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Old February 8, 2016, 07:55 AM   #1
P71pilot
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GP100 Massive problem

Hello all, I recently bought a brand new 6" blued ruger GP100 .357 Magnum. I really liked everything about the gun; I shot it pretty well, recoil was very manageable when shooting factory 158 Magnum loads, seemed made pretty well. But I discovered a huge giant problem in the design and sold it about 1 month after owning it. When letting inexperienced friends shoot it double action, one dummy caused the gun to jam up. The cylinder wouldn't open, button wouldn't depress, hammer couldn't be cocked, the gun was literally jammed up. I put a drop of hoppes elite gun oil down in front of the hammer and tried working the hammer and depressing the button for about 2 minutes and finally got the revolver to free up. The guy who raised me (ex-step-dad) has a gp100 match champion, and said he experienced the same exact problem when letting one of his friends shoot his gp100 DA. In the owners manual it states that when shooting the gun DA, after drawing the trigger rearward to fire, upon releasing the trigger, if you do not let the trigger reset 100% completely forward, it can damage the gun.

I bought that revolver as a hunting weapon and as a means of animal defense. Here in Ohio I have personally seen a total of 4 mountain lions (1 dead) , and where my (biological) father lives in eastern Indiana, he has also seen roadkill mt. lions and some of his friends around eastern Indiana have reported seeing black bears and wolves on trail cameras.

Now if you were being charged or attacked by a wild animal, you would most likely shoot double action for the speed of shots right? Under such a situation I cannot gauruntee I am going to let the trigger reset 100%, it might only be 98% and my revolver could then jam up, now I have a club and am probably dead. Honestly I wonder how many gp100 owners know about this problem, and If this problem also applies to ruger RedHawks, sp101s, lcrs, or other manufacturers of DA revolvers like S&W, Dan Wesson, colt, Taurus etc.

After that incident I no longer trusted that weapon with my life and quickly sold it for about a $150 loss and had fired about 150rds through it. To me the possibility of such a problem is unacceptable and I will never own another DA ruger revolver. It's a shame because I really wanted a Redhawk in the future. Not anymore

My wilderness defense handgun is now my trusty Springfield Loaded model 1911A1 which for me is the most accurate anyways and goes bang every time with good ammo. I have a box of Speer lawman 200gr flat point fmj I got from the gunshow for woods carry.

Has this ever happened to you? Can S&W's jam up like this too?
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Old February 8, 2016, 08:09 AM   #2
Salmoneye
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Quote:
In the owners manual it states that when shooting the gun DA, after drawing the trigger rearward to fire, upon releasing the trigger, if you do not let the trigger reset 100% completely forward, it can damage the gun.
No...The manual says nothing about damaging the gun...

Here is what the GP100 Manual says on Page #14:

"When firing in the double action
mode, be sure that the trigger is
released completely to its fully
forward position before pulling the
trigger for a subsequent shot. If
the trigger finger is allowed to
interfere with the full recovery of
the trigger (preventing it from
moving through about the last
one-eighth inch of its forward
movement), the trigger cannot be
pulled again for another discharge.
The trigger must be fully released
after each shot is fired. This
characteristic is found in all
modern double-action revolvers
and “double-action only” pistols."


https://ruger-docs.s3.amazonaws.com/_manuals/gp100.pdf
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Old February 8, 2016, 08:14 AM   #3
cecILL
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Hello. You know you will regret selling the Ruger, don't you?
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Old February 8, 2016, 08:21 AM   #4
UncleEd
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Short stroking the triggers can jam a revolver and this is true of Smiths as well as Rugers.

One reason not to lighten trigger springs (I did not say you did) too far aggravates the potential problem even more.

You must let the trigger snap forward on its own, letting up pressure after
firing. That doesn't mean taking the finger off the trigger all the way. Just
don't apply pressure during the reset.

Considering the billions of rounds fired DA through revolvers both in sport and combat without any hitches it's nearly a non-problem.

The GP 100 is as trouble free as any revolver can be.

