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Old January 27, 2006, 10:21 AM   #26
nscale
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You are giving law abiding concealed carry license holders a bad name. If you're going to break the law, at least don't brag about it in a public place.

peeweester40,
You are absolutly correct, I have made a choice to break the law. I dont see how my choice to do so reflects on law abiding concealed carry license holders , but I will go along with your statement above.
I am sorry for the loss of your friend and I totally agree the person was breaking the law driving, regardless of why he lost his license.

I will say this, and it is not my objective to incite you or anyone else. I carry this weapon because I have seen and been expossed to crimes that may have had different outcomes if a good guy was armed.
For me, my decision to carry is based on a moral decision to prevent myself, my family or any innocent from being harmed.

Yes I will use my weapon to protect my life, yours or your childs, whether I can carry legally or not.

Personnaly, I am prepared to spend a life in prison if my actions save the life of one child. So come to my trial and feel free to tell the jury "The guy with bad credit may not legally carry a gun"

This was my point with my States Law. But as you pointed out. It is still the Law.
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Old January 27, 2006, 06:39 PM   #27
tegemu
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Doug.38PR, your point is well taken and agreed with. However the original post spoke of waiting 30 minutes one time and then another time,waiting 10 minutes for a lady and when she left there was a man shuffling papers on the other side of where she had been. When he "went in or whatever" there was someone on the other side of the poster's car. after that the coast was apparently clear. I feel certain that I could have pulled away a short distance, removed my gun, re-parked and then have been inside the Courthouse before all of this time had elapsed.
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Old January 27, 2006, 10:21 PM   #28
snolden
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I really am not a troll. Despite my low post count, I feel the need to interject here. There is a constitution here in the US. That includes the 2nd amendment which states the "people". This guy that you are putting down is a "people". Just because the government decided to limit the "people" unconstitutionally doesn't mean that we are deprived of the right to bear arms. This is a god given, inherent right of all of us.

It is smarter to have a permit (I do now, but not until I carried for many years without one) in case you have to defend yourself in court. It was not a good idea for nscale to tell us as now he has exposed himself but it is not the place of any of you to deprive nscale of the right to bear arms. If I were to live in Washington D.C., Chicago, LA, New York City and other soviet republics I would still retain the right to bear arms. It is a right, not a privilege to be granted by the government.

Please remember that and that you should not pass judgement on your fellow man.
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Old January 28, 2006, 01:02 AM   #29
nscale
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The Lone Star State

TexasSIGMan said it
"Non gun people just don't see a gun, even if it's right there. Their brain tells them "that can't possibly be a gun, you have made a mistake".
If it's only a glimpse, they will shrug it off and move along. I've had many occasion where I just KNEW everyone could see, and I didn't even get a second look."

My original response to the topic of this thread was really to make the point that where I live people really don't take notice when they see a weapon as TexasSIGMan stated above. Maybe this is only typical in Texas?

In regard to my permit status, I had no idea the mention of it would incite such strong oppinions. I do however, appreciate the fact that we are all at liberty to state our oppinions. "NO WHERE BUT AMERICA".

I am glad there are folks like snolden who make a decision to carry a weapon, not based on his state laws requirements, but based on his conviction to protect himself, his family and other innocents from those that may do them harm. I applaud snolden for his willingness to comply with his state laws and I am happy he qualified for a permit. But, as he stated it is his right to carry either way.

I also appreciate the support from Doug.38pr and would hope that if ever I find myself being tried by a jury of my peers for using my weapon, a person like Doug would give me the benefit of the doubt.

But most of all I have to say, the strong oppinion of Peeweester40 has humbled me. While the reason I carry, is in my oppinion, right and justified, I should not consider myself above the laws of my state. Lets face it, we all carry our weapons to protect ourselves from people who have decided to break the laws of our land.

So where does this leave me?
I will be more discrete, but I will stay armed.
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Old January 28, 2006, 01:19 AM   #30
BigFunWMU
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Nscale

Discretion is crucial to carrying concealed, permit or no. Your first post in this thread stating how your gun is often exposed, does raise some concern.

