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Old October 18, 2005, 05:09 PM   #1
Remington kid
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why not 1875 Remington Out law .45 LC ?

Ask this question on another site so I thought I would see what you folks think.
Don't hear much about this gun but it seems to me that if someone wanted a Remington cartridge revolver ( .45 LC ) this would be the way to go instead of messing up a beautiful 1858 with the cylinder conversion.
I don't know a thing about the 1875 Remington and it may be they just aren't that great but they sure do look good. Now If I can just get my wife to hand me the Visa card, , Mike
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Old October 18, 2005, 07:04 PM   #2
Hafoc
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According to the Brownell's catalog, one of the conversions (at least) is a two-piece drop-in unit. What this means is you load cartridges into the cylinder, put a back plate on it, put the cylinder and back plate into the revolver, and fire away. No further conversion of your 1858 would be required, although I see they have parts to do a more complete job if you wish.

Cartridge conversions are interesting arms from the Old West era, in their own right. I suppose some people just like them. Also, if you already have a Remington 1858 you've had tuned and adjusted, it would be nice to be able to fire cartridges in it as well.

I have only read a little about the 1875 Remington reproductions, and what little I read was a long time ago. I'd guess it's like other clones, OK or not depending on which example you end up with. I can't see, though, that it has any great advantage over a Colt clone. I'd guess that's why the 1875 has never sold as great numbers as the Colt-- either in the 19th Century or today.
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Old October 18, 2005, 11:36 PM   #3
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75s

I can't help myself, so, I have a pair of the outlaws in 7 1/2, in the white engraved. I like them, they shoot great, out of the box, the triggers needed lightened, but no problems with smokless powder. I got them to shoot BP, it takes a little tweeking to make this happen but worth the effort, They look cool, and i don't think any are more accurate, than the Remington clones.

Colts, they are the ultimate, even the big guys don't win with colts? Why? They need tweeking too. Its the name, the cost the image, they aint't no better. I have one of there commemrotives in the safe, High dollar, I'd be afraid to shoot it, looks cool, bad workmanship, the cost is way more than its worth, but its a colt!? I had another but to get it right I'd have to spend a lot more money, I sold it. The rugers are best out of the box, period, and tuff.
I use Rugers too, I like the birds heads, all of these pistols need tweeking or we think they do.
I was going to do the CB with conversions but , they take the same tweeking to make all that work, think about it, drop in!! Right, but they do look cool.

Most of it is what you want or think you want, and how much time , money and effort are you willing to put into it. Its taken 4 months off and on,and many loading sessions to get the 75 pistols right with the loads, I shoot full house and in 45 LC. But they look cool when it all comes together.
I may not be fast but my stuff looks cool. Loco my $.02
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Old October 19, 2005, 06:32 AM   #4
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Thanks for the replies folks. I guess my problem is that I look at the old C&B Revolvers as the true gun of it's time and how it is still just as accurate or even more so than many modern fireams today.
You can load it up or load it down very easily when ever you want. No loading machine needed, no cleaning brass and so on. Just very simple and easy loading and ready to go. You can reload in the field or back yard and not have to run home to reload some more brass.
Maybe it's the idea that we don't really know just how well it served our frontiersman of old or the lives they saved or the lives they took or how many rabbit , deer and other critters they were able to take for food while on the trail or in the war. Not all the old boy's could afford rifle and revolver so the Remington was the best and most trusted. There life depended on them.
Guess I'm just an old romantic when I look at and hold my Remingtons and think about all this and what some of our forfathers went through. I've had my Remingtons for years and they are tuned like a fine running machine and get better with age. I never go to the woods without one on my side Mike
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Old October 19, 2005, 04:25 PM   #5
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I don't know much about the 1875 either, but it seems to me that the old SAA peacemaker elipsed the 1875 even back then and that seems to be true today as well. When we think of the old west we generally think of the SAA, we've been conditioned by all those old cowboy movies where everyone had a peacemaker.

