The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: The Semi-automatic Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old April 26, 2005, 10:33 AM   #1
grngables
Junior Member
 
Join Date: April 14, 2005
Posts: 7
Barrel length for IDPA (1st handgun)

I'm looking at purchasing my first handgun to shoot in IDPA, either an xd9 or a sig p226 as both of these guns fit my hand best. If I decide on the xd, should I opt for the 4" or 5" barrel if I am going to shoot IDPA? I figure that the longer sight radius would be better for a first timer. and that the 9mm would be better to start with than .40 cal.

Thanks for any input.
grngables is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 11:32 AM   #2
FallenPhoenix
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 2, 2004
Location: Odessa, Tx
Posts: 213
the longer barrel won't really make a noticeable difference in IDPA and if you plan on ever carrying this weapon I'd opt for the 4" bbl. If it's just going to be for the range alone, might as well get the 5" for whatever small advantage it may give.
FallenPhoenix is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 12:34 PM   #3
Jim Watson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 25, 2001
Location: Alabama
Posts: 10,904
I would prefer the XD 5" for its longer sight radius and standard recoil spring. But I would not pay a lot more money for one, the differences are small and the 4" will serve pretty well.

9mm ammunition is much cheaper than .40 and has less recoil which you will definitely notice in a 31 ounce gun.

NOTE: The XD is considered a single action pistol and will enter IDPA in Enhanced Service Pistol versus assorted .38 Super 1911s and heavily massaged Glocks. It doesn't matter to a novice but eventually you might find yourself limited by the gun. MIGHT. EVENTUALLY. The low price of the XD can outweigh that. By the time you are good enough to be helped by a more refined gun, you will probably be ready to buy a new gun anyhow.

QUESTION: Is this your first handgun ever or are you buying something you think better for IDPA than what you already own? If you already have something somewhat suitable, I suggest shooting it for a while before getting a gun especially for the matches.
Jim Watson is online now  
Old April 26, 2005, 12:57 PM   #4
grngables
Junior Member
 
Join Date: April 14, 2005
Posts: 7
This is my first handgun, Jim
grngables is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 01:10 PM   #5
xXStarScreamXx
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 11, 2005
Location: Nor*Cal 707
Posts: 353
Go with the Sig 226, 40 Cal and enjoy.

It's black,scary, reliable and accurate as hell.
__________________
I still don't see why cannibalism is a crime.
xXStarScreamXx is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 01:19 PM   #6
Dave Sample
Junior member
 
Join Date: December 10, 2004
Location: Prescott, AZ
Posts: 1,002
If it is your first handgun, I really don't know what to tell you. Starting out with a 1911 is a hard job and I would not advise a 4" Commander size gun for this shooting discipline. A 5" government size would be hard enough to manage, and the quicker cycle and shorter sight picture of the 4" would not help you a bit. The .380 magnum caliber would be of help, but I don't know why you shoot matches like this with a 9mm handgun. I am sure there is a reason, but I think you would be better served using what the Pro's use and get used to handling a man sized gun and caliber. Just the thoughts from one mind on Tuesday.
Dave Sample is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 01:44 PM   #7
npcolin
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 27, 2005
Posts: 155
which one makes it easier for you to swing around? The one inch difference in length probably does not make a whole lot of difference in an IDPA match since I don't think they have much long range shots.
npcolin is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 01:50 PM   #8
9mmMike
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 6, 2000
Location: SE PA
Posts: 1,049
If you like the way the 226 fits, I'd opt for the SIG. My first handgun was a SIG 228. It is still the gun that I loan to first time shooters. It is a terrific pistol and easy to shoot well, a real confidence-builder.
If you can afford the SIG, it is my opinion that it is a nicer-finished, better-engineered, pistol than the XD.
The XD is OK but more Glock-like in its utilitarian nature. I mostly shoot Glocks now but that SIG is still a real nice pistol.
Good luck with your IDPA adventure.
Mike
__________________
"Freedom is not free"
Visit TheRallyPoint.org
TheRallyPoint at LRGC- Saturday August 26th
IF YOU LIVE IN PA AND DID NOT VOTE, YOU DESERVE TO LOSE YOUR GUNS!
9mmMike is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 03:11 PM   #9
Sturm
Junior member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2005
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 584
9mm Mike, better check the innards of the XD, the locking system down to the removable and replaceable chamber block are SIG! I'll agree with you on the nicer finnish part, even if it's apples and oranges, but the engineering? Too similar until you get to the polymer and then I would say I favor the engineering of the XD over the SIG-PRO, or the Glock!

