"Stand your ground, no retreat required"

als54 · September 30, 2005, 10:08 AM

Well, tomorrow 1 Oct. Florida's law changes on the requirement to retreat before use of deadly force. The media really had fun with this one, however they missed the point, the guidelines for the use of deadly force didn't change. You just don't have to retreat before using it.

Zekewolf · September 30, 2005, 12:36 PM

In FL, you didn't have to retreat in your home, prior to the change. The change just expanded your rights outside of your home. Good for FL!!!

Massan · September 30, 2005, 12:37 PM

Man, im thinking bout moving to FL. Least their govenor has some freaking sense.

Garand Illusion · September 30, 2005, 01:50 PM

I just invested in a string of Florida car washes. Once the streets are running with blood, car washes should be highly profitable.

To those of you floridians who survive the oncoming blood bath, good luck!

(all the above is tongue in cheek, BTW)

Zekewolf · September 30, 2005, 01:51 PM

If you'd been investing in property along the FL panhandle Gulf Coast, you'd be a lot richer now!

**Mike Irwin** · September 30, 2005, 03:38 PM

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!

Blood In The Streets! Murder! Mayhem! Death! Destruction!

It Will Be Like The Old West

TheBluesMan · September 30, 2005, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Florida tourists warned that locals could shoot them

ALASTAIR JAMIESON

IT IS Britain's most popular transatlantic holiday destination, attracting more than 1.5 million visitors a year with its sun-drenched beaches, theme parks and wildlife.

Read more here: http://news.scotsman.com/internation...?id=2014492005

gb_in_ga · September 30, 2005, 03:48 PM

"If you'd been investing in property along the FL panhandle Gulf Coast, you'd be a lot richer now!"

Ah, I've got a bunch of in-laws there, in the Pensacola area. IF you invested in rental houses, and IF those houses are still standing after the last couple of hurricanes (Ivan and Dennis), then yes, you'd be a lot richer now -- intact housing is a premium in certain spots along there right now.

625 · September 30, 2005, 05:03 PM

No6,

Quote:

"Is there any legal action that the NRA could take?"

For a newspaper article from SCOTLAND? What and why? Hardly an NRA issue.

I can't respond to this in the other thread that was closed, but did you even read the article? It stated that the Brady bunch was involved.
I was just wondering if any legal action could be taken?
Seems that's all we can do these days is feed the sharks with our hard earned money.

**Mike Irwin** · September 30, 2005, 05:16 PM

No, no legal action warranted, really.

It's an accurate portrayal of the law, just done in the most blindingly hysterical, fear ridden way possible.

Typical for the Brady Bunch.

Russ5924 · September 30, 2005, 07:04 PM

Can't wait untill midnight so I can start on my list of people who I dislike

Should sound like the 4th of July out there. :barf:

TheeBadOne · September 30, 2005, 07:20 PM

Bush's fault

joab · September 30, 2005, 07:37 PM

Quote:

avoid disputes. Use special caution in arguing with motorists on ******* roads."

Wouldn't this be sound advice just about anywhere.

The funny thing is the media coverage this time is nothing compared to '87.

It was so bad about predicting the TEOTWAWKI in Fla that I was thinking about moving.

I was young so I bought into the hysteria of the blood red streets and traffic light shootouts

Almost 20 years later and the streets are just a little more potholed and congested but still are just plain ole black and I don't think I have heard the term road rage in months.
There was a guy stabbed at a traffic light a couple of years ago, but that was because the other guy tried to hit him with a motorcycle helmet.
The knife wielder did have a gun in his truck, but he never drew it.

But the media is still using the same doom and gloom talking points

AndrewTB · September 30, 2005, 11:11 PM

My neighbor (a sheriff) told me that this law wont make a big difference. I don't know but I think the basic concept is great.

NOW TO LOWER THE CCW AGE!

joab · September 30, 2005, 11:51 PM

The is allows us to "meet force with force" not to just shoot at anyone that crosseyes you as the media has been suggesting.

Quick story

A few years ago my father took my two little brothers to the Bithlo Raceway, an unofficial "whites only" venue.
Two of Bithlo's upstandings were sitting behind them making Jap and Chink comments.
At 58 and riddled with arthritis my dad decided he couldn't take the 30 something and his friends so he told the boys to move.

