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Old January 17, 2006, 02:36 PM   #1
beardking
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Titegroup and .45 ACP

Do any of you have any experience with useing Titegroup for your .45's? I just recently purchased a Springfield Ultra Compact and I will be reloading for it soon and already have Titegroup that I use for my .40 and would like to keep the supply variety down just to make reloading easier.

Also, what is a typical practice ammo size for your FMJ bullets? I bought a few Ranier 230g FMJ's but now I'm thinking maybe I should look into a light bullet just to make range sessions a little more pleasant.

Thanks in advance.
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Old January 17, 2006, 03:19 PM   #2
knightkrawler00
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I've used TG with the Ranier 230's, accurate and pleasant to shoot. I shoot a lot of 200gr. LSWC's and like the recoil of the lighter bullet better, it's just a bit snappier. I never liked TG with cast bullets, it burns fairly hot and leads faster than others.
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Old January 17, 2006, 03:36 PM   #3
Zak Smith
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I've shot many thousands of 200gr PRN's with 5.1gr. TG. About 170PF.
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Old January 17, 2006, 06:07 PM   #4
Dave R
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I use 5.2gr of TiteGroup under a 200gr. Laser Cast bullet. I do get a little leading, but it cleans out pretty easy. Very accurate.
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Old January 17, 2006, 06:09 PM   #5
HSMITH
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I have used it too. It works good but there are two things I don't like about it. One, it is HOT, it puts more heat into the gun than anything else I have ever used. Practice session pace is often dictated by the heat put into the gun, it gets so hot it concerns me. Two, it feels a little sharper than Clays or Bullseye.

Accuracy was fine and all of that, but I don't use it in 45 anymore. As soon as I find something better I won't be using it in 40 anymore either, but it works really well in 40 and won't be easy to replace.
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Old January 17, 2006, 06:29 PM   #6
DeltaWhiskey
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I've used it with Berry's Plated 200 grain SWCHP anf been very happy with the results, the charge used was 5.1 grains. I haven't noticed the heat that HSMITH has, but I have noticed the snappier recoil that he has spoke of.
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Old January 17, 2006, 06:52 PM   #7
Morgan
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4.7 gr under a Montana Gold 230gr ball gives 169pf at 735 fps.
5.1 gr under a Montana Gold 200gr JFP gives 167pf at 835 fps.

The 230gr is extremely soft shooting, so much so that I feel the recoil is too sluggish for IPSC, though it cycles fine and is a dream to shoot. The 200 gr cycles briskly, with soft recoil - a fantastic load.
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Old January 18, 2006, 12:02 PM   #8
beardking
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Thanks everyone for the responses. That's the kind of info a guy needs. I have to say that I've never really noticed the heat issue in my .40 using TG, but then again, all I've ever loaded with is TG so I don't really have anything to compare to except Blazer Brass factory ammo. I'll have to pay attention next time I go.
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Old January 18, 2006, 07:37 PM   #9
badaceds650
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best powder ever

percision cast 45 200 grs lrnfp with 5.0 grs tit grp and fed lp primer
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Old January 18, 2006, 08:29 PM   #10
Gary H
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Great powder for all but lead. I've tried it with many different manufacturers 230gr and 200gr lead bullets. TG really leads up the barrel in all of my .45 ACP pistols... all two of them...I have yet to shoot my newest 1911.
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Old January 18, 2006, 11:03 PM   #11
beardking
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Gary, I don't know if it was the TG or the bullets, but I know when I tried some Oregon Trail cast lead with TG in my CZ75 .40 I was much less than pleased with the amount of leading that was going on. In fact, I have since found another use for the remain 450 bullets that I had left over (they do a good job of keeping the clothes hamper right side up, no matter how hard the cats try to stop that). I've pretty much sworn off cast lead for my uses. Too messy and plated isn't much (if any) more.
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Old January 19, 2006, 12:19 PM   #12
Gary H
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It seems that leading and TG go together. I'm currently in a reloading hiatus. I built a structure in my back yard to house my reloading stuff. Wife wanted it out of the house. I've yet to finish the interior of the reloading shed. So, my information is out of date. I was considering trying Ramshot True Blue, or Winchester WST. Otherwise, TG is comfortable to shoot, reasonable flash and moderately clean.
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Old January 19, 2006, 05:37 PM   #13
HSMITH
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If you like the performance of TG but want to use lead bullets try some Unique, about the same speed (a little slower but not much) and the powder least likely to contribute to leading on the planet.

