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Old August 30, 2006, 09:28 AM   #26
DobermansDoItGoofy
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I doubt I'll ever go elephant hunting... It might be interesting...but it's somewhere near 'orbiting then landing on the moon' in regard to $ feasibility...

However, I also can't imagine 'gutting and cleaning and skinning an elephant'. My little buck knife is tough - but I think an elephant would absolutely gross me out !
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Old August 30, 2006, 09:43 AM   #27
Art Eatman
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Maser, from what I read, ethical hunts include scouting to see which particular elephant in an area is worth shooting. Then you gotta go back and find him again, which isn't necessarily all that easy. That can take many miles of walking and dodging critters that can and will stomp you or eat you.

You gotta get close. That means you have to be quiet, and have to have the wind in your favor. While you're doing that, you're dealing with thorns and vines and underbrush and all that hostile stuff.

What you don't do is drive out, say, "Oh, looky there!" and shoot.

DDIG, from what I read, when you kill an elephant you quickly find yourself surrounded by Eager Eaters who will happily skin and butcher the critter. Read some of Ruark's and Capstick's descriptions of the aftermath of an elephant kill.

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Old August 30, 2006, 09:46 PM   #28
Maser
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Eatman
Maser, from what I read, ethical hunts include scouting to see which particular elephant in an area is worth shooting. Then you gotta go back and find him again, which isn't necessarily all that easy. That can take many miles of walking and dodging critters that can and will stomp you or eat you.

You gotta get close. That means you have to be quiet, and have to have the wind in your favor. While you're doing that, you're dealing with thorns and vines and underbrush and all that hostile stuff.

What you don't do is drive out, say, "Oh, looky there!" and shoot.

I respect everything you have said, but I have to stick with my oppinion on what I said before. Just look at the comparison on deer hunting and elephant hunting. When you deer hunt you are usually by yourself or with a buddy. When you elephant hunt (from what I have seen on TV shows) you got guides following you with kalashnikovs which are most likely full auto. I don't call that "real" hunting. I understand the whole point of harvesting the large bulls to keep the elephant polulation alive and well, but to call that hunting.......sorry, but it really is not in my oppinion.
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Old August 30, 2006, 10:24 PM   #29
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a little off topic but its not worth a new thread. yesterday a made a little trip to the gun store. the owner hunts elephant with a friend in Africa. he was telling me a story of a trip his friend had made to hunt lion. he went out with the guides in the middle of the night to a spot where the guides said a huge male lion was hanging out. sure enough the lion was in the tree. he continues to shoot the lion, and the guides say its time to back to camp because it was not wise to track a wounded lion at night. well they go back to camp. the restless hunter keeps thinking that he had made a good shot and the lion is dead. he gets his rifle and "borrows" a jeep, and proceeds to drive to the spot where the lion was shot. sure enough the lion was still in the tree. he decides that he will get it out of the tree himself and take it back to camp. he climbs up into the tree and grabs the lion. then he realizes that something isn't right. the lion was frozen!!!! apparently the guides were leaving it in the tree th let it thaw overnight. i know that he reported the guides to the government (apparently it was concreted poaching) and had his money refunded, but nothing else about the end of the story.
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Old August 30, 2006, 11:05 PM   #30
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Maser,
Check out "Death in the Long Grass" at Amazon. Search inside the book for elephant. I think you'll agree after reading some of the descriptions that there is much more to hunting elephants than just blasting one with a full auto.

Your guide will more than likely be carrying a double rifle in a caliber beginning with 5, not a "kalashnikov". Before its over, you might be glad he's there. Believe it or not, an elephants brain is a very small target in a very large animal.

If you wound a deer, it won't normally grab you with its trunk and beat you to a pulp against the nearest tree or anthill. Deer won't usually put a foot on your chest and tear off your arms and legs or just use their foreheads and tusks to grind you into a grease spot. You don't even have to wound an elephant to get this treatment. All you have to do is get upwind when the elephant is having a bad day.

There are some epic stories of elephant hunts. You should read some of them and then form an opinion. TV is not always the best reference.

Everyone has the right to their own opinion and I respect yours. I would respect it more if it was better informed.
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Old August 30, 2006, 11:22 PM   #31
JohnKSa
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Quote:
When you elephant hunt (from what I have seen on TV shows) you got guides following you with kalashnikovs which are most likely full auto.
If someone in a hunting party is carrying an AK, it's for protection from CRIMINALS, not elephants! Ivory poachers tend to be a very unpleasant bunch.

Guides for elephant hunters carry guns, but not military style weapons.

BTW, it may look easy when it's done right, but the brain isn't all that big a target, it's behind many, MANY inches of skullbone, and if you miss it or your bullet is deflected or doesn't penetrate enough, things will get hairy in a hurry.
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Old August 30, 2006, 11:50 PM   #32
Bigfatts
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I have seen a few shows where Elephant were the main hunt and I have never seen a guide or tracker carrying ANY military style rifle. The only AKs I have seen in the shows are when they are talking about poachers. I have seen some hefty bolt and double rifles though. All the hunts I've seen have been very ethical as well. None of the meat or anything goes to waste from what I've seen. I'm no expert by any means, I have never been to Africa nor do I plan to ever go, but I'm pretty sure we have hunting to thank for these animals still being in a lot of the places where they are.
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Old August 31, 2006, 07:51 AM   #33
Jack O'Conner
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maas:

That was an interesting tale. Am I to understand that this lion was frozen solid in Africa? Or was this somewhere in North Dakota?

Jack
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Old August 31, 2006, 09:07 AM   #34
Art Eatman
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Maser, you oughta know by now that TV as a sole source for information isn't the best basis for opinion.

Just like the box-blind and feeder deer hunts on the Outdoor Channel: I don't doubt that there are folks who think that's the way hunting is done, and I don't doubt that for some, that's all there is. From my experience and observation over some forty years, however, that's a small percentage of all hunts.

Ask some of the guys who've posted here about their own hunting experiences in Africa, and also over at http://www.thehighroad.org There are a fair number of folks who can tell first-hand of what it's like, of how it's done.

I don't recall any of them ever relating anything that substantiates your view.

Art
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Old August 31, 2006, 04:45 PM   #35
maas
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it was frozen in africa. they had killed the lion (or found it dead) and just put it in a walk-in freezer.
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