Now, you want to talk about the potential for jams in automatics? Those are far, far, far, far greater than any revolver.
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Old February 8, 2016, 08:22 AM   #5
TimSr
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I have a GP100 house gun, and a Redhawk for hunting and bigfoot protection, but to be honest, when it comes to being attacked in Ohio by mountain lions, wolves, and bears, I'm content with my Single Six.
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Old February 8, 2016, 08:24 AM   #6
wpsdlrg
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Can't address the specific issue (with the Ruger), of which you speak. I had a couple of Ruger SP-101's for a while, but never experienced that kind of problem with them. Frankly, the whole thing sounds fishy to me, to be honest. Don't have them any more, so I cannot test for this.

Methinks there is more to the story.

I can say, though, that Smith & Wessons don't do this, certainly not the way you describe. If you "short-stroke" the trigger on those, then the gun simply doesn't cycle - until you release the trigger all the way. It simply becomes inactive. But, nothing "jams". You simply have to release the trigger, it resets, then everything is as normal.

The same is true for Taurus revolvers. I have one here - and it also does not exhibit that kind of problem.

As I said, I think there is more to the story. Your friend, when he jammed up your Ruger, must have done something else, such as manipulate the hammer manually, or mess with the cylinder release or something, while holding the trigger partially back.

You CAN cause some problems with many revolvers, if you partially release the trigger (after pulling it all the way back to release the hammer), but manually manipulate the hammer, instead of letting it fall or lowering it all the way. What that does is put the sear into the wrong position, vis a vis the hammer notches. THAT can cause damage to the hammer, if it is done repeatedly. Of course, the answer for that is - DON'T do that. But, that kind of thing is the action of a ham-handed know-nothing, who shouldn't be handling a revolver without proper instruction FIRST.

I don't really believe that Ruger engineered the GP-100 with some sort of major fault or "fatal flaw" built in, such as that. No, if the story is true, your ham-handed friend f-ed up your gun by ignorant handling....and damaged something internal.
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Old February 8, 2016, 08:40 AM   #7
UncleEd
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wpsdlrg,

I disagree with your statement regarding Smiths.

If you apply strong back pressure on any DA revolver before reset you
can jam it up. It depends just at what point and how much muscle
you're applying.

I've heard of Smiths jamming and did it once myself about 40 years ago.

Smith paid out to an LA LEO after experiencing a jam with his Model 15.

The LEO was wounded in a fight.

Smith tried to show in the hearing that he'd changed out springs but he
hadn't. He apparently had just really manhandled the trigger in his excitement.

Again, after billions and even billions more shots fired DA with revolvers,
it's nearly a non-problem.

I don't think the OP has any "fishy" things he didn't relate.

In regards to the OP's SA Loaded, just wait for his story of how it jammed one day and he had a double devil of a time getting it back to working order.
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Old February 8, 2016, 08:44 AM   #8
superspirit
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Quote:
Can't address the specific issue (with the Ruger), of which you speak. I had a couple of Ruger SP-101's for a while, but never experienced that kind of problem with them. Frankly, the whole thing sounds fishy to me, to be honest. Don't have them any more, so I cannot test for this.

Methinks there is more to the story.

I can say, though, that Smith & Wessons don't do this, certainly not the way you describe. If you "short-stroke" the trigger on those, then the gun simply doesn't cycle - until you release the trigger all the way. It simply becomes inactive. But, nothing "jams". You simply have to release the trigger, it resets, then everything is as normal.

The same is true for Taurus revolvers. I have one here - and it also does not exhibit that kind of problem.

As I said, I think there is more to the story. Your friend, when he jammed up your Ruger, must have done something else, such as manipulate the hammer manually, or mess with the cylinder release or something, while holding the trigger partially back.

You CAN cause some problems with many revolvers, if you partially release the trigger (after pulling it all the way back to release the hammer), but manually manipulate the hammer, instead of letting it fall or lowering it all the way. What that does is put the sear into the wrong position, vis a vis the hammer notches. THAT can cause damage to the hammer, if it is done repeatedly. Of course, the answer for that is - DON'T do that. But, that kind of thing is the action of a ham-handed know-nothing, who shouldn't be handling a revolver without proper instruction FIRST.

I don't really believe that Ruger engineered the GP-100 with some sort of major fault or "fatal flaw" built in, such as that. No, if the story is true, your ham-handed friend f-ed up your gun by ignorant handling....and damaged something internal.

