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Old July 6, 2007, 06:57 PM   #1
dustinlowery
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Stag arms or bushmaster?

which i dont know both have same price 16 inch chrome lined upper i already own a bushmaster anyfeedback on the stagarms im looking for reliability in lots of rounds fired
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Old July 7, 2007, 11:51 AM   #2
Lane
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i own a bushy and like it but iv tried stag and found their accurate but never put a bunch of rounds through i also heard lots of police forces are using them
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Old July 7, 2007, 12:25 PM   #3
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Stag is a great rifle,but they aren't as well known .also some folks are put off by the Stag head logo on the lower. Stag is CMT and if those fools would use 5140 steel they would be IMHO as good as a Colt . the Bushy has 5140 but the fit and finish is not as good as the Stag. you can't go wrong with ether. were I you I would buy an LMT upper and an LMT enhanced m16 bolt group from www.bravocompanyusa.com and a Stag or RRA lower from the EE on AR15.com and you will have what I believe to be one of the finest AR's at any price . than get some Black hills 77 grain red box or blue box and be pleasantly surprised. be carefull you don't hurt yourself smileing .
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Old July 7, 2007, 01:21 PM   #4
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Stag represents a very good AR, but one part of it needs to be addressed. They do not properly stake the gas key. Because of this, they can work themselves loose.


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Old July 7, 2007, 02:23 PM   #5
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well staking the key is only 10 bucks for me but can someone explain 5140 steel to me?
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Old July 7, 2007, 02:38 PM   #6
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If you buy your Stag AR from a dealer that knows what they are doing, they should have already staked the gas key for free.

There is no such thing as 5140. It is 4150 barrel steel. There are several grades of this. The military uses three different types (4150 ORD, CMV and 4150 Resulfurized).

This barrel steel really only matters if your running the weapon on FA as it handles heat better.


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Old July 7, 2007, 02:51 PM   #7
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thanks c41grant i dont run it FA but i would like the better steel anyway and anyone know of a company tat makes an 18 inch barrel
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Old July 7, 2007, 03:16 PM   #8
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18" 4150 Chrome Lined is somewhat of a difficult one as most people want this type of barrel (SPR) in SS.

CMMG might offer some so check them out.


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Old July 7, 2007, 05:18 PM   #9
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Stag Arms
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Old July 7, 2007, 06:38 PM   #10
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my bad 4150, and the only reason they are not useing it is because it saves them money .Bushmaster and Colt do what do you think they just do it for fun ? life is too short to settle for less. my buddy says 440 stainless is as good a blade steel a AUS8 and a blended scotch is as good as a Single malt .I always smile and sip my single malt while he tells me they will both get you drunk . C4iGRANT let me ask you this what doe's your personal SHTF M4 (clone) have ? from a practical standpoint you may very well be right ,most of us will never need it. the differance between want and need is huge and I bet it would only cost the manufacturer maybe $5.00 more for the better steel. who wouldn't pay say $20.00 or so more on a $800.00 rifle ?(not a target rifle )but a weapon for serious defence . my mom used to say the best ingredeants make the best meal.
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Old July 7, 2007, 06:41 PM   #11
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what supports ur choice rockymtntactical

good post buster
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Old July 8, 2007, 12:27 AM   #12
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Stag builds a better rifle (closer to milspec) than Bushy, and on top of that, they are less expensive.
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Old July 8, 2007, 06:10 PM   #13
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tghanks for the input ill probably go for the stag everyone
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Old July 8, 2007, 06:23 PM   #14
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I just ordered a Stag Arms model 3 and paid $758.00 out the door. I should have it by next weekend. The dealer had a Bushmaster just like the Stag that I ordered but he wanted $859 + tax. Getting the gas key re-staked is quite a bit less than $100+ as I'll probably so it myself.
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Old July 14, 2007, 10:02 AM   #15
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I have seen several Bushmasters with poorly staked gas keys that worked loose.
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Old July 14, 2007, 10:37 AM   #16
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This should end the "who is better than who" debate. Here is a breakdown of the manufacturers and who they manufacture and roll-mark for.

Quote:
LMT = LMT, Lauer(old), DS Arms, PWA, Eagle, Knights Armament, Barrett, Bushmaster (?)
CMT = Stag, RRA, High Standard, Noveske (old), Century (current), Global Tactical, CLE, S&W, MGI (1st batch), Wilson Tactical, (some?) Colt, Ratworx
LAR = Grizzly, Bushmaster (L Prefix), Ameetech, (?)DPMS, CMMG, Double Star, Fulton, Spike's Tactical, Noveske (new)
MMS = Mega, Gunsmoke, Dalphon, POF (forged), Alexander Arms, Stinger, Spike's Tactical(old)
JVP = Double Star, LRB
Olympic = Olypmic, SGW, Tromix, Palmetto, Dalphon, Frankford, (old) Century
Superior = Superior Arms, Lauer (current)
Grenadier Precision
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Old July 14, 2007, 11:05 AM   #17
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Quote:
This should end the "who is better than who" debate. Here is a breakdown of the manufacturers and who they manufacture and roll-mark for.


