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Old September 26, 2005, 11:33 AM   #1
dgc940
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WhiteTail hunting question

I just got a new 25-06 what scope power would be good on 150yard to 200yds? I have a 6.5-20 on my 17hmr and another with a V16 and love the AO and high power on it!
I do know about adjusting out the paralex. I see a lot of deer rifle's with 6x9 but isn't that a little week for 200-250yds? Is there some kind of atvantage to having a 6-9? Im new to centerfires but have been shooting rimfires for many years. I also love shooting paper and on white tail I think I would rather make neck shoot's but thats another question wher should I hit a deer? I'm not a trophy hunter my trophy room will be whit and very very cold!

Don
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Old September 26, 2005, 11:52 AM   #2
jasonc84
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I like a scope that will go down to about 3 or 4 because when you go to shoot a deer closer than 25 yards its going to be a big blur anything above 7. Low power is also good in thick brush. Not unless you're only going to be hunting in wide open fields, I would say a 4-12 would be just fine or 3-9 on the lower end.
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Old September 26, 2005, 01:09 PM   #3
Art Eatman
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I've hunted all kinds of country, from heavy brush to "way wide open" with a 3x9. Never had a problem.

The worst thing that can happen is to have the scope on 9X and jump a buck at 25 yards. You see a tine, some brown, an ear, some brown--and then nothing but brush. BTDT.

One of my longest one-shot kills was with the scope set on 3X, out around 350 yards or so. No problem whatsoever with the shot placement.

For deer hunting, IMO, "need" ends at around 4X. Above 4X, we're talking "preference" or "I want". Varmint hunting with a dual purpose rifle justifies magnification out to 9X or 10X and even more.

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Old September 26, 2005, 01:15 PM   #4
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Don,
My high power rifles (.25/06, .270, 7 Rem Mag) all wear 3x9 Leupold scopes but I have never used more than 4-6 power for shooting deer out to 350+ yds. More magnification simply magnifies wobbles and narrows field of view. The real benefit of a scope is putting the target and sights (crosshairs) in the same focal plane so you can see both sharp at the same time. Magnification is WAY over emphasized IMO. That said, use what you prefer, but be prepared to deal with high wobbles, narrow field of view, and difficulty aligning eye to scope with higher magnifications.

Good shooting and be safe.
LB

ps: My two S&W M629 hunting pistols wear 2X Leupold EER scopes and have taken game from 20 yds out to 95 yards. Have even taken running game with them.

Art,
We need to arrange a hunt together some time. Seems we think alike.
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Old September 26, 2005, 01:16 PM   #5
Charles S
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Quote:
what scope power would be good on 150yard to 200yds?
For the distances you specified on deer a 2-7 would be ideal, but I would put a 3-9X40 on a 25-06.

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Old September 26, 2005, 02:20 PM   #6
dgc940
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I guess a 3-9 x40 thru 44 would be a money saver!
I did build a ground stand and it has three windows with 4 inch thick gun rest on windows. Ok now Nikon monarch or burris signiture I do not want to spend the extra for Leo. or any of the higher europeon scopes.
Also forgot to mention the land owner wants the ferrel hogs eraticated as they have took over.
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Old September 26, 2005, 02:33 PM   #7
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Luepold VariXII 3x9. All you will need
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Old September 26, 2005, 05:36 PM   #8
mdhunter
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Don't Get Anything Larger Than a 3x9 for Hunting

DGC940,

Those higher power scopes are great for long-range prairie dog, antelope, and other shooting, but for hunting at distances from point blank to 250 yards or so, they're simply overkill. That's not to say that some guys can't use them well with practice, but they hinder rapid target acquisition at close range, have a lot more mirage effect in heat (I used the wrong term, but you guys know what i'm saying), and don't work as well in low-light conditions.

Case in point - last year in Alaska, we had a herd of caribou come by on the last afternoon of out hunt - a group of about 75 caribou, but only 5-6 shooter bulls among them, and the herd was CONSTANTLY moving and never still. I managed to bag one of the shooter bulls with my Winchester MOdel 70 .30-06 with 3.5-10x sat on 4x, after following the bull for a couple hundred yards until he cleared the other caribou to offer an ethical shot. My buddy was using a Sako with a 6.5x20 scope, and he wasn't able to stay on the bulls well enough in the crowd, to ever get a shot. That gave me all the evidence I'll ever need about having too much scope on a hunting gun!