As they started to leave the youngest, about 5, stood up on the walkway and put his hands down on the seat row in front, sicking his butt in the air the way clumsy kids do.

The tough guy said "yeah get outta here you little Gook" and pushed the kid with his foot and and he fell face first into the bleacher.

Dad without thinking broke the Klucker's jaw.

According to the cop my father had the legal obligation to make every effort to retreat, even though this was a verifiable hate crime and assault on a minor with injuries.

After tomorrow Dad could kick his butt with impunity and would not have to agree not to press charges in order for charges not to be pressed on him

als54 · October 1, 2005, 09:38 AM

WOW, we managed to make it throught the night, I woke up surprised to see the streets wasn't flowing with blood...

joab · October 1, 2005, 05:40 PM

A tourist cut me off in traffic and gave me a disrepectful look when I tooted my horn at him.

Apparently he just didn't know what day it was, so I let him live
This time

That was a joke y'all

BerettaCougar · October 1, 2005, 07:12 PM

Last time I went to Knights shooting range in St Pete (FL)
A group of about 15 Australians were talking about how they wish they lived here, and not just visiting for a week.

They compared a few things, and we pretty much dominate, when it comes to standards of living.

They said over there, first off, self defense is looked down upon...
Even training yourself for hand-to-hand combat is frowned upon, theres groups trying to ban martial arts!!!

Knives, blunt weapons, chemical defenses all are restricted.

The cops/military hold ALL power, what a shame.

Low Key · October 2, 2005, 06:54 AM

I've seen this on a bumper sticker and agree with the statement:

"An armed populace consists of citizens, an unarmed populace consists of subjects."

I hope this same "no retreat" law is enacted in all 50 states.

As for the Aussies, they're good people and they got a raw deal from their government. Hopefully something can be done to reverse the damage thats been done to their freedoms over there.

Blackwater OPS · October 2, 2005, 07:02 AM

Yeah, we even have this law in "Kalifornia"

KSFreeman · October 2, 2005, 10:48 AM

Silly, Brady Bunch, tricks are for kids.

I'm old enough to remember the hysteria regarding Florida in 1987. Blood in the streets! Women and minorities gunned down by horse-riding, pistol-toting Floridians in white robes!

At least the Brady Bunch is earth friendly--they are into recycling.

CCW wasn't invented in Florida, we had it in my state decades before Florida's '87 reform.

The elimination of the duty to retreat was not invented in Florida, we had it in my state centuries before Florida's '05 reform.

There will not be any blood, but there will be much hysteria.

Zekewolf · October 2, 2005, 11:59 AM

The Brady Bunch would spend their "lifesaving" funds much more effectively, if they erected hugh billboards all over the world that said, "Smoking Cigarettes Causes Lung Cancer," with a picture of Sarah Brady with a cig hanging out of her mouth.

blackmind · October 3, 2005, 05:58 PM

Quote:

In FL, you didn't have to retreat in your home, prior to the change. The change just expanded your rights outside of your home. Good for FL!!!

What this changed regarding the home is that now, you do not have to wait for a home invader to present a weapon and/or threaten to kill you -- you can use deadly force because now you are entitled to the presumption that anyone breaking into your home by force is there to kill you. I view this change as a good thing. Why wait until the guy has a weapon aimed at you? He's invading your home, possibly in a very violent manner. Should there be doubt about whether his intentions are noble?

-blackmind

blackmind · October 3, 2005, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Irwin

No, no legal action warranted, really.

It's an accurate portrayal of the law, just done in the most blindingly hysterical, fear ridden way possible.

Typical for the Brady Bunch.

Wait a minute. The article says the following:

Quote:

Previously, gun owners could only use their weapons if they first attempted to withdraw and avoid a confrontation, and were permitted to shoot threatening individuals only inside their home or property.

Now they can use "deadly force" if they "reasonably believe" that firing their gun is necessary to prevent a crime or serious injury. The law also effectively prevents civil legal action by victims of such shootings.

Wrong on two counts -- and as a result, hardly what I would call an accurate portrayal of the law.

Prior to the new law, we were not limited to using deadly force only inside our homes or property. (Where did they get an absurd idea like that?)