My concern is not in based on the fact that you do carry, it is the method that you go about it. The whole point of a concealed firearm is that nobody can see it. Even without a permit, a gun that nobody sees will cause much less trouble than one that is visible. I'm glad you are planning to take steps conceal better.

I wish you the best of luck in getting a permit in the future,
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Last edited by BigFunWMU; January 28, 2006 at 02:59 AM.
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Old January 28, 2006, 02:01 AM   #31
czc3513
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Quote:
Authority is artificial.
It is NOT a higher power.
You CAN resist opposition.
Life is anarchy.
I believe that we have the natural right to defend ourselves in any way that we see fit.

I do not have a packing permit.
I have said that I have packed but I have not said that I have packed outside of my home.

I find it hard to believe that all of you with a permit had not packed before you got the permit.
So you went through all of the trouble of getting a permit before you even knew what it was like to carry?

This thread will probably be closed/locked because posts are off topic and involve illegal activities. So into history/oblivion we go!
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Old January 28, 2006, 02:03 AM   #32
czc3513
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O...
And I take my gun off in the car all the time.
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Old January 28, 2006, 02:58 AM   #33
BigFunWMU
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So the topic sticks, since it is a good one....

I leave mine on in my truck, unless I'm going into a gun free zone (police station, courthouse, college campus buildings).

Then I ususally pull the gun, holster and all, while still in the truck, and lock it in the center console. I also make extra sure my doors are locked. I actually got the kind of holster I did in order to make it easier to remove the gun while in the holster and put it somewhere for safe keeping.

And I did carry around my own house before I got my permit, but I didn't take that show on the road.
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Old January 29, 2006, 04:43 PM   #34
Doug.38PR
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Quote:
I find it hard to believe that all of you with a permit had not packed before you got the permit.
I'll admit once or twice I loaded my .38 up driving across town back home late at night a few times before I got my permit. Who wouldn't? I loaded up once driving from Carthage to Houston late one night about midnight (but actually I found out later that was perfectly legal as I was traveling between at least 3 counties)

Quote:
It is a right, not a privilege to be granted by the government
Amen!
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Old January 29, 2006, 05:15 PM   #35
Wildalaska
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Personnaly, I am prepared to spend a life in prison if my actions save the life of one child. So come to my trial and feel free to tell the jury "The guy with bad credit may not legally carry a gun"
Oh give me a break, if you were such a firm believer in your right to keep and bear arms and how the carrying of firearms prevents crime you wouldnt be doing it surreptitiously...be proud..you're prepared to spend the rest of your life in prison on an "if come"? Show em whose boss, call the press, conceal your gun, tell the press and police , take it to court!!! Change the law, save potentially hundreds of lives!

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Old January 29, 2006, 05:20 PM   #36
teejhot.40cal
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This may sound odd but just pretend like you are supposed to have it (which you are) if people see you trying to hide it they would probably report you. If you just put it in your glove box like you would when no one is looking, people might think you are a cop or in the military unless they know u personally. People know an average person wouldn't do that so u would have to be a cop or sumone that is suppose to have it. I know it sounds crazy but it is true.
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Old January 29, 2006, 05:49 PM   #37
nscale
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wildalaska
Will you finance this activity?
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Old January 29, 2006, 06:24 PM   #38
woodland
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In the court house here, they have the metal detectors, and they tag and keep anything not allowed until you come out. I just leave the gun locked in the rig, and leave my holster on. I have a Suburban, so not many can see in from their cars, and pulling from the holster and locking in the center console is not even noticable anyway. I always pull the mag and take it with me. I put it in the tray with keys, cel phone, etc. before going through the detector. They just ask "do you have a weapon?" and I say "It's in my truck. I just don't like to leave a loaded weapon unattended ." They say "OK" and seal it in an envelope with my name on it, and that's it. No big deal.
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Old January 29, 2006, 06:32 PM   #39
Wildalaska
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Quote:
Will you finance this activity?
Money comes before principles?

