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Old February 25, 2011, 10:01 PM   #601
HUBEL458
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Here is picture the CBC 20ga FH setup
by mono-blocking a heavy 20 ga barrel
into a CBC 12ga breech section.The 20 heavy
barrel is threaded into the mono-block made
by cutting off 12ga barrel. These CBC actions
are taller and wider than other break actions
and the locking lug block works better and
nicer than other break actions.Also shown
is 20ga 3.5" plastic and brass cases.
Second picture is PH action with port lengthened
for 585HSM, shown in action. I also have second
change barrel for 700HE long case for this action.
Imagine over 20,000 ft lbs in a PH, for 700HE.
Also shown behind is a PH with 700H 3.25"..Ed

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Old March 5, 2011, 04:13 AM   #602
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Here are some 20ga slugs/sabots we rigged up.
I traded for whole box(hundreds) of 20ga Hammerhead
slugs, in the picture. They had pulled slugs
out of the locked on plastic base, so I glue them
back in so base stays for fair smoothbore accuracy.
And I also glued in various 458 bullets, as shown,
which fit tight in cup, up to 500gr. They discard
on impact. Fair accuracy at 50-70 yds. Less expensive
shooting as I have pile of hard lead 458 slugs.

Idea on 8ga FH. Looked at a TCR87 break action 10ga
and the breach mono-block can take a little bigger
barrel.If I find one I can afford(pricey) I'll do 8ga.
These are very strong actions, a little smaller version
of the action setup Colin put the 2bore in.
Just put in straight 8ga bull barrel like NEF Ultra.ED

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Old March 11, 2011, 02:45 AM   #603
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Here is picture of the 4bore in a more finished look.
Second picture is closeup of cases and 1520 gr
hollowbase hard slugs. The 4bore is smooth bore so
hollowbase slugs are used. I set up gun with
smoothbore as that saved large amount of time and
money on the barrel. Ed



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Old March 11, 2011, 09:01 AM   #604
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As always thank you for this most interesting thread. What are the ballistics of the 4 Bore you pictured?
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Old March 12, 2011, 03:59 AM   #605
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So far-
Light weight 760 gr ball 2700
Double ball load 2200-
1520gr lead slug 2200.

These are moderate loads.
Good weather gets here will test them higher
The brass and gun will hold pressures
to get 1500gr slug to 26-2700.Ed
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Old March 12, 2011, 10:10 AM   #606
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So this will go over 20,000 ft lbs. I think you indicated you had a couple others set up to do over 20,000 ft lbs or is this the only one? What are the general methods you use to deal with the insane recoil aside fron the obvious like a really heavy gun and a good pad? Thanks
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Old March 13, 2011, 02:45 PM   #607
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The heavy gun and good pad works along with
thumbhole stock. I also put ports on the
top of muzzle if needed.And hold it tight which
the thumbhole stock makes easier.Ed
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Old March 21, 2011, 06:50 AM   #608
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I found 3 long brass 8ga cases to go with
the 3.3" plastic ones. They are an inch longer
and made by RMC. The 8ga barrel I'm putting
on a falling block will have the chamber long
so I can use both lengths of cases.
The plastic ones are from 8ga kiln cases with base
swaged a little and has shotgun primers, The
long brass has shotgun primers.
I use Fed 239 shotgun primers.Ed

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Old March 29, 2011, 01:21 AM   #609
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The long brass 8ga cases have same thick
sides as plastic cases. And there are long
plastic/paper cases out there, but they
are scarce. Thick sides mean a good chamber
fit, so as to minimize case expansion and make sizing
easier. Here is picture 8ga and 10ga fullbore slugs with
locked on basewads that I setup. Wads held on by
screws and slugs hollowbase as well, so to work in
smooth barrels with some accuracy. 8ga is 1100gr.
10ga is 900 gr.Ed
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Old March 29, 2011, 02:09 AM   #610
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dang you aint going to have a shoulder left man
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Old March 29, 2011, 02:30 AM   #611
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MAGNIFICENT
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Old April 4, 2011, 03:30 AM   #612
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New super strong 12ga bolt gun just out, Savage 212, taking
over for the 210. You know I did my first 12ga FH in a 210 and
have posted that sometime I'd like to get a thicker walled
reciever built to have more strength and safety.
Well Savage helped us out.

