The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Art of the Rifle: General

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old June 8, 2006, 09:38 AM   #1
40CalGuy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 28, 2005
Location: southwest usa
Posts: 348
Federal Arms FA-91 .308

I have been entrusted with the care of a FA-91 in .308. It's not in bad shape. Someone took a hammer (and not a smithing hammer) to the receiver where the barrel pins in, and removed the finish where the pins are. The reason that I have been given this rifle is a double part equation:

1.) The extractor is apparently not quite working properly. Anyone have a line on where to get the extrator for this rifle? I know it's an HK-91 clone, but are the parts completely interchangable? I would not think this to be the case, especially with an HK.

2.) There apparently is a problem with the feeding of the rounds from the magazine. It's feeding 3 at a time. I figure this has to be a magazine issue. Bent feed lips, warped spring, causing multiple rounds to be forced into the chamber at once. Perhaps this issue is being exacerbated by the failing extractor?

I'll admit it, I think this is a sweet rifle. I will need to buy a mag for it to test it out, as the owner can't find it. Perhaps this is best, after all. If the feeding problem is mag related, hopefully a new mag would fix that on its own. The owner says that "When I use cheap ammo, it has more issues than when I use good ammo." Yeah...the guy is a friend of a friend (yes, it's one of those deals). Pretty subjective description, don't you think? I will not speculate as to what he thinks "good" ammo is, and would urge you not to either.

What do you guys think is in the realm of reasonable to pay for a 91 mag? And can someone gather a list of ammo, from worst to best? I will get the mag and ammo, and take it to the range with me next week to see how she does. Thanks in advance.
__________________
Entirely too many toys to list.
40CalGuy is offline  
Old June 8, 2006, 12:27 PM   #2
candr44
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 11, 2006
Posts: 412
An HK mag is very cheap right now. I found several new aluminum HK G3 mags for $5 each at a gun show. You can find them easily on line also for a cheap price. You might want to try a Cetme mag also and see if it works but they aren't as cheap or quite as easy to find.

I was just looking at FA 91 at a gun shop and the parts appear to be identical to an HK 91. I don't know if they will interchange but you might get by with just changing the extractor spring. The Cetme and HK extractors interchange so yours might also.

As for ammo I have only used South African .308 in my Cetme and it has proven itself as very good ammo. I used it with Cetme mags, HK G3 mags, and Thermold mags and it has never failed to feed, fire, and extract. You can still get it at AIM Surplus but the supply is drying up and the cost is also going up. If you find any Indian surplus ammo stay away from it. It is some of the worse .308 you can buy.

One other thing you might want to check is the bolt gap between the bolt and bolt carrier when it's in battery. It may be worn out and a source of some of your problems. Cetmerifles.com has a lot of information on what to look for on this type of design and they can help you with a lot of problems.
candr44 is offline  
Old June 8, 2006, 01:22 PM   #3
40CalGuy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 28, 2005
Location: southwest usa
Posts: 348
candr44

Thanks for the information regarding the ability to use CETME mags. I have seen them here at a local shop, and they are cheap. Also, thanks for the other info as well. If anyone else has anything to add, please do. I've not dealt with one of these rifles before. It was given to me to mess with and check out simply because I have become the consumate gun nut in the past year, and just generally like figuring things out. Much appreciated.
__________________
Entirely too many toys to list.
40CalGuy is offline  
Old June 8, 2006, 06:18 PM   #4
prime8
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 13, 2006
Location: In a tent in Iowa
Posts: 434
mmm

Im buying a ptr-91 . Ive done ALOT of research on these types of guns. From what Ive seen, you should sell the rifle a.s.a.p. The FA 91 has an aluminum reciever, wich gets hot and causes serious feeding and extraction problems. This is just what Ive heard! You could buy anJLD PTR reciever, and use the parts though. Im pretty sure most of the HK clones have interchangeable parts. Except Cetme. Check out the HK files!!!http://www.hkweaponsystems.com/cgi-b...ultimatebb.cgi
Good luck!
__________________
X
prime8 is offline  
Old June 9, 2006, 09:44 AM   #5
40CalGuy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 28, 2005
Location: southwest usa
Posts: 348
I had not considered that