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Old January 29, 2006, 06:45 PM   #40
Doug.38PR
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Quote:
In the court house here, they have the metal detectors, and they tag and keep anything not allowed until you come out. I just leave the gun locked in the rig, and leave my holster on. I have a Suburban, so not many can see in from their cars, and pulling from the holster and locking in the center console is not even noticable anyway. I always pull the mag and take it with me. I put it in the tray with keys, cel phone, etc. before going through the detector. They just ask "do you have a weapon?" and I say "It's in my truck. I just don't like to leave a loaded weapon unattended ." They say "OK" and seal it in an envelope with my name on it, and that's it. No big deal.
Most of the courthouses I go into don't have metal detectors and all that garbage, so if it is a shoulder holster, I just take it and my speedloaders in while removing the gun and locking it in the car.
However, if it does have metal detectors then the only problem I have with doing what you do is that it causes attention to you and anyone around knows there is a free gun to be had in your car if they can break in and get to it.
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Old January 29, 2006, 08:00 PM   #41
Peeweester40
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Quote:
I find it hard to believe that all of you with a permit had not packed before you got the permit.
Well believe it. If I didn't intend to comply with the law, I wouldn't have bothered to get a permit. I did however carry in my vehicle prior, with my pistol "securely encased" as the law states, which is legal in Florida.

Quote:
So you went through all of the trouble of getting a permit before you even knew what it was like to carry?
Precisely. I wouldn't however, consider it "trouble" to go through the process of getting a permit. It was done all in one afternoon at a gun show. I found it quite informative and to the point. The worst part was having my mug shot taken.
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Old January 29, 2006, 09:55 PM   #42
nscale
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Money comes before principles?

By asking I assume your answer to this question would be "No". So that must be a yes to my original question. Principles before Your money?
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Old January 29, 2006, 10:38 PM   #43
swmike
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Not only do I remove my weapon when parked, I have even been known to change my pants in my car.

I was scheduled to testify as an expert wittness in Federal Court one year. I went to the courthouse about 20 minutes before I was scheduled. Off came the belt and holster (which was then locked in the console) and then the jeans. On with the slacks and belt, all with people wandering around the parking lot. Nobody really cares.

Went in, testified, came out, changed and re-armed again. No issue. BTW, I didn't park right by the elevator, I did go to the end of a row.
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Old January 30, 2006, 12:01 AM   #44
riverrat66
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Quote:
I find it hard to believe that all of you with a permit had not packed before you got the permit.
Actually it's illegal to purchase a handgun in New York State without a pistol permit so there would be no way to carry before receiving one's permit. Also an illegal handgun calls for a mandatory one year prison term.

I just remove my firearm when I park and use a magazine or hat, if need be, to cover it as I put it in the glove box or console. Yep, and I've also changed my pants in the truck.
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Old January 30, 2006, 04:16 AM   #45
czc3513
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Quote:
Precisely. I wouldn't however, consider it "trouble" to go through the process of getting a permit. It was done all in one afternoon at a gun show. I found it quite informative and to the point. The worst part was having my mug shot taken.
I didnt know that it was that easy to get a permit.
It seems like I have read about it taking over a month.
Maybe I was thinking about a full auto or silencer permit.
Do you agree with the 21 min age requirement?
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Old January 30, 2006, 09:10 AM   #46
invention_45
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Courthouse faux pas

Hello, y'all. My first post. I had to register just to tell you all this one.

About 3 years ago I had to go to the Broward County Courthouse. At the time I had a Beretta 8045 (that I REALLY REALLY liked) and, of course, a CCL.

My practice, at the time, when going to places I knew disallowed CC was to unload the gun and lock it in the glove box. I figured better to come back and find a BG departing with it unloaded than loaded. So, of course, I'd put the clip in my back pocket and go about my business.

I was getting a RO, and the procedure is so that you go twice during the day (unless you want to wait there two hours, and it's not that entertaining of a place). First trip, I went in the main entrance downstairs. Empty all the metal stuff from my pockets, including the clip. Some official or another sees the clip in the little plastic bin on the x-ray belt and grabs it. He says I can't take it into the courthouse, but he'll bag it for me and I can pick it up at this little stand where two deputies watch the lobby.

