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Old November 1, 2005, 09:53 PM   #1
Kiehlroy
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Join Date: November 1, 2005
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Cartridge conversion advice

Hi guys, I need some advice as to which converter would be best for me and my new Pietta 1858 Remmie from Cabelas. I really don't want to have to send it across country to have it fitted. I do know of a smith in my area if it needs a little tuning but it is a new Pietta so I hope they're more standardized these days. Now, I've looked at the Kirst converters and it seems that they have a few options. Of course there is the 5 shot safety cylinder, but they also have a six shot converter for sale at River Junction Trade Co. but it says: "Standard .45 ammunition will not fit the .44 six shot converter" River Juntion does offer a: ".44 Remington 248 Gr. Cartridge with Heeled Bullet Outside Lubricated Smokeless". Now is the reason this converter is .44 and not .45 because it is straight bored and needed the extra room? Or is it angled like the R&D converter? Is angled all that bad? The most important thing to me is that the converter does not loosen up my gun too badly with moderate usage. And that it preforms well on the range. It seems that all options are around $250 so price is not an issue. Thanks for any help guys,

Micah
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Old November 1, 2005, 10:48 PM   #2
Old Dragoon
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I have just purchased a Kirst Konverter in .44 Remington and I did buy a couple boxes of their ammo at River Junction. I have not recieved them yet. RJ is supposed to be carrying just the heeled bullets very soon also.

This is what I know about the original Remington's and the original Conversions in .44CF.

The Original 44 Remington were in actuality .451 bore converted to a 6 shot .44 cf (.451 Heeled, outside lubed)(some in .44RF, and .46 RF) cal cylinder (actually the cylinders, mostly, were the original cylinder with the nipple area machined off down to the pawl and another disc welded, or brazed on and then the chambers were drilled out to hold the .44 CF cartridge. Some were new made cylinders. There is enough meat between the chambers and the O.D. to allow for this.That is why the .44 is a six shot and I do believe the Kirst is a straight thru design. The originals that were converted to 45LC were a new 5 shot due to space between the chambers and the O.D. of the original cylinder controlled that.

The last Original Rem, 1858 Conversion I owned was a factory conversion in 44 CF, 6 shot complete with the ejector. This particular pistol had been issued in the Civil War with inspector marks all over it. It was sent back to the factory (or the S & W factory) for conversion and was nickled at time of conversion. Numbers all matching including the grips. I'm sure it saw action on the frontier also. It looked just like Remingtons advertisements of their factory conversions. Wish now I hadn't sold it. Drats!
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Old November 1, 2005, 10:51 PM   #3
MrAcheson
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You are correct the .44s are straight bored unlike the R&D which have an insignificant angle. R&D holds the patent on the angled bore so Kirst can't use it. No angled isn't bad and it doesn't effect accuracy.

For the .44 guns to shoot properly you need to use the heeled .44 bullets so they will properly grip the rifling on the revolver. If you don't reload, go with a .45 colt conversion. If you do reload, then .44 might be an option but it will still cost you more in the long run.
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Old November 1, 2005, 11:21 PM   #4
Old Dragoon
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I agree with MrAcheson,
If you don't reload go with the 45LC. I went with the .44 Rem. as it is an original caliber. My era is the Cartridge Conversion era before the 45LC was introduced (1873 Peacemaker) or readily available. I wanted to stay true to that...and I have thousands of .44 colt brass, and .44 Rem Mag brass which can be modified for use (Length) and both will accept the heeled bullet. Rim Dia. and thk. on both are almost identical, as are the O.D. of the brass.

River Junction 44 Rem cartridge uses Unique (I think) smokeless in , I would guess 4 grains or less for a cowboy load. Their 38 heeled uses 3.5 gr. Unique.
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Old November 2, 2005, 12:15 AM   #5
Kiehlroy
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Thanks for the replies guys. Since it seems the angle isn't a problem I'm leaning towards the R&D since it is advertised as a drop in without much tooling. Plus you have 6 pins as opposed to one because if that one breaks the whole cylinder is inoperable.
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