Thanks prime8. It's all pretty much speculation at this point, and trying to get ahold of the guy that actually owns it to find out when the problems started, or if they were always there...what type of ammo he considers to be "good" and what he considers to be "junk." It's one of those "the gun is the property of a friend of a friend" type of deals, and the owner is kind of incommunicado at the moment.
__________________
Entirely too many toys to list.
40CalGuy is offline  
Old June 9, 2006, 05:02 PM   #6
40CalGuy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 28, 2005
Location: southwest usa
Posts: 348
I just thought of something

The guy that owns this is ex-military, so I would think that he would know better....but...what if he's shooting some bad mil-surp 7.62 NATO? In a stamped aluminum receiver, that would heat it up pretty quick, no? Also, if his magazine is beat up, that may account for the feeding problems, especially if he's blasting off the rounds real quick. Shooting the NATO rounds would only heat the receiver more, cause more flux in the material, higher pressures, and potential exascerbate whatever issues he was already having. Additionally, as to the extraction issue, perhaps the higher pressure is causing the extractor to fail intermittantly as well? Anyone want to chime in?

Also, picked up a HK stamped G3 mag today, used, but in good condition for $9.50. Also, 20 rounds of .308 Venezualan FMJ, 20 rounds of British .308 FMJ, and 20 rounds of Winchester .308 FMJ. Perhaps I should pick up 20 of 7.62 NATO just to see if that's what he's doing wrong?
__________________
Entirely too many toys to list.
40CalGuy is offline  
Old June 9, 2006, 08:32 PM   #7
prime8
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 13, 2006
Location: In a tent in Iowa
Posts: 434
Not the ammo

The only 308 Im aware of thats not real good is 1981 South African. The aluminum heats up and cant dissipate heat as well as steel. The trunion will eventually come loose, and your accuracy will go out the window. Im no engineer, but I was in ordnance in the Marine Corps. Your not alone, the Springfield armory, and vector ones are the same way. Every forum Ive looked at has said the same thing. Search "HK 91 or G3 forums".
This is all just what Ive heard, but you may save yourself some aggrevation and use it as a build kit. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.... These types of rifles are intended to be used with NATO ammo. For me, that was the attraction. Cheap bulk ammo being blasted as fast as I can squeez the trigger.
Heres the one I ordered.
http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/prog...asp?Prodid=249
__________________
X
prime8 is offline  
Old June 12, 2006, 11:50 AM   #8
40CalGuy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 28, 2005
Location: southwest usa
Posts: 348
Some intial findings

After picking up 60 rounds of various ammo...and some it is the South African...damnit, I loaded up the used mag that I bought, and found that when the action is cycled manually, I am experiencing the same sort of problems that the owner has described when he shoots it. Bear in mind that I am not shooting it, just manually cycling the action with a full mag to see if it feeds and extracts properly. When the bolt assembly travels forward, and picks up a new round from the mag, the bolt does not travel all of the way forward, and does not seat the round all the way into the chamber. When this happens, the extractor has not engaged the rear of the casing, and if you manually cycle the action at this point, obviously, there's still a round in the chamber that isn't going to extract...and you'll end up feeding another round into the recevier from the magazine. I have oiled the bolt carrier system, and the internals of the magazine. Feeding from the magazine is just fine. Anyone have any further input on this issue? If I release the charging handle, and let the action slam forward with a full mag, the cycling problems are less frequent than of I ride the handle forward. The owner reports that this is not a new issue on this gun, and that it has always had this problem. Thanks in advance.
__________________
Entirely too many toys to list.
40CalGuy is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:26 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.08211 seconds with 7 queries