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Old December 3, 2005, 12:51 PM   #1
C Philip
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My college wants its students to be easy victims.

Another student at my college was attacked recently (yes, it has happened before, more than once). He was walking on campus when he was knocked down by two other guys (not other college students). They demanded all his money, but he resisted and they ran off. (the college news letter didn't say how he resisted) Anyway, in the same news letter the college gives some suggestions to other students, two of these especially made me very angry.

1) Don't resist, your stuff isn't worth getting hurt.
2) Don't carry weapons, they could be used against you.

If students follow this, they are just making themselves easy targets! Guns are not allowed on my campus, but I do carry pepper spray, and am thinking about getting a ASP or Monadnock baton. I think that with proper training you greatly reduce the chances of your weapon being used against you. Any other thoughts on this situation?
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Old December 3, 2005, 12:59 PM   #2
Eghad
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If you are having problems on campus try to go places in pairs or groups. Also if it gets bad organize a student watch group with volunteers. On a local campus that was done and students could call for escorts. The criminal is only going to take what you give him. The University PD even gave them radios to call in and report. A criminal is going to migrate to somewhere else where it is safe for him to do business.
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Old December 3, 2005, 07:46 PM   #3
SamD
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C Phillip,
I suggest that you do what college students everywhere are famous for.
Stage a demonstration and get the school to change their rules on carry and their suck up to crooks policy.

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Old December 3, 2005, 07:55 PM   #4
Limeyfellow
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On almost every educational facilities in the US carrying weapons is illegal. In many states batons are more illegal to carry than guns. In NC its a good way of getting the sheriff to shoot you for instance.

Not resisting a robbery attempt has been advise for decades. Resisting can easily get you killed as seen ample time when shopowners get killed (we had 20 deaths from resisting in town this year alone). Its nothing new and has probrobly done more help than bad, especially with people caught up in crossfire.
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Old December 3, 2005, 08:04 PM   #5
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Resisting may get you killed, so can slipping in the tub.
Failing to resisit evil if you have ANY capability at all is morally wrong.

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Old December 3, 2005, 11:55 PM   #6
exoduster16
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Your college wants you to be a victim to? Hmmmm, so does mine....

What the odds of both of them wanting us to be victims?
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Old December 4, 2005, 12:31 AM   #7
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Hmmm. That makes three of us. I think I'm seeing a trend. :barf:
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Old December 4, 2005, 07:01 AM   #8
BlueTrain
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My daughter is in college now and my son spent some time in another school before deciding he wanted to try the army. But I was surprised in the campus visits how much the schools emphasized security, if not safety. That was totally absent when I was in school in the late '60's, which is surprising considering how much real rioting there was going on around the country.

What is even funnier, when I think about it, is that I had a closet full of guns even then, which were all Lee-Enfields plus an FN-49, was that my (off-campus) room overlooked the football stadium.

Personally, I always thought all comments from anyone to the effect that you should never resist, sounded pretty hollow.
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Old December 4, 2005, 01:27 PM   #9
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north of campus is a ghetto where kids get mugged, sometimes it spills down, on campus is just as bad with the officially sanctioned gangs (fraternities). there were a rash of rapes last year over the course of about a couple months. saw an ugly fight last night where some goons just smacked the hell out of some poor guy who was too drunk to defend himself. not much i could do. doesn't matter what kind of shape i'm in, i'll never be a linebacker. it is sad how universities explicitly prevent people from attempting to gain some leverage for their own safety. just keeping your head down isn't enough.
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Old December 4, 2005, 01:47 PM   #10
CanoeCrasher
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Another one

My school prefers me unarmed as well. Its not like downtown Atlanta is dangerous or anything...
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Old December 4, 2005, 06:43 PM   #11
exoduster16
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Oh, the schools emphasize safety and security. However, if you do take a proactive approach and do practice security and safety and are not going to let yourself become a victim.....then, well, they look down upon that.

You're damned if you do and damned if you don't. College is cool and all, but I don't like the fact that they want us to be victims and then tell us all that we need to practice security and safety.

It sucks.....
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Old December 4, 2005, 08:23 PM   #12
Mike in VA
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Way back when I was in school with Fred & Barney, my school also had a policy against weapons on campus. I only got rolled once before I started carrying a bar of soap in a sock. Fits nicely in a jacket pocket, fast and easy to deploy, and worked real good for calming bullies down. Bibbidy-bobbidy-thunk!
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Old December 4, 2005, 08:27 PM   #13
C Philip
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The bar of soap in the sock is called a "jailhouse blackjack" and is an illegal weapon in many states since it's a type of makeshift blackjack/sandbag.
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Old December 4, 2005, 09:46 PM   #14
progunner1957
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Quote:
Your college wants you to be a victim to? Hmmmm, so does mine....
90 to 95% of colleges and universities in America are controlled by leftist/liberal/Democrat/socialist "intellectuals.":barf:

They don't give a rat's sphincter about how many students are raped, robbed or beaten half to death as long as the institution does not get sued by the victims - and as long as the socialist anti-gun party line is preached by the institution and submitted to by the sheeple (sorry, I meant students).

It appears that in the view of those that run the "institutions of higher learning" that rape, robbery and beatings are to be accepted as part of college life by the students.

This is evidenced by the fact that these crimes - all felonies, by the way - are overwhelmingly ignored or covered up by those running the universities. After all, they can't have negative publicity cutting into their revenue and shattering the image of campus as island of leftist/liberal/Democrat/socialist utopia.

Bottom line - the university can't/won't provide for your safety. In that regard, you are on your own. If you are serious about your personal safety, you must say "f" the university's rules and provide for your safety by any and all means necessary.

