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Old April 23, 2006, 04:44 PM   #1
Minator
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AK-74 vs AR-15

5.45 and 5.56 are almost exactly the same yet operate totally different. On one hand since 5.56 is manufactered domesticaly so there is almost an endless supply and loadings but costs a little more.

Since 5.45 isnt made here there is a limited amount of types and supply but its cheaper.

Its proven the Ak handles adverse conditions and excessive abuse, but Its accuracy is limited. An AR preforms just as well if kept In a decent condition and they also make a gas piston upper so the way the system operates doesnt matter anymore because they are close to mimicing eachother.

Magazines are abundant for both and are around the same price.

An AR has an endless amount of accesories and parts, but so does the 74
which is one of the reasons I cant make up my mind I only want one type of midsize semi-rifles so If I pick an AR im staying with AR's so I dont have an excessive amount of mags and ammo other than for the one type. Ive owned both I know how to clean and build both.

Does anyone have any experiences or preferences that would push them in one direction more than another if they were in the middle of a decision similar to this.
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Old April 23, 2006, 07:45 PM   #2
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Unfortunately, I don't have any constructive input, but I do have a newb question. What is the advantage/difference between the 5.45 and the 7.62? Before I had any interest in long guns, I always assumed all AK's were 7.62. Now I know better, but I don't have the slightest idea what advantages one caliber has over the other or the physical differences in contruction of both rounds. A little enlightenment would be greatly appreciated
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Old April 23, 2006, 08:20 PM   #3
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AK. I don't know if 5.45x39mm is on par with the .223, but they're reliable as heck. Dip 'em in mud, pull 'em out, and empty a mag onto a target. They'll do it.
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Old April 23, 2006, 08:38 PM   #4
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difference between 5.56 and 5.45 are that 5.45 typically comes with lighter bullet weights, but seems to have a tendancy to tumble moreso that the 5.56 on impact. i'm not sure how they compare in terms of accuracy or flight characteristics. the ruskies had a type of 5.45 round refered by the afghans as "poison bullets" because they were so deadly, since they were FMJ but had a hollow space inside the tip which made them tumble like crazy on impact.



difference between the 5.45 and the 7.62?

5.45 would recoil less, have a flatter trajectory, higher velocity, more accurate at closer ranges, lighter weight.

7.62 penetrates more through objects, has heavier bullet weight which allows it to go a little further.

which one is deadlier? i'd think that the russian "poison bullet" hollow tipped 5.45 would be more deadly than a standard FMJ 7.62, but that 7.62 would be more deadly than a standard, FMJ 5.45.
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Old April 23, 2006, 10:19 PM   #5
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If you want a gun that runs in any condition, but shoots patterns get the AK.

If you want a gun that runs when clean, and shoots tight groups get the AR.

Both make big holes with the correct bullet with the AR being a better long range weapon (better accuracy and flatter shooting).

Modifications? AR by A LOT.
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Old April 23, 2006, 10:28 PM   #6
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But isn't tumbling a pretty bunk thing altogether? We're not talking about magic buzz-sawing bullets, are we? When a lot of people are describing the effects of a 5.56 on a target, I hear them refer to how the bullet tumbles at like 15k rps, but even at that rate the bullet might spin once going through the target's body. Oh - thanks for the response!
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Old April 23, 2006, 11:46 PM   #7
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The differences that I know of between 5.56 and 5.45, is that the 5.56 was made to fragment which it does but you haft to send out of at the very least a 16" barrel. The only difference in the 5.45 is its smaller yet has a tendancy to tumble more than the 5.56 fragments.

The only draw back of the 7.62 is its range.

Thats pretty much why I didnt care about wether it was 5.45 or 5.56 I just want to be sure when I get the 74 wether I ll have ammo and accesories.

Also does anyone know of a manufacture that sales 74s other than aresnal someone told me you can get them about the same price as a romanian but they rise in quality and price like the normal 7.62
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Old April 24, 2006, 12:09 AM   #8
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I would say AR-15.

I have two 5.45 rifles; a Romanian Sar-2 and an Arsenal SLR-105 and I also have a Rock River AR-15. Comparing my 74s with my AR, I would have to say that I prefer the AR. About the same kick but the AR is more accurate plus it's more ergonomic.

The 5.45 ammo is cheaper for now but I keep hearing that it's going to go up in price because there isn't much demand for it. Last time I talked to someone at Arsenal, they said they discontinued their 5.45 rifles because most people want AKs in 7.62 or 5.56. Also, there is a wider variety of loads for the 5.56 and all of my shooting friends have at least one 5.56 caliber rifle.

I like my 5.45 rifles and I've spent alot of money on accessories for them so I won't be getting rid of them any time soon. But if I had it to do over again, I would just stick to my 7.62 AKs and my 5.56 AR.
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Old April 24, 2006, 11:55 AM   #9
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If you are only going to choose one I would get the AR-15 because 5.56 is made domestically and very common. I have used the M4 extensively in combat without any trouble. 5.56 does its job.