^^^ these are my thoughts also^^^ I have a gp 100 a redhawk an sp 101 and many other Ruger revolvers and have never had a problem like that. Now Ruger does have it's problems and quality control has slipped as of late. but they do not build junk.
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Old February 8, 2016, 08:48 AM   #9
ScaryWoody
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I have a Ruger SP101 which I love. I was at the range and going through about 100 rounds of .38spl. Towards the end it locked up as well. What I found was that the forcing cone became fouled and with the heat in the barrel it swelled to jam the cylinder. I carefully cleaned and removed the fouling. It's back to 100%.
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Old February 8, 2016, 09:06 AM   #10
drobs
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This is like short stroking a pump shotgun.
Training = competence.

You need to train yourself to let the trigger reset / cylinder fully turn.
If you can't do that then maybe manually operated firearms aren't for you.
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Old February 8, 2016, 09:51 AM   #11
g.willikers
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Every double action revolver I've had would hang up with improper trigger use.
Not a complete lock up or jam, just a refusal to fire again until the trigger was fully released.
No big deal, just release the trigger all the way and they were back in action.
But it could get confusing when switching back and forth from revolver to auto loader, especially the striker fired ones with short reset.
Being completely familiar and confident in one's equipment is always paramount.
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Old February 8, 2016, 10:18 AM   #12
P71pilot
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All I know is that my friend fired about 3 shots through the revolver and handed it back to me (no more shots remaining), when I tried to open the cylinder to remove the shells and loadnit back up, the button would not engage properly, thus the cylinder could not be opened. I then realized something was wrong attempted to cock the hammer, could not draw the hammer back, I then tried to dry fire the pistol DA and the trigger would not function, firearm was entirely jammed up. After playing with it for a couple minutes I finally was able to pull the hammer back and cock it and this freed everything up, I emptied the shells and reloaded it and everything was back to normal. But it really scared me and it caused me to loose trust in that revolver. I quit shooting it double action entirely until I sold it. My gun buddy ex step dad has had the EXACT same thing happen to his gp100 match champion when letting an inexperienced friend shoot it. I just know that if I have an animal chewing on neck or body and I only have 1 hand available and my adrenaline is rushing like nothing else I cannot guarantee I will let that trigger reset 100%

You trust what you trust, I just can't trust something that has failed like that especially for the purpose I bought it for. And yes I know the odds of being attacked are very slim but I am a small man (5'6" 140lbs) and travel the woods alone sometimes. I will keep a large fighting knife and my 1911 just in case
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Old February 8, 2016, 10:30 AM   #13
Dan-O
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Improperly seated primer, backed out primer, unburnt powder jamming stuff up.....sound to me like the most likely culprit.
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Old February 8, 2016, 10:48 AM   #14
g.willikers
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Did anyone mention the possibility of the ejector rod cap unscrewing and hanging up on the barrel shroud, adding to or compounding the problem?
Just a thought.
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Old February 8, 2016, 10:56 AM   #15
P71pilot
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The instance that occurred to me was with federal 158gr JSP .357 Magnum ammo purchased from Walmart, I save all my brass cases, and nothing is wrong with the primers or brass on any of my cases (inspected all 137) firearm was freshly cleaned before this instance. Also this gun was manufactured in 2015 and what my manual stated is different from what one of the postees above me quoted. You guys can think whatever you want but I think there is a problem in the design and so I sold the gun.
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Old February 8, 2016, 11:00 AM   #16
reddog81
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Anything mechanical can experience a malfunction.

I've shot 5,000+ rounds out of my GP100 and have never experienced that.

If you think it's impossible to have a 1911 jam you haven't shot them enough.

It sounds like both you and your Dad had problems with inexperienced shooters jamming the guns. I've never experienced a jam in my Glock model 17. My girlfriend can get every other round to jam because she limp wrists it. Does that mean Glocks are unreliable?
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Old February 8, 2016, 11:16 AM   #17
Dan-O
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"Did anyone mention the possibility of the ejector rod cap unscrewing and hanging up on the barrel shroud, adding to or compounding the problem?
Just a thought."

GP100's don't have ejector rod caps.