And the law does not provide for using deadly force to prevent any old crime. Still has to be a violent or forcible felony, as far as I am aware. Still can't shoot someone for stealing your stereo. Still have to believe you or someone else stands to suffer grievous physical harm or death.

Calling this an "accurate portrayal of the law" and saying that it therefore has the shield of truth (regarding libel) as a result is inaccurate itself.

-blackmind

blackmind · October 3, 2005, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekewolf

The Brady Bunch would spend their "lifesaving" funds much more effectively, if they erected hugh billboards all over the world that said, "Smoking Cigarettes Causes Lung Cancer," with a picture of Sarah Brady with a cig hanging out of her mouth.

Hahahaa! And the NRA should take out ads targeted at Kalifornia tourists showing the infamous picture of Dianne Feinstein (mis)handling that "assault weapon" on a stage in front of dozens of people, saying, "Warning: visiting Kalifornia can expose you to the danger of being muzzle-swept by an incompetent gun-handler holding a 'high-powered-rifle' that she has neither personally cleared nor knows how to use."

-blackmind

September 30, 2005, 10:08 AM	#1
als54 Senior Member Join Date: January 18, 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 215	"Stand your ground, no retreat required" Well, tomorrow 1 Oct. Florida's law changes on the requirement to retreat before use of deadly force. The media really had fun with this one, however they missed the point, the guidelines for the use of deadly force didn't change. You just don't have to retreat before using it. __________________ Glock G17 Taurus PT145 Millennium PRO NRA Member

September 30, 2005, 03:48 PM	#8
gb_in_ga Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2005 Location: Wylie, Tx Posts: 2,979	"If you'd been investing in property along the FL panhandle Gulf Coast, you'd be a lot richer now!" Ah, I've got a bunch of in-laws there, in the Pensacola area. IF you invested in rental houses, and IF those houses are still standing after the last couple of hurricanes (Ivan and Dennis), then yes, you'd be a lot richer now -- intact housing is a premium in certain spots along there right now. __________________ COME AND TAKE IT http://www.tamu.edu/ccbn/dewitt/batgon.htm Formerly lived in Ga, but now I'm back in Tx!

September 30, 2005, 07:04 PM	#11
Russ5924 Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2005 Posts: 1,874	Can't wait untill midnight so I can start on my list of people who I dislike Should sound like the 4th of July out there. :barf: __________________ Russ5924

September 30, 2005, 11:51 PM	#15
joab Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2002 Location: Orl Fla Posts: 3,254	The is allows us to "meet force with force" not to just shoot at anyone that crosseyes you as the media has been suggesting. Quick story A few years ago my father took my two little brothers to the Bithlo Raceway, an unofficial "whites only" venue. Two of Bithlo's upstandings were sitting behind them making Jap and Chink comments. At 58 and riddled with arthritis my dad decided he couldn't take the 30 something and his friends so he told the boys to move. As they started to leave the youngest, about 5, stood up on the walkway and put his hands down on the seat row in front, sicking his butt in the air the way clumsy kids do. The tough guy said "yeah get outta here you little Gook" and pushed the kid with his foot and and he fell face first into the bleacher. Dad without thinking broke the Klucker's jaw. According to the cop my father had the legal obligation to make every effort to retreat, even though this was a verifiable hate crime and assault on a minor with injuries. After tomorrow Dad could kick his butt with impunity and would not have to agree not to press charges in order for charges not to be pressed on him __________________ Joab the Bugman Founding member- Lords of Pomposity It's a Yankee Doodle thing

October 1, 2005, 09:38 AM	#16
als54 Senior Member Join Date: January 18, 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 215	WOW, we managed to make it throught the night, I woke up surprised to see the streets wasn't flowing with blood... __________________ Glock G17 Taurus PT145 Millennium PRO NRA Member

September 30, 2005, 12:36 PM	#2
Zekewolf Senior Member Join Date: April 2, 2005 Posts: 886	In FL, you didn't have to retreat in your home, prior to the change. The change just expanded your rights outside of your home. Good for FL!!!

September 30, 2005, 12:37 PM	#3
Massan Senior Member Join Date: June 27, 2005 Posts: 167	Man, im thinking bout moving to FL. Least their govenor has some freaking sense.

