The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Hunt

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old June 23, 2005, 07:38 AM   #1
Old Shooter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 29, 2005
Location: Greenville/Anderson area of SC
Posts: 280
Coyote ugly

I have a coyote problem at my farm. I've lost a few small animals and I know it's not fox. We have a coyote problem in my area - several others have lost goats.

What caliber do I need to do the job efectively? Seveal people seem to think the .17 will do the job, others have said a .22 mag. I think they are too light but is a 30-30 overkill (parden the pun)? What about a .223?
__________________
My life is based on a true story ....
Sometimes I wish I could sit back and watch the things I do.
Old Shooter is offline  
Old June 23, 2005, 08:11 AM   #2
Twycross
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 26, 2005
Location: Montana
Posts: 1,187
Quote:
Seveal people seem to think the .17 will do the job
Which .17? 17HMR or 17HM2 will not, at least not in an ethical manner. 17 Remington? Maybe.

I don't know about .22 Mag. I know people use them frequently, but I am not sure whether I would do so. .223 is fine.

But for coyotes, there is no such thing as overkill.
__________________
The test of character is not 'hanging in' when you expect light at the end of the tunnel, but performance of duty, and persistence of example when you know no light is coming.
- Vice Admiral James Stockdale, USN (ret.)
Twycross is offline  
Old June 23, 2005, 08:28 AM   #3
bclark1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 5, 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,531
.223 is what i'm going to use up at my parents' farm. they asked i not call them in when they're around, not sure why, so i'm waiting on the opportunity. i've heard 22LR is doable, i'd prefer a magnum round if i'm going with something that small, but you have a lot of leeway. i'd also like to try shooting some of the 55-grain 30-06 accelerators i've got at them too, but that's probably farther down the line, or for long shots i need a scope for.
bclark1 is offline  
Old June 23, 2005, 12:07 PM   #4
knightkrawler00
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 28, 2004
Location: Prosser WA
Posts: 103
30-30 will do just fine on a Coyote. I made a broadside chest shot on one that dropped like its legs were cut off. The bullet went straight through, 150gr. Core-Lock, and from the looks of the exit wound, did not expand.

I've used a lot of 50gr. VMAX in my .223 for Coyotes, and it works great also.

Don't forget about buckshot, if you can get in close enough. I dropped a couple the other night with 12 pellet S&B, both went down with one shot each.

I stay away from the rimfire rounds for Coyote, I don't have enough confidence in it to do the job, even with perfect shot placement. Most any centerfire round will do the job, if you do yours.
knightkrawler00 is offline  
Old June 23, 2005, 01:37 PM   #5
Jseime
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 31, 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,775
centerfire

id use any centerfire round on the market and maaaaaybe the .22mag.

the .17 and .22lr rimfires are IMHO too small or too weak for coyotes.

i loved the .243 for yotes. i hit one a 250 yards and flipped it right over with a 100 grain SP. the .243 will give you reach and power needed for coyotes.
__________________
I love the smell of fresh shotgun in the morning.
Jseime is offline  
Old June 23, 2005, 02:09 PM   #6
dale taylor
Member
 
Join Date: February 10, 2005
Location: florida
Posts: 97
I agree with 30-30. You want them to drop. I've seen them run a long way with 223 in chest. daleltaylor@att.net
dale taylor is offline  
Old June 23, 2005, 06:40 PM   #7
22-rimfire
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 19, 2005
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 4,638
For open country, I like the 243 suggestion the best. 223 would be fine! I think that an important question here is how close you think you are going to be shooting at them or how close the neighbor's houses are to your hunting location or property. Night hunting? Lots of close neighbors, I might consider the 22 magnum or a shotgun for close up and personal. Is this for sport or for pure extermination? Like everything else, I would use what I've got.
22-rimfire is offline  
Old June 23, 2005, 09:54 PM   #8
Art Eatman
Staff Lead
 
Join Date: November 13, 1998
Location: Terlingua, TX, USA
Posts: 22,596
The voice of experience sez that a .223 with a 52- or 55-grain bullet will definitely ruin a coyote at 100 yards. I wouldn't hesitate to take a chest shot out to 200...

A .243 is plumb ruinacious, out to around 250 or 300, using a bullet like the 85-grain Sierra HPBT. Inside 100, it's really gross.

, Art
__________________
You're from BATFE? Come right in! I use all your fine products!
Art Eatman is offline  
Old June 23, 2005, 10:53 PM   #9
Springer45
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 24, 2005
Location: Land of Sky Blue Waters
Posts: 183
7.62 x 39 is another candidate if you're not needing to reach out too far.
__________________
If you have a 50-50 chance of being right, you'll be wrong 90% of the time.
Springer45 is offline  
Old June 24, 2005, 06:58 AM   #10
Old Shooter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 29, 2005
Location: Greenville/Anderson area of SC
Posts: 280
Quote:
how close the neighbor's houses are to your hunting location or property
I have 25 acres surrounded by other farms and a lake that borders the whole left side of my farm. Gun fire is not a problem since I practice a lot for IDPA matches and it's legal to shoot on my property. HOWEVER there is a development at the very back of my place. The last thing I need is to hit a coyote and have it run off and die in someone's backyard.