Regardless of what the "problem" was, the OP didn't do himself any favors by getting rid of a gun that if there was a true mechanical problem, and not user error, Ruger would have fixed and made it right.
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Old February 8, 2016, 11:44 AM   #18
DPris
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P71,
YOU can think anything you want, but I've been shooting GPs since 1989, currently own five, have spent money customizing them, have carried them in the wilds for animal and people defense, will again, and have worked professionally with them.

I have every bit as much confidence in them as in any other brand of revolver, and more than any other brand of revolver, in the broad picture.

I carried one concealed after retiring from my PD, with full faith & confidence, till 9-11 happened & I reverted to an auto for capacity.

This does not speak as an absolute Ruger fanboy, the company has its problems & I own & use & respect other makers' products, too.

The GP has no inherent "design flaw" that causes what you experienced.
Condemning the entire company & model line because of what could have been due to any number of other factors is fatuous.

The gun could have been faulty from the factory, metal chips are not unknown in them. Not ideal & shouldn't happen, but it occasionally does & can be rectified by breaking the gun down & thoroughly cleaning it.

There could have been a defective part.

Did you do ANY analysis before selling it?
Break it down & thoroughly clean INSIDE?
Have a gunsmith look at it?
Contact/return to Ruger?

I don't know what the two people who caused those GPs to jam were doing, but it could easily have been either operator error or two coincidentally problematic guns, or both.

Two negative experiences may be overwhelming to you, but 27 years of positives isolates them for me, and doesn't condemn the entire line.
Especially without any analysis to determine the problem.

Short-stroking any DA revolver can cause problems in cycling.
Short-stroking a Ruger GP should not bind up the locking mechanism.

And finally, from the angle of somebody who carries defensive artillery on ANY trip in the wilds, I would feel infinitely more comfortable toting a GP than a Kimber.

Boycotting EVERY Ruger revolver as a result of firing 150 rounds through a gun & encountering a problem, without making any attempts to find the cause?

You buy a new car, find a couple drops of oil under it in the driveway the first week, make no attempt to determine cause or get it fixed under warrantee, sell it off at a loss, and vow never to buy a car from that company again?
Your money.

Denis
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Old February 8, 2016, 12:31 PM   #19
K_Mac
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I completely agree with Denis. I have experienced cycling issues a couple of times with my GP100 due to short-stroking the trigger. This is not the fault of the revolver. The times it has happened have all been during dry fire drills. This is the reason for doing dry fire drills and practicing with a weapon. I have full confidence that if I ever need it in a life threatening situation it will work exactly as designed. If I didn't, I would send it back to Ruger and they would make it right. I don't know of any handgun I would have more confidence in.
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Old February 8, 2016, 12:36 PM   #20
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I just wrapped up a career that has had me carrying a 6" GP-100 since 2003. Zero issues. Of course one CAN jam a revolver by short resetting, but with any kind of training at all it will never happen.

That said, if your .45 is kept clean and is reliable, it will probably do just as good a job on that class of animal.
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Old February 8, 2016, 01:11 PM   #21
John D
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A "massive" problem would suppose that this occurs regularly. As this revolver has been sold for over 25+ years, any design malfunction would have become apparent over this time period. I've had my GP100 since they first came out and have had zero problems....it's a tank.

Sorry your buddy messed up your revolver and caused you to get rid of a really solid gun. I trust this gun and my model 66 to go "bang" every time!
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Old February 8, 2016, 01:19 PM   #22
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I'm guessing with the 'jammed' trigger he tried to forcibly open the cylinder which cause it to bind up.
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Old February 8, 2016, 01:29 PM   #23
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Quote:
I just can't trust something that has failed like that especially for the purpose I bought it for.
Well it was most likely you're shooting buddy that failed, did you get rid of him.
Quote:
Also this gun was manufactured in 2015 and what my manual stated is different from what one of the postees above me quoted.
My 2015 GP manual states exactly what's quoted.
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Old February 8, 2016, 01:46 PM   #24
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Operate the gun incorrectly and then blame it for YOUR failure? How typical.
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Old February 8, 2016, 02:03 PM   #25
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I had a 2” Taurus in .357 mag, one time while I was shooting it the bullets would jumping crimp and try the gun up. These where factory rounds not reloads. Did you check the see if the crimps held?
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