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Old January 15, 2006, 02:11 PM   #1
dfaugh
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Non-firing "full auto" replicas

because of the abundance of cheap "parts kits" out there (and the fact that I'll probably never be able to afford any full auto guns, and could't in my current state of residence anyway) I was thinking it might still be kinda neat to have some "non-firing replicas" to hang on the wall, etc.

What I was thinking, was to get some of the ones that include a "torch cut" receiver, and breaking out with the welder. Carefully weld receiver back together (obviously unsafe it you ever wanted to fire it), and doing whatever else need to be done to make it "legal".

The question is, what needs to be done to make it legal. I would like it to appear like the original(for example allow the bolt to move), but was thinking you could remove most of the FCG, weld up the firing pin hole, weld up the breech end of the barrel, maybe weld the magazine so its can't be loaded, then weld it to the gun?

Any one know the applicable statute for something like this? Does the BATF have some standard for "non firing replicas"?
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Old January 15, 2006, 05:05 PM   #2
Dust_Devil
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I often look at those machineguns that are demilitarized and sold as collectors items for a few hundred dollars and ask myself why people would spend that much money for a firearm that doesn't work at all.
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Old January 15, 2006, 11:53 PM   #3
Dave Haven
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Because it looks really COOOOOL?:shrug:
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Old January 16, 2006, 07:52 AM   #4
dfaugh
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I wouldn't spend alot of money on one either, but the parts kits I'm talking about are $150 or less. Then it just "hobby time" to put them together.
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Time is running out...Let's roll.
Let's roll for freedom, let's roll for love.
We're going after satan, on the wings of a dove.
Let's roll for freedom, let's roll for truth.
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Old January 16, 2006, 11:02 AM   #5
shaggy
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There are no specific rules for how to make a non-gun, but it cannot be "readily restored " to fire again. There is speculation as to what is meant by the "readily restored" language in the statute, but keep in mind BATFE has a fully equipped machine shop in which to work and determine if what you have done is "readily restored ".

I would definitely stay away from rewelding any torch or saw receiver that came in such a kit. Rewelding of cut receivers is often used to make post-sample weapons for demo use from those kits. Even some transferables are re-welds. While you may think it is unsafe to fire like that, I have seen re-welded MG42s, HK21s, M60s (rewelded trunion), M16s, AKs, and various subguns. Even with re-welded receivers (or receiver parts) they all functioned fine.

Welding up the breech end of the barrel might be good, if done in conjunction with other methods, but alone it is far from enough. Many registered DEWATs simply have welded up barrels. A DEWAT, however, is still registered under the NFA, and can legally be converted back to live status.

Welding the mag in place is also a good idea, if used in conjunction with other methods. I would also consider welding up the trigger group/fire control parts so it is not functional and then welding the trigger group to the receiver so it cannot be changed out with a working one.

I am no expert on this, but if you are thinking about somre sort of 'tube gun' like a sten, sterling, Port Said, etc. I would feel fairly safe making a dummy gun with the following features:

1. Make a dummy receiver with no holes or access in the receiver for the fire control parts to come in contact with the bolt or anything inside the receiver. Basically make a tube with only a slot for the cocking handle, hole for the mag, and an ejection port - no access for a hammer, sear or other parts from the trigger group to contact the bolt.

2. Disable the trigger group by welding up or removing some parts inside and then weld the disabled trigger group to the dummy receiver. For example maybe keep the trigger and trigger spring (so you can pull the trigger), but there would be no need to have parts like a sear, hammer, disconnector.

3. Weld up the firing pin holt on the bolt.

4. Weld up the receiver so the bolt and other internal parts cannot be removed and replaced with working parts.

5. Weld up the barrel.

6. Weld the mag in place.

I may be going a bit overboard with all these precautions, but better to be safe than sorry.
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Old January 17, 2006, 06:49 PM   #6
OneInTheChamber
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Buy an airsoft gun. You can get a full metal gun (just like the real thing) for $400 that shoots plastic bb's accurately out to about 50 ft. in semi,burst-or full auto

www.classicarmy.com

or

www.patriotairsoft.com if you want plastic guns that cost less and still really fun to play with. $10-50 range. The owner is a friend of mine and is really good to his customers.

Chase
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Old February 15, 2006, 06:36 PM   #7
gdm
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there are fakes already made,all metal ones that cost around 150 bucks.I saw a fake 1927a1 deluxe model with the fake 100 rnd drum that you could detach, the trigger worked,bolt slammed shut.identical to real deal cept couldnt chamber or fire live ammo.

some time ago, an uzi was offered as a kit for around 100 bucks, it fired blanks only.you had to assemble it,worked semi or full,identical externally but again, would not chamber 9,45 ammo...used special blanks.saw one on the net for sale..a bit pricy for one missing the special blanks.theres mac copies that shoot paintballs and theyre made out of plastic but these are also pricy,they were made in canada.


there is a fake receiver that fits real ak kits....fake bolt and the parts just slide on.I think cheap than dirt had these.


airsoft as mentioned...there is also a stage prop company on the net that sells movie guns that feed blanks,kinda pricy but fun none the less.
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Old February 15, 2006, 07:42 PM   #8
WillBrayjr
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Check out: www.airsoftmadness.com They have all sorts of blank firing replicas. Your best bet though is airsoft, I can't complain.
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