Get a 2x7 or 3x9, and KEEP IT ON THE LOWEST POWER - if you need more power you'll likely have time to dial the scope up, as the game will be some distance away; it doesn;t work the other way around - if you jump a deer at 15 yards and have the scope on 9 power, you're not likely to get a good sight picture soon enough to get a good shot off.

Good luck, let us know what you decide.

Michael
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Old September 27, 2005, 08:10 AM   #9
dgc940
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Thanks everyone
Mdhunter I see what you are saying and it does stand to reason. but the reason I was asking why most people use a 6-9 is because i guess As you said some people with practice can is because I squirrel unt with a weaver V16 4-16 on a 10/22. now keep in mind Im not arguing with you as I think Im going to buy a nikon 6-9 after all I have been told and they are a little cheeper on price. That beeing said the reason I like the higher power on my 22 is I like puting the round right thru a squirrels eye! (as he sits still) another thing I dont understand is why dose leopold have such a cult type following? I will never buy one for this reason. Honda atvs and motorcycles were the same way!

Don
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Old September 27, 2005, 11:55 AM   #10
mdhunter
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Leupold Cult Following

Don,

Lotta good info posted here, you're doing the right thing taking it all into consideration.

As for the high power scope on your squirrel gun - I hear you, I have a Ruger Model 77 in .22 magnum with a 3x9 power scope on it, and I like to dial the scope up to 9x for head shots! But, I do carry on 3x while I'm walking through the woods, in case I get just a quick shot at a squirrel on the ground.

However, I think that's a little different than using a high-power scope for big game.....because if we miss our chance on that squirrel we'll probably see another in a little while, and we might not get too upset at missing out on one squirrel - there will be more later today and next Saturday. But if we miss out on a chance at a big buck (or in my buddy's case a big bull caribou), that's IT for this season - THAT is a lot harder to get over......

As for Leupold, they make excellent scopes with fully multi-coated lenses, and have proven their worth in all types of bad weather conditions, so I think they've earned their cult following honestly! That said, a Nikon scope will work just fine, with the proper amount of practice in hunting positions by the guy looking through it....
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Old September 27, 2005, 07:52 PM   #11
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If your longest shot would be 200 yards, and you mostly would hunt at under 100 yards, you could do just fine with a fixed 4x or a low power variable, such as a Leupold or Burris maybe a 1.5 X 5.
That would fit better on your rifle, weigh less, and still provide you with adequate magnification if you needed it.
I have taken many deer through the years, most with a low power variable.
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Old September 27, 2005, 09:26 PM   #12
dgc940
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Points well taken! And i'm even going to take the advice!
But I do have one other question! I have never been a deer hunter but a good friend of mine owns a LOT OF LAND and wants me to start going with hin as he feels that he's getting way to old to go by himself. with that being said my question is dose most people in other states hunt whittail the same way? Put up a feeder throwing corn, put a blind or stand close by. sit for hours waiting for the deer to come feed and shoot?
onother question is why dose this excite people so much? I went with him the last three years carried a spare gun of his used his ammo his stand but would never shoot mainly because I had a gun that I had never fired!
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Old September 28, 2005, 09:39 AM   #13
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Bushnell Elite 4200 or 3200

I have NOT used them, but I have heard that the Bushnell "Elite" series of scopes (4200/3200) represent a decent value of performance/price. You might want to research them.
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Old September 28, 2005, 02:12 PM   #14
mdhunter
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Deer Hunting.....

Many people hunt deer in that fashion - the perceived advantages being that in a stand you are not spreading as much fresh scent as you would be walking SLOWLY and QUIETLY through the woods (stillhunting). Also, many people do not have the patience to stillhunt SLOWLY (i.e., look and listen for a few minutes, take 1 or 2 steps, look and listen for a few minutes, 1 or 2 steps, etc.....)

I hunt from stands and also stillhunt, but don't have land so don't put corn out......I like both methods, tend toward stillhuntingfor my own preference. If you and he are the only hunters on a large parcel of land, you can use both methods effectively, just need to be sure you both know where the other hunter is located in relation to your own positon.

Good luck - I love this time of year, when the leaves start to change with the crisp fall air!