With that said, I am a big fan of the AK-74 and 5.45. It is accurate, extremely controllable, and a joy to shoot. I do believe that 5.45 is more effective than 5.56 because of the bullet design. It doesn't rely on velocity to fragment or tumble. 5.45 x 39mm is a much more accurate round than 7.62 x 39mm. I would put my AK-74 clones up against my standard 16" AR any day as far as accuracy. The drawback of the AK-74 is the sights. The sights on an AR-15 are much better. 5.45 is fast becomeing one of my favorite rounds.
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Old April 26, 2006, 07:11 PM   #10
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if accuracy is not your bag, or cheap rounds, the 545 round has it all over the 223, plus the ak gives you an ooh ahh factor.
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Old April 26, 2006, 07:29 PM   #11
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Quote:
.....plus the ak gives you an ooh ahh factor.
Only in rap videos.
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Old April 26, 2006, 07:35 PM   #12
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It would have to be the ak. I just couldn't consciously join the Ar fanboy crowd where everyone and their pet has one because like the military have a version of it.
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Old April 26, 2006, 07:37 PM   #13
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from what I understand, no bullet actually tumbles in the sense that it spins end over end over end like a saw...The most they'll really go is around 180 degrees, at which point they're going butt-end first through meat (or whatever you're shooting).
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Old April 26, 2006, 07:44 PM   #14
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The .223 bullets fragment at closer ranges in FMJ and will fragent at almost any range with a varmint bullet. The wound channel is nasty.
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Old April 26, 2006, 07:53 PM   #15
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The 5.56x45 is a very slightly better preformer than the 5.45x39 with the ammo you can curently get now ,the real deal rusky stuff is damn good at it's job and a great anti personal round . they are not going to import the good stuff any more so its a moot point . I say get them both an AK and an AR .
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Old April 26, 2006, 08:37 PM   #16
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I pulled a 5.45 bullet years ago. It measured about .224 inches in diameter. This didn't surprise me since their 7.62 is a .311, I figured the 5.45 would be bigger than it sounds. Now if someone would start making brass cases I can start reloading for this thing and push it to the extreme.
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Old April 27, 2006, 05:55 AM   #17
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I do have experience with the AK74, and I can tell you that the 74 is superior to the M16. You have the legendary reliablity of the AK family, plus the hard hitting accuracy of the M-16. The best part is that the 74 feeds better than the 16, you don't have to seat the rounds in the magazine (those of you that have used the M16 in combat will know what I'm talking about; remember tapping your helmet with your mag?), and best of all, it's as accurate as an M16; no joke... If you can get ahold of a variant chambered for 5.56mm, commonly known as the ak103...you've got the best of all worlds. I just wished that when they built the mags for the M16, they'd have left them straight or did something to improve feeding with the 30rd mag.
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Old April 27, 2006, 05:59 PM   #18
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5.45x39

the round is for the most part a 22 ppc i know they are not the same round. a few years ago i got a boult gun from sog in 5.45x39 and after i got rid of the scope that came with it was the best out of the box rifle i own. now here is where you will all lose it i reload the steel case i recut the primer pockets and neck size only ( its a bolt gun ). i got the dies from rcbs . ilove it i have killed more ground hogs then i can remember
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Old December 31, 2009, 10:55 AM   #19
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Here is some surprizing food for thought

Food for thought on this old assumption and old thread. I was very surprised after watching both videos.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8SSQ_wIG4o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lo5WhVvtYak

I never would've guessed these results.
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Old December 31, 2009, 03:28 PM   #20
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I like the AR15 better.
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Old December 31, 2009, 03:32 PM   #21
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Just an F.Y.I the AK-74M is accurate out to 585m if I remember right so as far as accuracy is concerned it is on par with a M-16
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Old December 31, 2009, 04:40 PM   #22
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Seems like there is one of these "Russian or American" posts every other day...

Let the gun pick you. Both have their strong points, as you made clear. So go to the range, go to the shop, and handle both. If you believe they are equally suitable guns for what you want.. then why it comes down to whicever gun feels best in your hands.

However, that's not what you wanted to hear. So I'll cast my vote for the proven and robust AR 15. Go with a good manufacturer, and observe yourself never grow tired of it because you can readily transform it to meet more than one purpose.

Instead of having a rifle for my every need, I only need my reliable RRA Carbine length AR 15 and a plethera of parts and accessories that I can switch out in a couple minutes. The rest of my rifles are for kicks

And please disregard anyone who submits to internet rumor abou the reliability of an AR 15. the tolerance levels of ARs and AKs are very similar
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Old December 31, 2009, 05:02 PM   #23
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My Arsenal has failed more often than my 6920-- Crappy AK promag versus Magpul PMag. My Arsenal SLR106's accuracy in on par with a AR-15. Choose whichever you like, use quality parts and accessories, and feed it quality ammo
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Old December 31, 2009, 05:23 PM   #24
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Notably, you CAN get an AR-15 in 5.45, so if your love of 5.45 over 5.56 is what's pushing you towards an AK-74, that's something to consider.
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Old December 31, 2009, 05:47 PM   #25
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Eh, bad idea. The biggest benefit of the 5.45 cartridge is the fact that it's slung from a Kalashnikov. I own the S&W M&P 5.45 AR-15, and while it's a great training gun, the feed reliability leaves MUCH to be desired. The magazines are absolutely terrible for 5.45x39 on an AR-15 platform.. The only ones available (to my knowledge) are made by C Products and they are some of the worst built mags I've ever had the displeasure of using. Poorly made doesn't even begin to describe how bad they are.
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