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Old June 18, 2005, 01:48 AM   #26
Limeyfellow
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Yes it will really **** of people when we get a nuke dropped on us and we won't be able to fire our handguns because of an emp.
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Old June 18, 2005, 02:10 AM   #27
Crosshair
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Garand Illusion

as long as it's proven technology. Trusting our lives to technology/computers is something we do every day whether we think about it or not. Whenever you get on a plane, take a commuter train, when you get in an accident and hope the air bag deploys -- even when you apply your ABS brakes on an icy street

I wish the ABS on my car worked. I need to go in and disable it someday. (Just like the smart guns. ) It works find until you slam hard on the brakes. (Just the best place for them to do that, ) When you do that the "Oh sh*t" light comes on. The best part is that once it quits, the brakes aren't getting the same brake pressure. So until I shut off the car, braking is an interesting experience. The problem is in the cars computer and it is over $1000 to fix it. (I paid only $4,000 for the car.) So I have to put up with it working most of the time.
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Old June 20, 2005, 12:04 AM   #28
Garand Illusion
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Hey Crosshairs ...

Most ABS systems can be disabled just by pulling a fuse (which one depends on model, of course).

I've heard that all NY taxi drivers disable ABS. And I know for a fact there are several ABS systems that just plain make the car more dangerous, sometimes engaging when hitting a bump and causing the driver to rear end the car in front of him ('97 - 98 Isuzu rodeos, and I'm sure there are others).

And of course many off-roaders driving late model vehcile disable abs before going off-road.

To me ... ABS is mostly for people who don't know how to drive real well on ice. Those who do can often do better with their normal "bag of tricks."

I drive well on ice (even race in ice racing competitions in the winter) but still do like ABS on my on-road vehicle. Just my preference.
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Old June 20, 2005, 09:48 AM   #29
Crosshair
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I wish it was that easy. If I just pulled a fuse I would disable my heater/AC blower fan as well as who knows what else. Living in ND, that isn't an option.
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Old June 20, 2005, 10:08 AM   #30
Garand Illusion
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Hey CH ...

bummer they don't have a specific fuse for ABS. Isuzu actually does, so you can disable their ABS quite easily -- just have to get used to seeing the red light on the dashboard.

I guess it depends upon the vehicle and its electric design -- but you're right; don't want to disable anything but the ABS!

Never done this before, but most modern ABS systems have sensors on the axles and wires running back to them. Might be worth looking at to see if pulling those wires would help?

To keep this post gun related, if you decide to shoot the wires out I would suggest a .410 with birdshot so as not to get overpenetration.

IANAM (I Am Not A Mechanic).
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Old June 20, 2005, 01:58 PM   #31
Crosshair
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LOL Garand Illusion I know how to disable it, though it requires a soldering iron and some other tools. The big difficulty is that without it the brakes like to go to 100% with very little pressure applied. It's a big mess really. *Sigh* I miss my old Escort. Only thing powered was the steering and the brakes. (No ABS) Could put the rear seat down and fit more guns in it too.
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Old June 20, 2005, 05:40 PM   #32
Eghad
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What I learned in the military......

electric/computer crap breaks
or they dont have replacment batteries
the middle of nowhere does not have many wall sockets
no substitute for a brain and no. 2 pencil/paper/forms and knowledge of manual procedures
need to know how to read maps the old fashioned way
no substitute for basic marksman ship skills
the more you depend on electronic crap the more it breaks.

so gimme a rifle or pistol withot out any gee whiz stuff
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Old June 22, 2005, 01:50 AM   #33
Garand Illusion
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What I learned from living in the 21st century ...

1. Not every "new fangled" idea is bad -- many of them add to the quality of our lives.
2. Things that are new and scary now will be old hat in 5 years.
3. You can embrace technology or run from it, but it will be part of your everyday life whether you like it or not (but it will be annoying at times -- i.e. cell phones).

Like I said before ... I don't want it forced to be on all weapons, and I'll be waiting to see who embraces it first, but I'm not skeered of it just because it brings another level of sophistication.

And has been said ... of course whatever it is can be defeated. Just like you can defeat tracing a gun by serial number by grinding the serial number off.

But doing the latter will get you in a manure-load worth of trouble!
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Old June 22, 2005, 06:09 AM   #34
Mikkel
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Or.... uh... um..... my gun aint workin, i forgot to change the battery in it. I yell to the BG, wait a minute i have to change the battery or sumthin. Please dont fire your gun while im doing this will u?
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Old June 22, 2005, 10:59 AM   #35
Garand Illusion
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Love playing the devil's advocate ... which is what I'm doing here ...

Quote:
Or.... uh... um..... my gun aint workin, i forgot to change the battery in it. I yell to the BG, wait a minute i have to change the battery or sumthin. Please dont fire your gun while im doing this will u?
Anyone too dumb to replace their batteries once a year is too dumb to carry a gun. And quite frankly the BG is doing us all a favor; he's removing from the gene pool a gun owner who doesn't maintain his equipment and committing an act that will hopefully put him in jail and keep him from reproducing as well (most forced-prison-shower-sex doesn't result in a pregnancy).

All guns need some maintenance. There are any number of reasons they may FTF if not properly maintained, though obviously a battery dead in your scenario would be a show stopper.

Did I mention I DIDN'T want a law that they be put on all guns, but that once the technology is proven it be offered as an option?
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Old June 22, 2005, 11:35 AM   #36
Guy B. Meredith
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Except for preventing gun grabs by bad guys and for toddler tamper proofing, the smart gun will never be 'proven'. I don't carry and I don't have children around so it will not ever be an option for me.

Solder gun at the ready...
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Old June 22, 2005, 06:01 PM   #37
kozak6
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I don't like the idea of smart guns at all. I'm just glad they can't trace Grandpa's guns back to me.
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Old June 22, 2005, 06:39 PM   #38
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Really, I think that I might like a smart gun, assuming it were of the relatively benign doesn't-work-except-for-the-owner variety, and not the tracked-and-computer-controlled variety.

While it's definitely no excuse for poor retention techniques, the peace of mind that a user-keyed weapon might give would be nice. My suggestion on design would be a chip implanted in one's finger that one keys to one's weapon(s). That said, I also understand that most people are squeamish about the idea of getting an implant. However, I would demand that all gun makers standardize on a system so that I only need one implant for all of my smartguns.

As for batteries dying... well, remember to change them. It's not like these are high-consumption devices, so there's no reason that they should need to be replaced more than once a year or something. And if you're that paranoid, change them every 1000 rounds or something. An extra $12 for a battery every couple of months isn't a huge burden.
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Old June 22, 2005, 10:55 PM   #39
Guy B. Meredith
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For my personal taste embedded anything is not an option. Well, maybe a pacemaker, but that need doesn't run in my family.

Alteration of my sacred bod is not part of my lifestyle.
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Old June 23, 2005, 03:15 AM   #40
Mikkel
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ha ha ha ha.... i allways check my batteries and equipment several times a year including my pacemaker. it wouldnt happen to me, but i bet it could happen to lots o people that dont think about what weather does to batteries.
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