits your hands the best..

For me, the length and width of the grip in the Freedom Arms large frame, model 83, fits that bill better than the other suggestions. So I would opt, and have, for the 5 shot large frame Freedom Arms.

Here's mine I ordered a few yrs ago.... 4 3/4" octagonal barrel, in .357 Mag...and I think this yr, as my birthday rolls around again in Jan, I will order another one, identical, in .44 Mag...

http://thefiringline.com/forums/atta...0&d=1339790943
BigJimP is offline  
Old May 19, 2015, 05:26 PM   #18
357 Python
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 7, 2007
Location: Charlottesville, VA
Posts: 724
Where a 44 Magnum is concerned I would go with the highest quality revolver I could afford. Regardless of price the Ruger is extremely difficult to beat quality wise. I have only one 44 Magnum and it is a Ruger Vaquero 5 1/2" barrel Bright Stainless Steel. Like the Super Blackhawk it is built like a tank. Would I ever consider getting rid of it? Absolutely not.
357 Python is offline  
Old May 19, 2015, 06:32 PM   #19
Targa
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 20, 2014
Posts: 149
Beautiful gun Big Jim. I want to keep the price in the $600 range so the Freedom Arms seem to be a bit rich for my blood but they are beautiful, no doubt. 357 Python, you mention your .44 in a Vaquero. I like the looks of the Vaquero a bit over the Super Blackhawk but it looks like I can only find them in .357 and .45 lc. am I missing something? Did they discontinue the Vaquero in .44? Thanks again all.
Targa is offline  
Old May 19, 2015, 07:39 PM   #20
44 AMP
Staff
 
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 12,898
Targa, you are the victim of the Ruger name idiocy.

Ruger used to produce a gun they called the "Vaquero". Same frame size as the New Model Blackhawk/Super Blackhawk. But it had fixed sights. Blued & stainless. (I had a 7.5" stainless .44Mag) Ruger dropped this model several years ago.

They replaced it with, and currently produce a gun named "New Vaquero". It is a smaller framed gun, approximately the size of the Colt SAA. It is available in .357 Mag and .45 Colt.

They are NOT the same guns, despite the very close names.

The trouble is someone says "Vaquero" meaning the original Vaquero, and someone else says Vaquero meaning the NEW Vaquero, and you kind of have to have the context to tell which is which in conversation.

IF RUGER had picked ANY OTHER NAME, it wouldn't be an issue.



The gun on the top is a NEW VAQUERO, 5.5" barrel .45 Colt.
The gun on the bottom is a VAQUERO, 4 5/8" barrel .45 Colt.

Note how both guns are almost exactly the same size overall, despite one having a barrel 7/8" shorter than the other. A close look will show the size difference in the frames, as well.
__________________
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.
44 AMP is offline  
Old May 19, 2015, 08:53 PM   #21
Targa
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 20, 2014
Posts: 149
Thanks 44 AMP for clearing that up. And thanks everyone for bearing with me on this single action thread. The last time I was this unfamiliar with something that had my attention was back in grade school.....if I could just remember her name...
Targa is offline  
Old May 19, 2015, 09:29 PM   #22
Lurch37
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 6, 2006
Location: Middle of Nebraska
Posts: 735
[IMG][/IMG]

I'm not much of a revolver guy honestly but I have a couple. I just picked this Ruger up a couple weeks ago, and it does shoot rather nice. It's a .44Mag with a, I think, a 7.5 inch barrel. It's what they call a Vaquero Bisley or the other way around, and sports the larger grips and dropped down hammer.
__________________
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
Lurch37 is offline  
Old May 19, 2015, 10:08 PM   #23
hartcreek
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 22, 2014
Location: Washington
Posts: 932
The Uberti Cattleman is plenty solid. Uberti got their experience with .44 magnum when they were producing barrels for Ivar Johnson for the original cattleman line which has a foot built in to the hammer so that they can be loaded with six cartridges. The Uberti cattlemen that I have seen should only be loaded with five. Mine which is an original with an eighteen inch barrel and attachable rifle stock can be carried with six and shoot 240 grain bullets with 22.7 grains of 296 all day long.
hartcreek is offline  
Old May 19, 2015, 10:21 PM   #24
357 Python
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 7, 2007
Location: Charlottesville, VA
Posts: 724
Yes the Vaquero was discontinued. What is out there now is the New Vaquero. The New Vaquero is closer to the size of the Colt SAA. According to what I have heard Ruger did not feel the New Vaquero would safely handle the 44 Magnum so it was dropped from the New Vaquero line. The original model Vaquero can be found on the used market, if you are lucky. Yes it is about 10% larger than the Colt SAA but that helps it handle the 44 Magnum. I received mine in the early to mid 1990s.
357 Python is offline  
Old May 20, 2015, 10:10 AM   #25
44 AMP
Staff
 
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 12,898
Also take note that the Ruger NEW VAQUERO is not suitable for the "Ruger only" .45 Colt handloads.

The Vaquero, is.

"Ruger ONLY" .45 Colt loads were developed back when the only Ruger .45 Colt was the .44mag sized Blackhawk. and they made it into loading manuals in a separate section about a decade or so after that. Also note that .45 Colt is the only caliber to have "Ruger only" loads.

Anyone saying they are shooting "ruger only" loads in another caliber is mis-applying the term.

Also be aware that not everything that is named Ruger Blackhawk is suitable for those same "Ruger Only" loads. Ruger has made "Blackhawks" with two frame sizes, and only the .44mag size frame is good to take the extra heavy loads.

I love Ruger new model SA's and have about 10 or so, but Ruger's policy of using the same name (Blackhawk) or very similar names (Vaquero and New Vaquero) for guns of different sizes and strengths is probably the stupidest thing Ruger ever did.

Ok, that, and the rear sight windage screw...
__________________
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.
44 AMP is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:25 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2015 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.13965 seconds with 9 queries