September 30, 2005, 01:50 PM	#4
Garand Illusion Senior Member Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,278	I just invested in a string of Florida car washes. Once the streets are running with blood, car washes should be highly profitable. To those of you floridians who survive the oncoming blood bath, good luck! (all the above is tongue in cheek, BTW)

September 30, 2005, 01:51 PM	#5
Zekewolf Senior Member Join Date: April 2, 2005 Posts: 886	If you'd been investing in property along the FL panhandle Gulf Coast, you'd be a lot richer now!

September 30, 2005, 03:38 PM	#6
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 14, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 33,116	Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!! Blood In The Streets! Murder! Mayhem! Death! Destruction! It Will Be Like The Old West

September 30, 2005, 05:16 PM	#10
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 14, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 33,116	No, no legal action warranted, really. It's an accurate portrayal of the law, just done in the most blindingly hysterical, fear ridden way possible. Typical for the Brady Bunch.

September 30, 2005, 07:20 PM	#12
TheeBadOne Junior member Join Date: January 12, 2002 Location: USA Posts: 1,199	Bush's fault

September 30, 2005, 11:11 PM	#14
AndrewTB Junior member Join Date: January 11, 2005 Posts: 677	My neighbor (a sheriff) told me that this law wont make a big difference. I don't know but I think the basic concept is great. NOW TO LOWER THE CCW AGE!

October 1, 2005, 05:40 PM	#17
joab Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2002 Location: Orl Fla Posts: 3,254	A tourist cut me off in traffic and gave me a disrepectful look when I tooted my horn at him. Apparently he just didn't know what day it was, so I let him live This time That was a joke y'all __________________ Joab the Bugman Founding member- Lords of Pomposity It's a Yankee Doodle thing

October 1, 2005, 07:12 PM	#18
BerettaCougar Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 1,226	Last time I went to Knights shooting range in St Pete (FL) A group of about 15 Australians were talking about how they wish they lived here, and not just visiting for a week. They compared a few things, and we pretty much dominate, when it comes to standards of living. They said over there, first off, self defense is looked down upon... Even training yourself for hand-to-hand combat is frowned upon, theres groups trying to ban martial arts!!! Knives, blunt weapons, chemical defenses all are restricted. The cops/military hold ALL power, what a shame.

October 2, 2005, 06:54 AM	#19
Low Key Senior Member Join Date: September 4, 2005 Location: In the woods of TN Posts: 298	I've seen this on a bumper sticker and agree with the statement: "An armed populace consists of citizens, an unarmed populace consists of subjects." I hope this same "no retreat" law is enacted in all 50 states. As for the Aussies, they're good people and they got a raw deal from their government. Hopefully something can be done to reverse the damage thats been done to their freedoms over there. __________________

October 2, 2005, 07:02 AM	#20
Blackwater OPS Senior Member Join Date: September 11, 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,154	Yeah, we even have this law in "Kalifornia" __________________ "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." -Ben Franklin Spc. Jeremy M. Campbell Died 9/1/2005 and the best DS ever MSG Matthew Ritz Died 11.23.2005 matthewritz.com For those who have had to fight for it, Life holds a special meaning that the protected will never know. (\__/) (='.'=) Someone set us up the bunny! (")_(")

October 2, 2005, 10:48 AM	#21
KSFreeman Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2001 Location: Lafayette, Indiana--American-occupied America Posts: 5,424	Silly, Brady Bunch, tricks are for kids. I'm old enough to remember the hysteria regarding Florida in 1987. Blood in the streets! Women and minorities gunned down by horse-riding, pistol-toting Floridians in white robes! At least the Brady Bunch is earth friendly--they are into recycling. CCW wasn't invented in Florida, we had it in my state decades before Florida's '87 reform. The elimination of the duty to retreat was not invented in Florida, we had it in my state centuries before Florida's '05 reform. There will not be any blood, but there will be much hysteria. __________________ "Arguments of policy must give way to a constitutional command." Payton v. New York, 445 U.S. 573, 602 (1980).

October 2, 2005, 11:59 AM	#22
Zekewolf Senior Member Join Date: April 2, 2005 Posts: 886	The Brady Bunch would spend their "lifesaving" funds much more effectively, if they erected hugh billboards all over the world that said, "Smoking Cigarettes Causes Lung Cancer," with a picture of Sarah Brady with a cig hanging out of her mouth.