If you choose to submit to being an unarmed victim, they can engrave your headstone with, "He/she died for a noble leftist/socialist ideal - unarmed victimhood."
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Old December 4, 2005, 09:47 PM   #15
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I would seek out someone to show some real self defense stuff to the students. Nothing ever comes from just thinking "don't do anything". If you want to be safe, you have to do something about it. I approached a college in my area last year after there were MULTIPLE attacks on students. I offered to do a free seminar and then very inexpensive follow up sessions. (I mean VERY) and their solution was to offer 'rape whistles' to anyone that requested them. After hearing that, I went directly to the students. I held a seminar off campus and got 57 students. I held three more that month. The attendance went up each time. I am still working with students a year later, the interest was so great. I inquired to a few of them and they said that they could not believe the collegs did not offer anything like a class, just a friggin whistle. keep trying. You'll find something that works. if you are in the WNY area, email me and I can set something up for you.
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Old December 5, 2005, 11:55 AM   #16
Pistolenschutze
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As a college instructor I can only say this: Like most schools, the college where I teach has a rule about no firearms on campus. Interestingly enough, the state law for CCW does not forbid a weapon on a college campus, only on a K-12 campus. The law also states explicitly that it is legal to have a gun in your locked vehicle while on any school campus, assuming one has a CCW. My own rule is simple: When I teach a night course (sometimes not getting out until after 9:00 PM), I always carry my .32 Beretta in either a pocket holster or a below-the-belt-line rig under my shirt. Parking lots are one of the most dangerous places one can be after dark, according to the stats I've seen. Many of my student know I have a CCW and quite a number of them (largely females) have approached me about how to apply for one, which shows how much concern there is over this issue.
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Old December 5, 2005, 12:21 PM   #17
root
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I go to school in colorado and from what I understand Pistolenschutze is right about our laws. Although, I wouldn't carry since my campus is patrolled by colorado springs PD - very anti-gun. The police do offer a self-defense class each semester which usually consists of maneuvers to hurt an assailant long enough to run away.
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Old December 5, 2005, 02:17 PM   #18
claude783
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Rather than the bar of soap, carry some "change" in the sock. If stopped, you were using it to purchase food, gas, soda, basic survival as your a poor college student and this is all the money you have...why in the sock, to much to carry in the pockets and it tears a hole in the pocket.

Wify-poo works at a college, no knives, so always get a little paranoid when I go over to take her out to lunch...however, I am furnished "steel-toed" boots, shoes from the company I work for, so haven't purchased shoes in 10 years, but a good swift kick into a shin bone with a steel toed book/shoe should show some reaction...
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Old December 5, 2005, 02:24 PM   #19
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claude783, i do the same thing. i also carry a small maglite on my left side of my belt. i know how to defend myself with the flash light. itis about 6 inches. never leave home without it. i have used it for self defence many times. i have also deflected a knife with it.

ever since the time change i get out of class and it is dark. need light.
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Old December 5, 2005, 03:00 PM   #20
Mikeyboy
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I don't know why but most colleges are close to bad neighborhoods. In Philadelphia a lot of the big name colleges are bordering some nasty neighborhoods. Temple University (A college which I did a couple of semisters at) actually ranked within the top 10 largest police forces in the state of PA, so they had more police then some small towns, and they needed to be because the Campus was in the heart of North philly, the worst neighborhood in Philadelphia. They too had no weapons policies, however most people carried something. Most crime was theft, I lost one bike and my car got broken into TWICE, in a two year period. I was never mugged, but I got into a fight once with one of the locals, but I was tall and in shape (back then). Unless the guy is unarmed, I'm not going to get into a life or death fight over my college possessions. My wallet back then usually only had a few bucks and no credit cards. If it a simple armed robbery, let him take it, if it's something more (rape, assault. etc) fight for your life.
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Old December 5, 2005, 03:42 PM   #21
Pistolenschutze
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Quote:
Originally Posted by root
I go to school in colorado and from what I understand Pistolenschutze is right about our laws. Although, I wouldn't carry since my campus is patrolled by colorado springs PD - very anti-gun. The police do offer a self-defense class each semester which usually consists of maneuvers to hurt an assailant long enough to run away.
Root, Pike's Peak or UCCS? You are only too right about the cops in the Springs, not to mention the People's Republic of Denver. Fortunately, I live in Canon City which is not so closely supervised by the police. We do have a security guard, but he's an old VN vet like me and doesn't get overly excited about ! guns.
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Old December 5, 2005, 03:56 PM   #22
guntotin_fool
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carry a laptop anti theft cable with a lock on it. make a loop around your wrist and swing away. carry a nice folder knife, call it a tool for work, not a weapon. I went to school in Mn and no one ever asked why a kid had a knife, just assumed all kids did. I carried a pistol to class all the time in grad school in DT mpls. once a couple of girls saw it when i was pulling off a sweat shirt before class, I said, not going to get mugged down here, later that night at break, they asked me to walk them to their cars, I did so for rest of the semester. ended up dating one for a year.
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Old December 5, 2005, 05:28 PM   #23
root
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UCCS, and I suppouse I'm lucky as far as campuses go. Having been to others throughout the country, UCCS is suprisingly well lit everywhere and there's few places where you are more than 50 yards from a call box.
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Old December 5, 2005, 05:38 PM   #24
coolridelude
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you guys have a call box.

man i will my college had one. it is a community college.

some areas are real dark.
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Old December 5, 2005, 05:59 PM   #25
root
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yeah, they built a "path" to some new student housing, there's a huge bright light every 25 yards and a call box every 50. The path is only 350-400 yards long. they just like to spend $$. I think 1 call box would have sufficed
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