My shot should be well under 100 yards and I need to drop it in it's tracks. Also, the answer is "yes" - this if for extermination not sport.
__________________
My life is based on a true story ....
Sometimes I wish I could sit back and watch the things I do.
Old Shooter is offline  
Old June 24, 2005, 10:30 AM   #11
Art Eatman
Staff Lead
 
Join Date: November 13, 1998
Location: Terlingua, TX, USA
Posts: 22,596
Any chest-cavity hit will not see a coyote go more than 20 to 50 feet, if he doesn't drop DRT.

Don't sweat the difference--if any--between extermination and sport. Nobody will ever kill the last coyote. Even a full-time highly-experienced professional trapper can only reduce the numbers--not zero out.

, Art
__________________
You're from BATFE? Come right in! I use all your fine products!
Art Eatman is offline  
Old June 24, 2005, 01:26 PM   #12
Capt Charlie
Staff
 
Join Date: March 24, 2005
Location: Steubenville, OH
Posts: 4,314
Quote:
Nobody will ever kill the last coyote.
Probably not. Native Americans called them the "trickster" for a reason. They're smart, and they learn fast! Along with that, they can live on darned near anything. One thing that surprises me of late is their size. I remember seeing lots of them in AZ in the 70's, and they were small and scrawny. The ones I see today are huge! I also noticed that they seem to roam in bigger packs today. Anybody else notice this?
__________________
TFL Members are ambassadors to the world for firearm owners. What kind of ambassador does your post make you?

I train in earnest, to do the things that I pray in earnest, I'll never have to do.

--Capt. Charlie
Capt Charlie is offline  
Old June 24, 2005, 02:39 PM   #13
bclark1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 5, 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,531
4 of them took down a deer in broad daylight darn close to one of the neighbor's houses out in WI. definitely time to cull the pack. back near chicago i'm starting to see them around the suburbs more, too. i was in a gas station parking lot in the chicago burbs a solid 2-3 miles from the nearest forest preserve, which is across a major highway (I294) at that, and saw a decent sized coyote trot by. i did a double-take thinking it was a stray dog at first, but nope!
bclark1 is offline  
Old June 24, 2005, 02:49 PM   #14
kingudaroad
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 11, 2005
Location: austin
Posts: 735
The problem with the 30/30 is the effective range of about 100 yards.Those wily coyotes may not get that close.I'd think youd have better luck with a flatter shooting gun, .223,.243,.25.06. I think a .17 is a bit light.
kingudaroad is offline  
Old June 24, 2005, 06:23 PM   #15
Hello123
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 21, 2005
Posts: 571
If your goal is elimination and not using the hide, use a flat shooting deer rifle if you have one.
Hello123 is offline  
Old June 29, 2005, 10:05 PM   #16
Johnny Guest
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: August 28, 1999
Location: North Texas
Posts: 4,117
I've been messing with a couple of .22 Hornets recently

I'd certainly go for a coyote up to about 150 yards with either one. The little .22H has a surprisingly mild report, compared to the bigger varmint rifles and any of the deer rifles. Neighbors who cheerfully accept pistol and shotgun noise sometimes become nervous when you start lighting off a .30'06 or the like.

Best,
Johnny
__________________
MOLON LABE!
Amendment II ensures the rest of the Bill of Rights.

Blog: Expert Witness
Johnny Guest is offline  
Old June 29, 2005, 10:47 PM   #17
JRLaws
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 8, 2005
Location: Hills of Kentucky, now.
Posts: 177
Quote:
My shot should be well under 100 yards and I need to drop it in it's tracks. Also, the answer is "yes" - this if for extermination not sport.
That sounds like a solid case for the 30/30. The .223 would probably work well, but your 30/30 sounds ideal for these conditions. Throw some accelerators in it if you need to open up the range and you're good to go.

I think the rimfires "could" work, but why use one if "I need to drop it in it's tracks".


JRLaws
JRLaws is offline  
Old July 1, 2005, 08:58 AM   #18
44-40
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 31, 2005
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 180
I would think if hit with anything if not killed he wouldn't come back.A few years ago we were loosing small animals,never saw what was doing it,we have a barnfull of leghold traps but didn't want to catch our animals.Called the county weed And pest,they loaned me a large live trap, had a neighbors dog the next morning, was repaid for the lost animals and the dog was put down.
44-40 is offline  
Old July 1, 2005, 09:49 AM   #19
Wraith
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 22, 2004
Location: The Free State
Posts: 498
Be a man... use a shotgun. j/k
__________________
June 23, 2003
GRATZ et al. v. BOLLINGER et al.
The day America died.


Never Forget 9/11.