GrnGables, what Jim Watson told you is entirely correct. The XD Tactical in 9mm will give you a very good start. The bulk of the weight in the XD trigger system comes purely from spring weight. This pistol uses a sear to release the striker just like a 1911 or Browning HP use a sear to release the hammer. Strikers will give a faster lock time than a hammer will. No connector to be replaced and no doubt aftermarket springs to lighten the trigger are coming very soon if they're not already around. You may end up with all the pistol you'll ever need for IDPA! Mine's a .40, but for IDPA, I'd use the 9mm.
Sturm is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 04:21 PM   #10
Handy
Junior member
 
Join Date: August 31, 2001
Posts: 8,785
Sturm,

Glocks also have the same barrel system and removable locking block. Actually, a ton of pistols do, too.
Handy is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 04:50 PM   #11
Sturm
Junior member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2005
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 584
Handy, I meant that the XD's locking block that also provides much stronger rails, is a solid piece of machined steel like that was used without the rails in the SIG-Sauer 220 series. Both the XD's and the Glocks lock-up with chamberblock in slide window are from SIG, and of course a derivative of John Browning, but the most unique of them. I should have explained myself better, because I was referring to the block in the frame and I referred to it as chamberblock. My Mistake! But, you know what I'm talkin' about and the steel block and front rails are replaceabe if ever necessary. It provides a measure of strength that the Glock doesn't. I don't mean to be a Glock basher, but when I look at the XD, I see several areas of innovation over Glock since the HS-2000 first arrived and evaluating it since then in all areas with all polymer pistols makes this the best in my book. Of course Glock was first and the Croations got to evaluate everything previous. Not to mention, the XD Tactical shoots better than any previous forty I have ever owned, alloy, polymer, or steel framed. The only other route I would go in .40 would be the CZ 75, which wouldn't make a bad IDPA pistol either. As I said, to contend with all the gamesmanship previously mentioned, I would go XD Tactical in 9mm and upgrade the trigger and sear springs when they no doubt become available and still be content to compete with anything in class and still have an excellent and safe 9mm Tactical pistol to boot!
Sturm is offline  
Old April 26, 2005, 04:59 PM   #12
Jim Watson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 25, 2001
Location: Alabama
Posts: 10,904
My experience with XD is limited to the occasional "Hey, look at my new gun. Want to try it?" But I found the trigger kind of tough those few times.
A woman in our club started out with one, based on the usual advice from men who assumed her too stupid to operate a thumb safety. Her scores were not very good, even for what you expect at the beginner level and did not improve much with practice. Somebody moved her into a SA 9mm 1911 mutant and business picked up right away with about half the trigger pull and a single stack grip frame she could hold on to.
The XD was more mechanically reliable than a mass produced 1911, but she could fox it some way or another and it refuse to fire. We thought it might be trigger freeze, not letting the trigger reset all the way. The problem did not occur with the 1911.

A P226 is a nicer made pistol, but more expensive new. I have one of the Certified Pre-Owned guns that is in very good condition for a 15 year old police tradein. Heck, it would be considered in good condtion if it were a year old and had spent most of the time in a bureau drawer. And it only cost $459.
The main thing in learning to shoot a a P226 or other DA/SA well is what Jeff Cooper called the crunch-tick; the transition from the first DA shot to the second SA shot. It can be learned, but you have to work at it. I find it more manageable than the eternal mush of a Glock and prefer it to the creepy hard break of the XD. I have shot IDPA SSP with a CZ75 and the next time the urge strikes, it will be with that CPO P226.

Say, Grngables, that would be something else to look at. The CZ75 is famous for the way it sets in your hand. Best used cocked and locked and entered into IDPA ESP, although I have manually uncocked mine to get to the DA start for SSP.


I just don't know what Dave is talking about. I don't know what a .380 Magnum is unless he is ridiculing the 9mm P. The two main reasons to shoot a 9mm in IDPA are the low cost of ammunition and the low recoil... it is the lightest autopistol caliber allowed. And is very common among the Pros who value those characteristics as much as a beginner will. Me? I am now shooting a manly gun, but am having to practice to get out of the flinch as I transitioned from several months of 9mm to .45ACP.
Jim Watson is online now  
Old April 26, 2005, 05:42 PM   #13
Sturm
Junior member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2005
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 584
Jim, good stuff and I agree the trigger was a bit mushy when I first bought the gun. More I shoot it the crisper and lighter it has become. Since a lighter trigger spring and possibly the sear spring, would definitly make a difference and at a very low cost for the dividends.

In the case of the lady shooter, she may not have had a firm enough grasp of the pistol. I don't get into all this limpwristing business, I guess because I've never had a limp wrist. But, not properly applying pressure on the XD's grip safety will get you the same result as it would on a 1911. Light and tunable triggers are the ingredient that makes 1911 so popular and it seems natural to me that she would shoot it better. If she had fired an XD with a 3lb. trigger instead of the one she tried, who knows? XD's don't come with 3lb. triggers folks, but, just as the case with 3.5 lb. connectors on Glocks, someone WILL start selling lighter weight springs for tyhe XD. Just a matter of time! You can bet Rob Leathem's has 'em. In fact the HS-2000's I read about did have 3lb. triggers and I was kind of ticked when Springfield got the rights and we got the USA trigger, spec'd at 5.5-7.7 lbs. Almost kept me from buying one, but I knew there will come a day!

One thing for sure, get a CZ and a trigger job and you'll be in high cotton shooting IDPA and if I'm not mistaken, you can shoot it first shot DA in Service pistol and cocked and locked in Enhanced.
Two-two-two mints in one!
Sturm is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:53 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.09060 seconds with 7 queries