I agree with you about the 1858, and I know exactly where you're coming from there mike, they are beautiful guns and I can't stand the thought of messing one up with a cylinder conversion either. I guess I'm turning nostalgic about those things as I get older. Just like you, every time I'm in the woods I have an 1858 on my hip.
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Old October 19, 2005, 11:39 PM   #6
Loco Smith
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58's

I'm back. I kinda got off the topic, But I love the 58's Cb's thats one reason i went to the 75's they look the same, a little heaverier but shoot just like them. The only reason i haven't bought some Cb's is my better half don't understand they are different than my75's my BH's and the vaqueros. Most of the shoots I attend there is only one maybe two shooting them CB's. The time and those not knowing about them makes it not as much fun, everybody gets impatient. In the cowboy shoots, for me things are trying to speed up, so if you don't keep a cool head the CB's become problems, if you don't slow down and have fun with them. I want a pair but with all the hipe lately I'm not sure which ones are best. Uberti, Taylor or Piattra> Any input on which one are more user friendly out of the box. I want to see a shoot where all use CB's, I'm ready for that, there ain't nothing cooler, and when one can make it come together, not like TV they all work, it looks cool.
I feel they were probably under powered in there time, and i think if used in a fight had to be close, penitration isn't much. I've used one on the farm, to take down cows and small critters, but they have always taken more than one shot. I've seen guys shoot them and some go bang, some puff, they say same amount of powder. Is this the compression, or the bullet, mine always went bang. I also love the Dragoons, I still have my 47 walker, now thats a CB. 56 grs BP and it will out shoot a 357 and have more knock down. But they are heavy. I'm rammbleing so . I like the 58's which are the best?? Thanks Loco
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Old October 20, 2005, 04:23 AM   #7
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loco

I have a pietta myself, (if you check my thread "everyone loves pictures" there is a picture of it on that post). Just reading back through some old posts on this forum, I've seen where some people dont like the pietta and say that it is poorly made and has all kinds of problems, but personally I am very satified with my pietta. Several people say that Uberti is top of the line for the 58 replicas and I would like to buy one next year for comparison (and I'd just like to have another 58, mine is a target version and I'd like to have the fixed sight version as a contrast).

As far as power goes, they say that the old cb revolvers were about equal to a 38 spec. but I think they have more than that. I'm gaining a respect for what a round lead ball can do to a target. Some of the balls that I have dug out of my backstop (which was a 10 in diameter log before I shot it to death ) have sunk in 3-6 in and have flattened out nicely with some wicked sharp edges. I've used the 58 for some snakes, but not for large animals like deer or anything.

FWIW, I've seen in an old post where someone (444) listed some figures from a lyman black powder shooting guide showing the balistics of a 58 Rem with 37 gr. of fffg black powder as being 1096 fps and 326 ft/lb of energy, if thats correct then its about in the same range as a .40 s&w. I shoot 30gr of 777 which is about equal to 36gr of blackpowder if my research is correct. You know how it is though, I just like the old 58 and when you like a gun you go looking for reasons to justify your liking for it. But what it boils down to is the 1858 is just a cool gun! I'm sure that Mike agrees with that!
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Old October 20, 2005, 05:13 AM   #8
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Low Key and Loco Smith, The two 1858 Pietta's I have run as smooth as a babys butt. I have done an action job on them and alot of polishing of the works but the Ubertis need it to. A friend of mine tried to one-up me by buying the Ubertis and we had to do the same work to his.The only difference I could see is that the workmanship on the Uberti's is a little cleaner,
As for the 58 being the same as the 38 special I have heard the same thing but that would depend on what and how your loading it .As for penitration
mine will go through a 2x8 and stick another 6" in the ground on the other side when I load it with 35g of Goex fffg, a wad and a little grease over the ball.You can load this gun with 40g of fffg but I stop at 38g for in the woods and believe me it will drop a cow stone dead if you hit him right, not that I want to try it,
The killing power of the ball doesn't work like the modern loads. The ball will tear a jagged channel as it tumbles and turns and a modern load get's most of it's killing power from shock.
Many cowboys and lawmen stuck with the Remington C & B even after the cartridge came out because of it's accuracy and you have to figure that most of them counted on a one stop shot and not so much of a fire fight. Mike
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Old October 21, 2005, 12:57 PM   #9
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Well,i Have 3 Of The Rem's And They All Are Piettas.i Have Had No Problems With Either.i Have Had My Stainless 58 For Going On 12 Yrs Now And It Shoots Great.i Load It With 40grs Of 777 Under My Own 200gr Cast Lrn Bullet.im Not Sure What The Ballistics Are But It Damn Sure Barks.lol.at 30 Yards I Can Keep All 6 With In The Center Of A Small Paper Plate.as Far As Taken Big Game,i Have Taken 2 Deer With My 58 With The Load Above And With A Double Lung Shot At 30 Yards They Have Only Went About 40 Yards On Me And Dropped.