Cold dead hands...
Wraith is offline  
Old July 1, 2005, 11:34 AM   #20
MEDDAC19
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 18, 2005
Location: Endless Mts,NEPA
Posts: 379
The 30-30 and the .223 will work, the 22 mag is a little light unless the yote is in close and you can be sure of a clean headshot. Capt Charlie you are right about the size. The coyotes here in PA and OH are slightly different from the ones you used to see out west. These eastern beasts have some wolf genes in them and have a Canadian lineage, which account for their larger size, also they cross with dogs and some offspring are huge. I have seen kills in northeast PA that weighed in at over 70 lbs. One of the reasons coyotes are so hard to eliminate is that they are so adaptable and will eat almost anything. Coyotes also have an ingenious survival adaptation. The more stress that a coyote population is under, whether that stress is human pursuit or lack of food and water, the larger the size of their litter. This seems to work very well for them. Most animals that are starving or under alot of stress will abort or have a smaller numbers of young. It is clear that this technique has worked very well, as coyotes have not been eliminated and are expanding their range.
MEDDAC19 is offline  
Old July 1, 2005, 12:29 PM   #21
Capt Charlie
Staff
 
Join Date: March 24, 2005
Location: Steubenville, OH
Posts: 4,314
Was at the ranch late at night last week and heard a large pack very close. I didn't see 'em, but it sounded like somewhere between 15-20. Made me a little nervous until I looked around and the horses just plain ignored them. Still, my Walther made me feel a little better. That got me to wondering: Has anybody ever heard of coyote predation on a healthy, adult human? As they get bigger and bolder, I'm thinking it's only a matter of time .
__________________
TFL Members are ambassadors to the world for firearm owners. What kind of ambassador does your post make you?

I train in earnest, to do the things that I pray in earnest, I'll never have to do.

--Capt. Charlie
Capt Charlie is offline  
Old July 1, 2005, 03:54 PM   #22
CarbineCaleb
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 27, 2004
Posts: 2,745
Capt: Not that I know of... I guess anything is possible though. My understanding is that their big cousins, grey wolves, which average 100lb, attack people much less frequently than bear, which is not real often.
__________________
“Never express yourself more clearly than you are able to think.”
Niels Bohr
CarbineCaleb is offline  
Old July 1, 2005, 04:06 PM   #23
QuickTrig
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 26, 2005
Location: Iowa
Posts: 157
My Coyote gun would be a Yugo SKS. The 7.62x39 is pretty much ballistically identical to the 30-30, Plus 10 shots in semi-auto, you cant beat that. Saw a case of 900 rnd FMJ's at the shop in 7.62x39, for $119, Not bad.
__________________
Gun safety is my religion....Preach it
QuickTrig is offline  
Old July 2, 2005, 12:18 PM   #24
Johnny Guest
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: August 28, 1999
Location: North Texas
Posts: 4,117
Sorry, I just can't accept the premise.

I understand it is popular to state - -
Quote:
The 7.62x39 is pretty much ballistically identical to the 30-30 . . .
Really, they are a bit farther apart than this indicates.
Remington factory figures show:
.30-30 - - - - 150 gr. RNSP -- MV: 2390 100 yd. vel: 1973 ME: 1902 100 yd. eng: 1296

7.62x39mm - 125 gr. PSP - - MV: 2365 100 yd. vel: 2062 ME: 1552 100 yd. eng: 1180

The .30-30's 25 grain heavier bullet, with the blunt round nose profile, starting at a similar velocity, not only has greater paper energy - - life experience demonstrates that it really does "hit harder."

One point I'll yield: Their trajectories up to about 150 yds is practically identical.
Compare for yourself at the Remington ammo site at:
http://www.remington.com/ammo/ballistics/ballistics.htm

It is easier to fit most any .30-30 with a good aperture sight than an SKS. The .30-30 has the advantage of being able to use 170 gr bullets, in case of need, as in very close range hunting, or if big hogs are the game.

Best,
Johnny
__________________
MOLON LABE!
Amendment II ensures the rest of the Bill of Rights.

Blog: Expert Witness
Johnny Guest is offline  
Old July 3, 2005, 02:13 AM   #25
JRLaws
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 8, 2005
Location: Hills of Kentucky, now.
Posts: 177
I also think it's interesting that the .357mag, from a lever action, is closer to the 7.62 x 39mm than the 30-30.

Buffalo Bore Ammo claims their 125gr. Gold Dot does 2298 fps from the Marlin 1894 w/ 18.5 inch barrel, within 67 fps of the Remington 7.62x39. The 180gr HCLFN does a claimed 1851 fps, putting it just under the 30-30 and way out past the SKS in my opinion. I don't know how the .357 holds up at distance but I'm very impressed with how the lil' fella does out of the muzzle.

I've owned an SKS before and thought it was a fine weapon. I think a lever .357 magnum would give it a run for its money and would probably group better on average.

Just wanted to throw that out there. I always hear the 30-30 and 7.62x39 being compared and think that the .357 needs to be in there as well.

JRLaws
JRLaws is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:56 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.13029 seconds with 7 queries