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Old April 27, 2005, 01:50 PM   #1
Jelly
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Trespassing...

Seems that the general firearm owning public believes that shooting someone who is trespassing is a justified act.

Is this true? If someone is on your land, trespassing, but does not brandish a gun, are you justified in your actions?

Any legalities in firing "warning" shots?
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Old April 27, 2005, 02:56 PM   #2
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Not simple trespass. While that is easy to say, the operative words are, fear of eminent, deadly force, which means armed.

From that point the eminent, and deadly are in the eye of the beholder, and there by the grace of God go I.
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Old April 27, 2005, 02:58 PM   #3
mete
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NO ! If someone is trespassing you ask him to leave. If he refuses call the police. Do NOT fire warning shots or threaten with a gun [ reckless endangerment !].
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Old April 27, 2005, 03:00 PM   #4
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Quote:
Seems that the general firearm owning public believes that shooting someone who is trespassing is a justified act.
What lead you to believe that??
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Old April 27, 2005, 03:15 PM   #5
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Uhh I don't think so. Unless he is tresspassing inside your house.
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Old April 27, 2005, 03:17 PM   #6
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Yeah, what FrankDrebin said.

I haven't heard that so I am on your statement.

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Old April 27, 2005, 03:19 PM   #7
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As FrankD asks, how do you conclude that the general firearm owning public believes that. None of my friends believes that.
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Old April 27, 2005, 03:31 PM   #8
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Our property is enclosed with a 6' tall stockade fence, all three gates are kept locked 24/7 - anyone tresspassing inside has made an "extraordinary effort" to make entrance onto our property and I will consider them a "dangerous threat" and use whatever force is neccessary to protect myself & my family from them.
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Old April 27, 2005, 03:46 PM   #9
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Our property is enclosed with a 6' tall stockade fence, all three gates are kept locked 24/7 - anyone tresspassing inside has made an "extraordinary effort" to make entrance onto our property and I will consider them a "dangerous threat" and use whatever force is neccessary to protect myself & my family from them.
I'll come to one of your defense fundraisers if you shoot him as long as the food is good. Do you plan to have kielbasa??? Fresh, or smoked?? Cheesecake?? Beer??
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Old April 27, 2005, 04:46 PM   #10
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Frank,

Just this last January we had a home invasion, in which someone knocked on the door and when I answered the door, violently forced his way into my home.

I was armed at the time and was able to hold the intruder at gunpoint in my living room - fortunately I did not have to discharge my weapon.

I am not gungho on using deadly force on another human being - but if I am ever forced to do so, it will be a justified shoot.
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Old April 27, 2005, 05:47 PM   #11
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puppy

Be careful about your defending the back yard....... What if a teenager just had a few beers with a pal and got lost finding his way home?... your not justified to shoot him in no way shape or form. Same is said about a neighbor out for a walk and is chased to your fence by a big dog. He has the chance to escape danger from dogs teeth and jumps the fence and ends up dead in your back yard? and one other thought is what if it's a mental handicap person and for one reason or another thought your fence was a climbing toy.... I know all these seem a little silly but trust me.....Call police for anything outside your well locked and secured home. It's going to be a tough case to get your freedom back if you smoke someone in your backyard. A six foot fence isn't the same as your front door getting kicked in........
*Self defending and family defending is much different than someone without weapon or means to hurt or cause harm has entered your land or yard. Be very careful and take a deep breath - then call police.


Just some advice that I hope isn't taken in any wrong way....... Good luck
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Old April 27, 2005, 06:03 PM   #12
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Puppy
Quote:
Just this last January we had a home invasion, in which someone knocked on the door and when I answered the door, violently forced his way into my home.

I was armed at the time and was able to hold the intruder at gunpoint in my living room - fortunately I did not have to discharge my weapon.
I've recently noted some 'know-it-all's' around. When it comes to home defense, I don't pretend to know enough about anyone from one post to jump in with both feet. It's obvious to me from the above quote, that puppy doesn't need any advice when it comes to handling a violent home invasion, or protecting his family.
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Old April 27, 2005, 06:10 PM   #13
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Oh yeah, totally justified!! In fact, just the other day, someone who was walking their dog, inadvertantly stepped into my yard, so I took out my new fangled pistol (it is a 9mm, .45 and two .40s welded together!) and blew him away!!
This can't actually be a serious Thread, can it??
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Old April 27, 2005, 07:04 PM   #14
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Trespasser(s) on my property but not in my home? To me, that is cause for elevating my threat awareness, but not enough to pop a cap. Unless, of course, the trespasser(s) are engaging in some felonious activity directed against me/mine. For all I know, the trespasser(s) might be "just passin' through", and no actual threat at all -- no cause for violence. But I'll watch the trespasser(s) like a hawk, just in case.
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Old April 27, 2005, 07:22 PM   #15
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forcible felonies