I get my business done and go to that stand, and, sure enough, I get my clip back.

That afternoon, I go to pick up the TRO. Instead of going downstairs (the parking garage was fuller, so I was upstairs instead of ground floor), I took the 2nd floor flyover to get to the courthouse. There I found another entrance inspection station.

I know the drill, so I empty my pockets. Suddenly, lots of eyebrows go up and a deputy approaches me, takes the clip, and asks "what is this?". I ask him if he can hold it for me while I'm inside and says he most certainly cannot. I explain that that had been done earlier. As we're talking, more deputies show up and are chattering about the situation. One leaves.

After a minute it is explained that I'll have to take it back to my car. So I'm putting all my stuff back in my pockets and as I'm about to start walking back to the garage, the deputy who left returns.

He stops me and says he knows why I was allowed to have my clip stored earlier. The guys downstairs simply assumed I was in law enforcement.

Most of the guys present found it good for a laugh. But I did have to leave the clip in the car.

Another time I went to a nightclub. I followed the same practice, separate the gun/clip with the latter in my rear pocket. At the door they were patting everyone down, for drugs, I guess. The lady doing the patting touches the clip and asks "what's this?" I answer "it's my clip". She didn't even ask to see it. Maybe she thought I meant money clip. I was allowed in with it.
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Old January 30, 2006, 02:33 PM   #47
Mikeyboy
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As long as it's not a bunch of teens or someone who looks like they will break into your vehicle while your gone, I don't care. Your being paranoid, if you do it in one easy motion, they probably would have no idea what your doing.
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Old January 30, 2006, 03:26 PM   #48
riverrat66
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Quote:
Peeweester40 sez:
Precisely. I wouldn't however, consider it "trouble" to go through the process of getting a permit. It was done all in one afternoon at a gun show. I found it quite informative and to the point. The worst part was having my mug shot taken.
Quote:
czc3513 sez:
I didn't know that it was that easy to get a permit.
It seems like I have read about it taking over a month.
Maybe I was thinking about a full auto or silencer permit.
Do you agree with the 21 min age requirement?
I don't mean to get off topic but you guys are fortunate. I've carried for 30 years and it took me 7 months to get my CCW permit and then only after hours of safety classes, references, interviews, fingerprints, pictures, background checks, both local and federal and approximately $200. Also if I want to purchase a handgun I must show my permit at time of purchase and then I have 10 days to report to the pistol permit office where they record the Make, Model & Serial Number in their files also recording it on the back of my permit. In other words, they have a list of every handgun that I own, complete with serial numbers. They even charge a fee to "register" that handgun! My permit is "good until revoked" or until they see fit to take it and all my handguns with it. After all they have a complete list of each and every one of them. You talk about someones rights being trampled! In New York State they consider it a privilege not a right to own a firearm.
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Old January 30, 2006, 03:38 PM   #49
Doug.38PR
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Hello Invention_45,
Welcome to The Firingline. Wow, quite a story about your clip. I didn't know it was illegal to carry around ammunition in Florida. In Texas there is no law against it (unless you are in an airport where it is considered an "explosive"), but I just leave my speedloaders or clip in the car just to avoid attention when metal detectors and all that junk are involved.
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Old January 30, 2006, 08:04 PM   #50
Peeweester40
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Quote:
I didnt know that it was that easy to get a permit.
It seems like I have read about it taking over a month.
Maybe I was thinking about a full auto or silencer permit.
Do you agree with the 21 min age requirement?
I had fullfilled all of my requirements in one afternoon. After having my picture taken and leaving the CCW class, I had to go to the police station to get fingerprinted. I think Florida has to issue (with correct and clean applications) within 90 days of receipt of CCW issue info. I recieved mine in about 40 days. I absoluetly agree with the 21 minimum age requirement. I just wish it were required for marriage too.
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