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Old June 29, 2007, 08:30 PM   #1
FirstFreedom
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Armalite AR30 - .300 winmag vs. .338 lapua mag

How much realistically will the .338 lapua extend your range over the .300 winmag? Is the .300 win mag AR30 comfortable to shoot without the muzzle brake on? It's a pretty heavy rifle. I'd guess that WITH the muzzle brake, the .300 winmag is quite pleasant? Is the lapua round worth the extra ammo cost, even if you reload for it? How much further will it stay supersonic over the .300 winmag? Thanks.

http://www.armalite.com/sales/catalog/rifles/ar30.htm
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Old June 30, 2007, 03:45 AM   #2
tINY
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Do you have a practical application for 1000+ yard shots, or is this just a toy?

The 338 Lapua and 338 RUM are both pretty brutal, it's probably better to just bite that copper jacketed lead and go to the 50 BMG...

If you are just punching paper or shooting anything smaller than Elk, look at the 6 and 6.5mm chamberings that the bench-resters are shooting - like the 6.4-284, the 6mm BR and even the 243 with a fast twist and heavier bullets...




-tINY

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Old June 30, 2007, 06:35 AM   #3
Moloch
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About the recoil, a .300 win mag in such a heavy rifle is a pussycat, the .338 should kick quiet well but not even close to ''brutal''.

Compare it to a standart hunting rifle weighing 6 pounds, the .300 win. mag is hard-kicking, but in the 12 pounds double-as-heavy rifle the recoil should be nothing to worry about. Recoil is greately affected by rifle weight, and a 50% heavier rifle gives 50% less recoil. With muzzle brake it should have a tame recoil even with the .338.
Some years ago I had a .300 win-mag Remington 700, and it wasnt that bad- and it had no muzzle brake and didnt weigh 12 pounds.

The ammo price will hurt you a LOT more than recoil.
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Old June 30, 2007, 07:40 PM   #4
dustinlowery
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a little off post but can anyone give a review for the AR30
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Old July 2, 2007, 07:13 AM   #5
1BadF350
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FirstFreedom, here's my two cents.
If my AR50 is any indicator, the AR30 is an extremely accurate rifle out of the box. The 300WM and 338 Lapua with muzzle break will be a pussycat to shoot.
I've read that a muzzle brakes efficiency increases with the size of the round. Meaning the brake on th 50bmg is more efficient that the same brake on a 300wm. This does not mean the 50 recoils less than the 300wm, it means that the overall reduction in felt recoil (as a percentage of total felt recoil without brake) is higher with the bigger round.
That being said, my Armalite AR-50 recoils like a 20ga shotgun. It is very mild. The loudness of the report and the muzzle blast in your face WILL get your attention. It's seriously loud.
As far as choosing between the 300wm and the 338 Lapua, the 338 ballistically exceeds the 300wm at 1000 yards in every imaginable way. The downside is cost of ammo, which I'm sure you have researched already.
I've toyed with the thought of getting the AR30 so my AR50 has a younger brother. I decided, based on ammo cost and my particular application, that I would choose the 300WM with brake. I am not match shooting at 1000+ yards and it would be a fun gun to have.
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Old July 2, 2007, 07:24 AM   #6
esheato
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I've shot the .338 before. The gun is just a scaled down AR-50.

The brake does what it is supposed to do. Recoil with full power loads was moderate. I've shot -06s with worse recoil.

The stock was less than impressive. While not flimsy, it could have been a bit more solid. Accuracy was as expected. We were drilling Coke cans at 300 yards without even trying.

Like the AR-50, the small brother still has a large footprint. Plan on some bench space.

Other than that, I'd go for it.

Ed
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Old July 2, 2007, 02:33 PM   #7
Zak Smith
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The 338LM shooting 300's should have about 250-300 yards more than the "best" 300WM load, and 400-500 yards more than the most common factory 300WM load (190gr SMK).

20-35% less wind drift depending on which loads being compared again.