Michael
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Old September 28, 2005, 03:16 PM   #15
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I think 2X7 is better than 3X9 but

I think 2X7 is better than 3X9 but either works. I've thought so ever since I read that in Bob Hagel's writings. Though I've owned 3X9 I've never used one for seriously hunting as I have 2X7 - the VariXII had inferior coatings and perhaps other optics but it was a better fit. I had a bigger 3X9 on a .270 that I sometimes stretched the range for varmint hunting.

My own deer rifles are a Steyr Scout with stock Scout scope and .30-06 with a fixed 2.5X and a 6mm with a 4X.

I like a lot of power in a dedicated varmint gun - 16 power is as good as it gets for ground squirrels and I agree with the man (Jim Carmichael) who said that if you are accustomed to scopes a 6X may suit you better as an all around than the long traditional but perhaps past it's best 4X. For hunting I'd go with a 6X but there's nothing wrong with a lower power variable. I'd avoid neck shots unless you have dressed a few deer yourself and become intimately familiar with their anatomy.
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Old September 28, 2005, 03:36 PM   #16
Lonestar.45
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I've got a 3x12 on my BDL, and love it.

About the stand hunting, that's the way I grew up hunting. It's not for everyone. I do like stalking, glassing, getting out and moving around some, especially during the rut. If the terrain permits, that's lots of fun and challenging.

HOWEVER, I will say this, stand hunting over a feeder will allow you to watch deer, lots of deer, in a shorter period of time. To me that's more fun than shooting one, just watching them interact. It's the best way to learn about deer behavior in my opinion. Seeing which direction they come from and what main trails they use, seeing which ones return all the time, which ones might be "itinerant" bucks looking for a doe, noting which does have fawns, which does are in charge of the herd.

I only THOUGHT I knew about deer behavior until I took up archery, and hunted over a feeder at 15 yds. Having 8 or 10 deer 15 yds away, for an hour or two at a time, is extremely educational. You'll learn real quick which movements will tip them off, what kinds of sounds they are oblivious too and which ones they alert on, how the wind will affect them, whether your camoflage works, whether your equipment is silent enough, and how effective any cover scents you use might be. It's not for everyone. But to anyone who thinks hunting over a feeder isn't challenging or sporting, lay down the Remchester magnum, pick up a bow and set up a tree stand 15 yds out and see how you do, you'll be surprised at how hard it is.
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Old September 29, 2005, 10:05 AM   #17
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Scopes and Deer Hunting

dgc940,

Scopes:
My first criteria is nothing larger than 40mm, I like my scopes as low as possible. On my woods guns I have the Simmons Whitetail Expeditions 1.5x6 32mm. This is a great little scope in the woods where its normally darker then in a field and the lower magnifications allow greater light transmission. I normally keep it set between 2 -3 . My field guns wear Burris and Nikons 3x9 40mm which I normally kept under 6x. The only time a crank up the power is when I'm bench rested testing loads.

For the ranges you will be shooting any quality mid priced scope 3x9 40mm will work fine.

Why does Deer hunting excite people....Huh... that could be a long post... I'll try to keep it short:

I hunt in Eastern North Carolina and there in nothing like slipping into a swamp in the dark, sitting on a camo'd 5 gallon bucket, in a gillie suit and having wildlife pass within feet me. I have had deer within 10 feet of me and did not I was there. OR sitting in a stand with my 12 year daughter when she shot her first buck. I best stop there.

Stand hunting -- Mainly ( not always) used for hunting fields. In the counties around where I live, if your going to be using any kind of rifle you must be elevated a minimum of 8ft. this is for safety reasons ( I'm told). I prefer my climber or 5-gallon bucket ( see above) in the swamp.

Corn feeders -- Around here I would guess that 80 % of the fields are planted in cotton, deer do not cotton to cotton for food. We use the feeder for two things 1.) to help hold the deer in our area 2.) to help draw them out of the swamps, most of the natural food the deer eat is in the swamps, mainly acorns. Huh... did I mention I like to hunt in the swamps?