Mike,im Still Having Problems With Getting Those Old Nipples Out Of The Cylinders!im At The Point Now I Think Im Just Going To Buy New Ones And The Hell With These Old Ones.i Bought These Guns (the Two Blues I Recently Got)off Gunbroker.com And The Guns Were In Good Shape But The Nipples Were Neglected And So They Are Stuck.
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Old October 24, 2005, 07:57 AM   #10
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MPP1423, It seems to me that you are to the point of nothing to loose with these nipples (Cylinder) so why not drill out the nipples just leaving a little metal around the threads and then try an easy out and clean up the threads with the same size tap? If all else fails I would just get a new cylinder. They really are not very high priced and make sure you order extra nipples for it. Then always use never seize or Lock ease on the threads before you place them in the cylinder. I remove the nipples about three times a year to do a real cleaning of my guns and never have a problem.Sure hate to hear that you are having such a hard time with these nipples. It sure isn't fun , I know. Been there a few times with other gun problems.
This may help some of the new guys and gals keep there guns running smooth and clean:
In between times I clean my Rem after shooting no matter if I shoot one cylinder or twenty but here is how I do it. Remove the grips and the trigger gard and cylinder. Soak the gun down with break cleaner including in the works by spraying down in the trigger area and from above around the hammer and barrel. I then swap the barrel with a patch soaked in the stuff and then the brass brush and then more patches until clen. Then I blow the gun off with my air compressor. Now I soak it all with W-D40 and set it off to the side. Clean the cylinder the same way and use qtips to reach all the way to the bottom of the chamber around the nipple . Use patches on the cylinders soaked in the break cleaner until clean. Clean around the nipples and inside them with a pip cleaner and wire nipple pick. Blow it out and soak in W-40. Blow out the gun and the cylinder and then wipe down well with a clean dry rag and clean the barrel and cylinder chambers with dry patches and qtips. I like to place a little grease on the cylinder pin and in the cylinder hole and on the star of the cylinder too.
Never had a misfire or a rusty gun but I do take care of it. When I come in from the woods and haven't fired it ,I use a small rag with W-40 on it and wipe down the gun before putting it back in the holster. I have let the gun sit for weeks at a time doing this with no problem.
This sounds like a lot of work but the whole cleaning takes less than 10 minutes once you get on to it and it's well worth it, Mike
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Old October 24, 2005, 03:05 PM   #11
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Thanks Again Mike,i'll Try The Tap Out.maybe That Will Get The Darn Thing Out.the Silly Thing Is All Came Out But One.lol.i Even Bought A Smiths Model Nipple Wrenck From Dixe,broke That One Too.by The Way Dixe Has These Cool Rubber Reloaders For These Pistol.they Are Enough For 40 Grs Of Powder And Just Top Off With The Ball And You Have A Preloaded Reload.man,they Are Cool!they Come 50 To A Pack For About 8.00.now When I Go To The Range I Can Load These Up And Save Time.
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Old October 24, 2005, 06:23 PM   #12
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MPP1423, Are the rubber loaders a one time deal or can you use them over?
I had shotgun loads like that for my 14 gage muzzle loading shotgun. On one side was the powder and the shot (lead ) was on the other. Made it easy to load in the field. Thanks for the tip, I'll check it out, Mike
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Old October 24, 2005, 10:19 PM   #13
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The problem with the '75s and '90s is, as Robert Duvall put it, it's a gun with some heft.