Its reciever is 1.5" diameter, where the 210 was 1.36" dia.
I has a large .900" diameter bolt, where the 210 had regular
110 bolt inside bolt carrier. It has a fitted bolt head like 210
and other Savage 110-116 rifles. Only its bolt head has two lugs
where the 210 had 3 lugs. Its two lugs about 90% strength as
the 210s 3 lugs.Its about 12% stronger lugs than Enfield and
Rugers. Also it appears the bolt raceways are not through the
barrel thread area so about 50% stronger barrel connection.

Price not too bad 500-550. I'll try to find one later to do some
hairy cartridges in. It has a 3" 12ga chamber from factory and
detachable magazine. Probably can have mag and port lengthened
and feed ok, with 3.5" 12ga and the 700H 3.25". More info
as I find out stuff.Picture from auction-e.Thanks to
Bob in OR for info.Ed
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Old April 12, 2011, 11:30 PM   #613
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Some more info on the Savage 212. I looked at one,
got more measurements. The port is 3.812" long.
Can be made longer. Bolt travel is 4.625" and can be .50"
longer. And with full diameter bolt can have extra
lugs in back. The Mag box has room for extra length in
front of it and behind it. It could work for 12ga FH
and 700HE long case.

A fellow on Gunsmithing forum found a way to make
jacketed slugs using copper tubing caps, the solder ones,
by putting them in a die and using a shaped punch to form
a round nose copper jacket, that can be filled with lead.
He made .700 cal ones, different dies/punchs could
be made .729, 12ga size. I got a few here and going to see
what is possible. I got bigger caps also to see about 4ga
and 8ga ones. Here is picture of the CBC break action with
the 20ga heavy barrel mono-blocked in, with action open.Ed
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Old April 27, 2011, 10:20 AM   #614
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Would have posted back quicker but computer
hookup down for afew days..
Here is picture of 16GA FH I mentioned earlier doing in
an Enfield. Got 630gr slug 2400, compared to
the first 16GA FH in thin barrel break action at 1600.
I use 630 gr full bore slugs and the 385gr SPW
saboted with locked on base.

Opened port and changed bolt stop. Reamed
front so case fit through action into barrel and added extra
rear lugs. Same process that is used to do Enfield
in my 700H 3.25.
I got some of the work done on 8ga in my falling
block design, like the 4ga I've done pictured earlier.
Will get pictures posted later..Ed
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Old May 10, 2011, 03:29 AM   #615
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Experimenting for fellows trying to get speed with heavier sabot slugs than
the lightweight saboted 4-500 gr kind of slugs, in 2 5/8" length brass
cases for where length is limited..

Using 770 gr saboted slugs with locked on base, by US-S.
Thes are long saboted slugs due being brass and locked on base.
Real hard to do with these due to lack of powder space for the RE17
and IMR 4759-4227 that I like to use. With 770 gr and 60gr 4759 got 1450 fps.
With 75gr Re17 about 1350 fps. Both of these all case will hold under sabot.

For contrast using full bore 730 gr Dixie with just seals under it, much more
powder room, with 95gr 4759 getting 1800 plus and 130 gr RE17 1700 fps.
I went to faster powder, my slowest shotgun powder, Alliant steel, to try to get
speed like full bore slugs get.

These listed are max loads before brass cases expanded to much and started
sticking, due to sharp expansion step, where the base goes to the side with a
real small inside radius on this particular RMC brass case.
47gr Steel,and 770 gr slug 1400 fps.

So I tried the 570 gr US-S with 53gr Steel,and got 1700 fps. Same slug with
65gr 4759 got 1650. You can put in more Steel but cases stick.
And cases expanded that way are hard to resize.