I hope this rumbling helps some
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Old September 29, 2005, 01:04 PM   #18
dgc940
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Hey windjammer

What kind of NIKONS DO YOU USE? DO YOU LIKE THEM OK?
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Old September 29, 2005, 01:15 PM   #19
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dgc940

My 30-06 wears a Nikon Monarch Scope 3-9x 40mm Nikoplex and the .243 has a Burris Fullfield 2 Scope 3-9x 40mm Ballistic Plex. They are both good scopes.. IMHO the Nikon is a little better on light transmisson.
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Old September 30, 2005, 10:53 PM   #20
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"...would rather make neck shoot's(sic)..." Forget the neck shot. It's a much smaller target. Shoot into the heart/lung area. Just aft of the front legs.
Forget the high magnification scope too. 2.5X to 8X will cover every shot you could ever make with a .25-06. 200 to 250 yards is a very long way for a new CF shooter. In fact, it'll be unlikely if you even see a deer at that distance. You need to practice shooting off-hand at a 9" pie plate at 100 yards until you can hit it every time. Then you'll be ready to hunt.
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Old October 1, 2005, 12:28 AM   #21
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Why do people use scopes in the first place? Primary reason is that scopes reduce the negative effect of having a poor cheek weld. There is no rear sight to throw off a fraction of an inch which multiplies out to a foot or two at 200 yards. The second reason is that older people have difficulty focussing on the sights and the deer. Scopes allow all the focussing to be at one single pre-chosen range so they put both sights and deer at the range of your granny glasses. Third, the scope will gather light and improve sight contrast during the critical dawn and dusk periods.

I think the best compromise between power and scope diameter is 3 to5 power and 40 mm for fields and 1.5 to 2.5 and 32 mm in the woods. I find that cranking up a scope to 9 or 12 power won't really add horn counting ability at dusk in the haze.
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Old October 1, 2005, 09:19 AM   #22
dgc940
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The reason!

I have not recieved a scope for the 25 yet but I did mount my weaver vi6 on it the other day for kicks sighted it in at 100 yds it shoots pretty good with the cheep rem. 100 grn's! Yes T. O'Heir I am new to CF'S but I have been thru a many rounds in 17hmr and .22 also shoot a lot with my precision air rifle with triger down to less than 1lb. hitting pie plates will not be a problem as I have been nailing chicken silloetts out at 300yds off of bench of coarse! and holding at top of the siloetts.
and grouping less than 3 1/2 inches at two hundred with no wind The only reason I was intertaining a higher power was I was thinking with higher magnifacation would be better for precise shoot placement. after all the stand I will be hunting has 1 x 6 gun rest around the windows. and with possible shooting out to 300yds. but A Feeder only out to 50 yds? so with ever thing I have read here it wont matter and with such a large kill area on a deer a 6x9 will be all I will ever need! I was at first thinking out to 150 yds That i wanted to shoot in the neck area for the challange of it! I dont think I will ever have any problem hitting a deer in the front side and killing it just too large a target! and with a cold barrel iv'e been hitting dead on at a hundred but did not feel I could hit a two inch or so (the neck spine) target at 200 with only 9 power? But i think with all of your input the V16 is going back where it belongs and a 3x9 Nikon is going on my 25-06 and I will just shoot in the boiler room!

thanks

Last edited by dgc940; October 1, 2005 at 12:08 PM.
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Old October 1, 2005, 04:31 PM   #23
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i keep my scope adjusted to 5x
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Old October 1, 2005, 04:50 PM   #24
Charles S
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Quote:
i keep my scope adjusted to 5x
With my general purpose rifles I tend to keep the power at 3 when walking in the woods, walking to and from stands, for stands in the bottoms where shots tend to be short, I might turn it up to 4, for stands in the clear cuts and fields I almost always use 6 power and I sight in at nine or ten depending on the scope. This has always worked for me, I have never had a problem with my scope being set and too high a power because I made it a habit of turning the scope to the lowest power when walking. When I load the gun I check the scope.

I really prefer a lower power scope on my rifles, my favorite walking rifle is a Remington model 7 in 308 with a 1.75-6 Leupold scope. I really feel that this rifle fits my needs the best.

Charles
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Old October 1, 2005, 11:43 PM   #25
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Really Can You justify that for another hunter I think that a 3x-9x will work but it just depends wat you might want to see I personally like a high power scope thet way I can see exactally where I want to hit him I have a .243 win and I use a 4.5x-16x nikon scope on it and that is my all around hunting gun for texas game i use it for every thing around here
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