I was at a gun shop yesterday because my next gun will probably be a single action revolver. Colts don't work for me. The grip is the exactly wrong size for my hands. I looked at a Vaquero, a New Model Army, and 5 1/2" 1875. Despite the fact that it had the longest barrel of the bunch, the NMA felt quick and pointed naturally. The old model vaquero felt heavy. The '75 felt ill balanced, but not as bad as a schofield.

So I'll probably get one of the shorter barreled '58s (even more of a good thing) and cartridge convert it. It'll cost a few dollars more than a '75, but the 58 fits and the others don't. Sometimes guns are funny like that.
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Old October 25, 2005, 11:39 AM   #14
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Hey Mike,
You Can Use These Loaders Over And Over Even Wash Them In The Washer With A Pair Of Jeans It Says On The Pack.man They Are Cool! They Have Them For All Cal's And Powder Charges.check Them Out At Dixegunworks.com.
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Old October 25, 2005, 11:53 AM   #15
MPP1423
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Mike,
I Mispelledthe Address Its Dixiegunworks.com .these Are One Sided Loaders.you Put In The Charge Then Insert A Ball Or What Ever Type Of Bullet And There You Are.when You Go To Load Just Sqeeze Out The Bullet And Pour Out The Charge Into The Firearm.i Wish I Had These A Long Time Ago.they Come In Target And Hunting Size Meaning To Hold More Or Less Of A Charge.

Kevin
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Old October 25, 2005, 08:05 PM   #16
Remington kid
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Kevin, I checked them out and I already had Dixie booked marked. I have bought stuff from them many times over the years. When I head for the woods I have two cylinders on my belt and one in the gun so I'm set for a few day's that way.
My thought was to buy 50 in the 35g range for target and 50 of the 40g for hunting and some rainie day load them up and place them in a ammo box. That would make it nice when your ready to reload at the range , field or home. Mike

Loco Smith, If you want to see a good movie where they use C&B's in all the scenes and in the shootouts, watch the movie "Quigly down under" It's a great movie with the guy that played Magnum, PI. (Tom Selick) One thing they do say about him is that he is a real collector and a nut for period accuracy in the westerns. Mike


Low Key, "You know how it is though, I just like the old 58 and when you like a gun you go looking for reasons to justify your liking for it. But what it boils down to is the 1858 is just a cool gun! I'm sure that Mike agrees with that!" It looks like we are on the same page when it comes to our feeling about the Remingtons Mike
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Old October 25, 2005, 09:41 PM   #17
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Amen Mike!!!!!!! The 58's Are Just Awesome! They Look Cool And Shoot Better Than The Poen Tops.i Have Had A 1860 And 1851 And I Cuoldnt Hit The Broad Side Of A Barn With Them.and Its Not Me.lol.the Rem's Hit On Target.im A Police Officer So I Have To Qualify Twice A Year And I Always Shoot A Perfect Score.the Open Tops Just Arent As On Target As The Rem's.but Thats Just My Opinion.now I Dont Dislike Them Cause I Like All Guns Of Yesteryear But I Favor The Rem's.
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Old October 26, 2005, 10:59 AM   #18
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MPP1423
I've been reading about your problems with your cylinder and I agree with mike, you got nothing to lose in that cylinder. If the drill and tap doesn't work for you, you can get a brand new cylinder from Cabela's for about $36 or so plus shipping. Doesn't it figure though, you can get five nipples out of the cylinder but the sixth is stuck good! That sounds like the way my luck runs!
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Old October 26, 2005, 02:49 PM   #19
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Low Key,
Your Right About The New Cylinder,thats Next Before I Pull My Hair Out.lol.the Only Thing Is That These Cylinders That Came With The Guns Match The Finish(worn)and I Hate To Put A Shint Blue One In That Old Finished Gun.i Guess I Could Remove The Blue And Retreat It So It Matches.damn,cant Nothin Go Easy For Me.lol.
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Old October 27, 2005, 02:19 PM   #20
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Bought my Remington M-1875 -repro, of course-in 1979, still going strong.
Basically, the Remington didn't sell, it's like VHS versus Beta, Beta just didn't
sell for a variety of reasons. Had a gunsmith make a slight taller front sight
to get it right on with my loads. someday I will get a .45ACP cylinder for it.
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