TG has a very high nitroglycerine content, and as a result a very high flame temp. That is why you see the leading with TG.
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Old January 19, 2006, 08:50 PM   #14
mapwd
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I use Titegroup and 230 gr. LRN bullets. I never had a problem with leading while using Miester hardcast bullets. I switched to a local supplier of cast bullets and they lead horribly. I never thought it could be the powder. Will using spray on molly lube help stop this?
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Old January 19, 2006, 10:21 PM   #15
HSMITH
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Mapwd, I don't like moly for reasons I won't go into in this thread.......

Before I forget, what brand bullet are you buying locally? I am about 50 miles east of you and have tried most if not all the local bullets...

I have used Lee Liquid Alox in the past to help lower leading with poor commercial cast bullets. It works pretty well with most loads and most powders. It is fairly messy to reload bullets with it unless you apply it right. A search on my username and liquid alox should turn up application info, if not shoot me an email or PM.

In reality the problem you run into in 45 acp most of the time isn't bullets that are too soft, you run into hard bullets with poor lube and that is where the leading comes from. 45 struggles to make enough pressure for the hard lubes to flow, the blue crayon stuff talked about in this thread is a good example.

What I mean by flow is that pressure in the barrel makes its way into the lube groove on the bullet. This pressure forces the lube to flow out of the groove in between the bullet and the barrel. Heat is also a small component but it is nearly all pressure that gets the lube in between the bullet and the bore where it is needed. The lube coats the barrel when it works right, and the lead vaporized from the base sits on top/in the lube to be pushed out with the next round.

For some reason Tite-Group, Universal and a couple other powders will show leading when a simple switch to another powder will eliminate it. I don't fully understand the mechanism for this, but time and again it has been apparent. These two powders also smoke more with cast bullets than powders that don't show the leading.
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Old January 20, 2006, 12:27 AM   #16
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tight group has been working ok with my 230gr hand cast bullets. leading is'nt to bad
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Old January 22, 2006, 12:13 PM   #17
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or

45 Acp = W231
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Old January 23, 2006, 01:32 PM   #18
Rico567
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I have found Titegroup to be quite accurate and very reliable in .45 ACP, in either a 1911 or a G21. However, if there are things you don't like about it, I can also recommend either 231 or Clays. I used 231 for many years, and only switched to Clays because it has a softer recoil.

In .40, if you're looking to switch from Titegroup, try Hodgdon's Universal. All the virtues of Unique, not the dirtiness. Universal is my powder of choice in .40 S&W, 165 gr. Rainier FP.
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Old January 23, 2006, 01:59 PM   #19
beardking
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Actually, I really am quite partial to Titegroup. To me it seems to be quite clean, efficient (I don't get much if any unburned powder), and because of the charge sizes, quite cost effect. I load 4.4 grains of TG with 180 gr plated bullets for my .40 and at this rate, I'll be able to get almost 2K rounds out of a single 1 pound canister, and looking at the loads for .45, it should be about the same for them. Of course, I haven't tried any other powders yet, so I don't really have much to compare to.
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Old January 23, 2006, 02:15 PM   #20
Poodleshooter
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Quote:
For some reason Tite-Group, Universal and a couple other powders will show leading when a simple switch to another powder will eliminate it.
I've wondered about that. I'm getting less overall cleaning effort since switching back to Unique loads in my handguns. Soot just wipes off, but lead has to be brushed out. I'll take the soot.
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Old January 23, 2006, 02:55 PM   #21
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Yeah, I've found unique works the best with lead in .45.......
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