Quote:
LMT = LMT, Lauer(old), DS Arms, PWA, Eagle, Knights Armament, Barrett, Bushmaster (?)
CMT = Stag, RRA, High Standard, Noveske (old), Century (current), Global Tactical, CLE, S&W, MGI (1st batch), Wilson Tactical, (some?) Colt, Ratworx
LAR = Grizzly, Bushmaster (L Prefix), Ameetech, (?)DPMS, CMMG, Double Star, Fulton, Spike's Tactical, Noveske (new)
MMS = Mega, Gunsmoke, Dalphon, POF (forged), Alexander Arms, Stinger, Spike's Tactical(old)
JVP = Double Star, LRB
Olympic = Olypmic, SGW, Tromix, Palmetto, Dalphon, Frankford, (old) Century
Superior = Superior Arms, Lauer (current)
Grenadier Precision
Lowers are pretty much lowers and really doesn't matter IMHO. The parts that tend to make a weapon more reliable are all contained in the upper.



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Old July 14, 2007, 11:13 AM   #18
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I have always bought Bushmasters.

Never had a problem with them. Then one day on a whim I ordered a Stag Lower to slap a SPG (spare parts gun) together (one made up of all the take-off parts from older builds) and was pleasently surprised with the quality of the stag receiver. The finish was very nice, and the manefacturer too the time to sand all of the machine marks smooth on the entire piece, something bushmaster doesn't do. The coating used was also very smooth and black. The stag head emblem doesn't bother me at all either.

So am I a Stag convert? Probably not, but if ever I were to want to by a complete AR15 again, I would definately put my money on a Stag.
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Old July 14, 2007, 01:04 PM   #19
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I would have to agree with C4igrant that an in spec forged lower is all you need ,the reliability of the system is all in the upper . I think Stag should change the Stag logo to a Stag with a derby on it's head and a cigar in it's mouth and the letters CMT below the Stag . I bet they would sell more rifles,and lower's in the first 6 months than they did last year. by the way I was not aware they were not properly stakeing the key ,they should know better and it sould not even cost them more than $2.00 at the most. I have 2 Stag lowers and the fit and finish is superb,my brother has a Stag M4 (type) that he has put over 3000 rounds of all type of ammo from wolf to Hornady ond never hade a problem digesting any of it . he likes it a lot and that is a big deal because he is a real nit picker . I checked the gas key and it is as tight as could be ,I told him to take the bolt group out and bring it to a gunsmith and have it properly staked .
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Old July 15, 2007, 10:22 AM   #20
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I just got my Stag Model 3 and am quite pleased with it. For as far as being put off by the logo I much prefer a deer's head than a big snake. I need to get the gas key re-staked but that is just finding the time to do it. With Wolf Brown Bear 62 gr HP it shoots in about 1 1/2"-2" at 100 yards. I've only been able to put 150 rounds so far so it's not even broke in yet.

Last edited by dodge; July 16, 2007 at 09:54 AM.
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Old July 15, 2007, 01:27 PM   #21
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Having owned Colt and Stag I can't coment on the Bushmaster. I amm more than pleased with Stag quality. I don't mind the deer head at all. Essex
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Old July 16, 2007, 12:27 PM   #22
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Quote:
Lowers are pretty much lowers and really doesn't matter IMHO. The parts that tend to make a weapon more reliable are all contained in the upper.
This is true... Who cares about who makes the lower (As long as it's anodized, forged and the holes are drilled correctly)?
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Old July 16, 2007, 12:37 PM   #23
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Since we know Stag barrels are made of softer, less durable steel than Bushmasters (which means no Stag barrel can be milspec given the material itself is not milspec) what of the Stag upper makes it better? That is not intended to be confrontational, but is the Stag upper receiver itself better, or is it the bolt, carrier, rear sights, what? Is it merely the assembly that is better? Certainly Stag doesn't properly stake their keys as has been stated here, what else makes them better?

I have a Stag upper and am pleased with it, so this isn't anti-Stag. But a little more information is in order, here.

Davis
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Old July 16, 2007, 12:54 PM   #24
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There is no such thing as 5140. It is 4150 barrel steel. There are several grades of this. The military uses three different types (4150 ORD, CMV and 4150 Resulfurized).
so does stag use this type of steel
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Old July 16, 2007, 03:37 PM   #25
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Quote:
Since we know Stag barrels are made of softer, less durable steel than Bushmasters (which means no Stag barrel can be milspec given the material itself is not milspec) what of the Stag upper makes it better? That is not intended to be confrontational, but is the Stag upper receiver itself better, or is it the bolt, carrier, rear sights, what? Is it merely the assembly that is better? Certainly Stag doesn't properly stake their keys as has been stated here, what else makes them better?

I have a Stag upper and am pleased with it, so this isn't anti-Stag. But a little more information is in order, here.

Davis
The difference between 4140 and 4150 is not terribly great. 4140 is still a good grade of barrel steel and with chrome lining there's almost nothing lost.

That said, the 4150 steel is the ONLY thing that bushmaster has on Stag.

Stag makes better bolts (a weak spot on the AR15 platform) and they MPI them all. They use milspec buffer tubes. They include more standard upgrades for less money.

To be honest, the difference won't be noticed by most... but why pay more to get something that is not quite as good? For a name?
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