-z
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Old July 4, 2007, 02:02 PM   #8
armedtotheteeth
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Well, I purchased the AR-30 300 wIN ABOUT 2 YEARS ABO. I love IT!! I have never ever fired a Factory load through it, And never plan to. Now adays, ammo runs about 50 cents a shot, even reloading, the storebought cheapie crap is well over a $1 a shot even at Wal mart. My 300 Win kicks a bit less than my aR-15. bUT Is louder that a Boeing 747. It is seriuosly accurate, as I can pretty regularly hit a Milk jug from my longest field shot of 825 yards. Ammo cost should be a major consideration of purchasing a gun. Expect the cost of ammo for the life of the gun to well Exceed the cost of the gun. In the case of a 338 Lapua, it could be as much as 5 times the cost of the gun. Think about it. $2 a shot, maybe more?? HMMMMMMMMMMMMM
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Old July 4, 2007, 11:23 PM   #9
line1
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The good thing about the 338 Lapua is the brass . Its expensive, but very high quality and can be reloaded alot. The other reloading items dont cost that much extra . The Norma Brass is even cheaper. Walmart has the best price on the Dinty Moore cans for the mile shots.
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Old July 23, 2007, 01:05 PM   #10
erwinmaes
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I shoot both the 300WSM and the 338 lapua magnum.
I reload both cartidges with Viht N560 powder.

The 300WSM uses about 68 grains for my optimum load, the 338 swallows 84 grains.
The bullets cost about the same.

The cases are MUCH better quality (I use Lapua), and can be reloaded up to 8 times, copared to the 4 times I MAX use the WSM cases (Norma 5 times)

So, the is not much price difference.

Downside on the 338 is the recoil (yes it is more than the 300WSM ;.)
and the small amount of bullets available. (only the 250gr lapua scenar and the 250gr and 300gr Sierra Matchkings and other brands ofcourse)
For the 300WSM, you have the vast choice of all the .30 cal bullets available.

Shooting range : the 300WSM goes subsonic at about 1000 metres, the 338 lapua only at 1500 metres...
Military sniper rifles (as the TRG42 I use) are used for anti-personel purposes up to 1500 metres, because of the supersonic flight. (you hear the blast after the bullet hits you.. )

I'd go for the smaller .30 cal, although the 338 is a great toy!!!

References :
http://www.custer.com.au/Lap/338magnumstory.php
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.338_Lapua_Magnum
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Old July 23, 2007, 01:15 PM   #11
FirstFreedom
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thanks erwinmaes....

Quote:
Walmart has the best price on the Dinty Moore cans for the mile shots.
Been watchin "Shooter", have we?

FYI: I got the .300 winmag. I'm kinda thinking along the lines of what tiny said - if you're going to go for a .338, may as well bite the bullet (so to speak) and get a .50 BMG - it has insane ballistic coefficient bullets. AND, once you reach the "muzzle-brake-necessary-not-just-preferred" point, which is right at or just below a .338 maggie, then you're already throwing up dust and otherwise receiving the negatives of the brake (blast). So once you're at that point, may as well do it right. The .300 winmag is just tolerable recoil-wise without a brake with a heavy-ish rifle.

Otherwise, I'm gonna stick with 6mm, 6.5s, and this one .300 winmag for long range stuff. Until I can afford a .50 bmg, if ever I do, that is.
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Old July 23, 2007, 03:02 PM   #12
Chris Phelps
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Quote:
Do you have a practical application for 1000+ yard shots, or is this just a toy?

The 338 Lapua and 338 RUM are both pretty brutal, it's probably better to just bite that copper jacketed lead and go to the 50 BMG...

If you are just punching paper or shooting anything smaller than Elk, look at the 6 and 6.5mm chamberings that the bench-resters are shooting - like the 6.4-284, the 6mm BR and even the 243 with a fast twist and heavier bullets...




-tINY

I am with him, for the most part. 50BMG and 338LM can only be compared so far as to say they are both designed for long range shooting. The LM was purpose designed to be a sniper rifle, with the intent being to engage soldiers. The BMG was designed to engage hard targets. The LM is more accurate.


If you plan on doing any sort of hunting at all... go with tINYs recommendation.
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