The first 3" brass I got years ago, same problem with
a sharp step expanding above the base. So when I had 3.5" brass made
I had them do a long inside radius from base to the sides. These with extra
room for powder and cushion are much less problem. I think where you have
to use shorter cases, you can use plastic, as a 3" plastic is 2 5/8"
when crimped and will do the same and only be 20 cents or so new.Ed
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Old May 26, 2011, 12:58 AM   #616
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Here is picture of a big bolt action a fellow on Homegunsmith
built to put big cases in, for his own use. It is of better looks,
quality than most other single shot actions, of that style being
built by others for sale. And that is absolute
sexiest bolt handle.
Also the fellow made a recess type of die and shaped punch
to make large caliber, copper bullet jackets, from plumbing
copper caps, and then put melted lead into them from
the back. He uses a big hammer, works great.
I got a few different sizes of caps and they are
perfect for bullet jackets. Right from hardware or plumber
supply places. ED

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Old May 29, 2011, 01:45 AM   #617
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Answering questions bullet jackets from copper tubing caps. This process makes jacketed slug with covered nose. With heavy soft jacket as opposed to a solid turned slug from solid rod or soft lead slug.

1/2" caps can make .700 and 12ga size jackets. 5/8" caps can do 8ga and maybe 10ga jkts. And 3/4" caps can make 4ga. These cups are malleable enough to shape into jackets, without a 20 ton stamping press.

Interesting info about our posting of this subject on about 5 dozen forums. One big general forum thread, that we posted some info, has about 5 million views.It is Mil Photo Forum a big world wide forum.. The top forum of the bunch, with whole thread on it about 120,000 views, 2nd about 110,000, views, 3rd one about 104,000 views, 4th one (which is this forum) about 102,00 views.
And we really appreciate all the support from the forums, big and
small. And all the help from readers..Ed

Ed
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Last edited by HUBEL458; May 29, 2011 at 11:30 PM.
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Old June 9, 2011, 08:16 AM   #618
HUBEL458
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You know of the 4 bore we did on falling block,
with its 1 inch bore.Using turned cases and cases
made from 20mm brass. Our cases have a rim and
straight sides. A smith in the EU made a 1 inch bore
gun on a bolt action, using 20mm brass expanded
to take 1 inch bullets. His case has a shoulder to
head space on. It is called the Inch Gun by some.
It is a really nice looking gun, with great
craftsmanship.Ed
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Old June 9, 2011, 08:46 AM   #619
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Hope it is as stout as its good looks. That is one nice looking gun.
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Old June 9, 2011, 09:13 AM   #620
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Very nice work,however I did not read the whole thread but what type of game would this firearm likely take out real fast effectively with one shot or two. A large adult elephant? seriously tho. Thanks
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Old June 9, 2011, 01:32 PM   #621
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These big bores would be stoppers for elephant,
rhino, and African buffalo.Our 1 inch 4bore with
top loads has a Taylor KO of about 600.Ed
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Old June 9, 2011, 10:14 PM   #622
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I've got a nosebleed and a dislocated shoulder just looking at those things. Any pics of you actually firing them? Or are there some somewhere in this long thread?
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Old June 10, 2011, 01:15 AM   #623
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Youtube videos of 12ga FH atomizing 6 gal sealed pail
of water. Called 'Grandpa's Cannon' and "Grandpa's
First Shot". In these I shot at the pail from my bench.Ed
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Old June 10, 2011, 02:21 AM   #624
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I've been following this thread for 3 years. I still think you're crazy.

I was going to ask if the 12 ga FH participants making jackets from plumbing caps were annealing the jackets, but realized a lead hot-pour will take care of that. It would probably make the forming process easier, though.

Keep up the good work. We all enjoy the updates.
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Old June 10, 2011, 11:47 AM   #625
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The guys never mentioned annealing.
They are soft enough that I formed a nose
on one with rounded punch and a hole in
a steel block. Ed
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