In the state of Florida, you can only use your gun to protect yourself from bodily harm, a law which was just liberalized by the way, and to prevent someone from commiting a forcible felony. Unless someone is damaging or stealing your property, harming someone, or otherwise being a threat , you need to wait for a cop. Trespassing alone is not enough. You also leave yourself open to aggravated assault charges.
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Old April 27, 2005, 07:31 PM   #16
Jelly
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This is what happens when the original poster is not specific enough in his original comments...

I wasn't talking about someone who has simply wondered onto your property, but those that are committing an "act", such as stealing...
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Old April 27, 2005, 08:08 PM   #17
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Quote:
Frank,

Just this last January we had a home invasion, in which someone knocked on the door and when I answered the door, violently forced his way into my home.
No problem...but like I said before, if you shoot him, just keep me on the email list for your party after you tell the prosecutor you shot the guy for trespassing in your backyard because someone else, who you didn't feel the need to shoot, previously broke into your house with you in it. I like a good party.
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Old April 27, 2005, 08:53 PM   #18
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Last June I was in my gun room , which is a 8' by 20' attachment to my non attached garage made out of 3/4" plywood plus siding and insulated and sheet rocked. I have a humongous safe which when the 2" thick door is swung open blocks the entrance if I open only half of the double entrance door (36"+36") . I was working at my bench on some project with the safe door open and the outside door partially open and the vent fan on the end of room near the bench on.
I had a friend up on my house doing some roofing repair with a helper about 75' away. My yard is fenced on the road and cross fenced for pastures and the driveway is 600' long. I have a Ridgeback/Mastif cross 125 pound dog- who stays on the property and bites strangers if they aren't cool! Listening to a talk show on a Saturday morning I begin to hear a soft voice holding a conversation . It sounded like it was about 50' away and I thought it was the roofer's helper talking to my friend on the roof . But the voice went on and on for about 1/2 hour and I begin to make out weird words and sentence structures. I moved to my safe near the door and listened with the radio and fan off and decided I didn't know who was talking but it sounded like a bizarre monologe! :confused:
I grabbed the closest loaded pistol that would conceal in my sweatshirt- a S&W 296 .44 special loaded with 180 grain XTP Hornady ammo . I closed the safe door partially and looked around the corner of outer door to find a long haired bearded, dirty bum about 30 or so leaning against the back of my garage and haveing a real evil sounding conversation with himself- about 10 feet awy!! :eek:
The gun imm. goes to low ready (2 hands and finger straight along trigger down under eye plane) and I challange the TRESSPASSER with : a strong " what are you doing here?" :mad:
The stranger starts approaching me with his hand extended, I yell: " Stay back, Stay back" and level the gun at his chest. He keeps coming and my finger goes to trigger and I tilt my head down on sights taking a back step and repeating the command to " Stay back" at the top of my voice.
He holds out his hand as if to shake hands and slowly advances oblivious of my gun and I continue to step back keeping about 8 feet from him (too stinkin close!!!!) . My friend the roofer, an old combat amigo of mine from VN and a bar brawlwer if there ever was one :D yells down to me "is there a problem?" *(&^ yes I replied. Right then the guy begins retreating and suddenly his reddened crazed eyes focus on that big .44 muzzle with the cylinder that was beginning it's rotation as he kept coming! He starts saying with his hand out" I was at the party last night Bro, I just wanted to thank you" He was obviously still drunk/stoned from what ever/whereever the party was but I informed him clearly and while being covered that he was to leave right now and never come back! :mad: My friend wanted to get in his face , but I restrained him (and my now present barking dog- who had been harrassing my goats or something in far pasture near the woods) and we escorted the troll to the county road and went back and called the sherrif. The sherrif came about 1/2 hour later ( :rolleyes: ) and I never heard if they contacted him or not.
Bottom line: no lawsuit, I felt safe and in control, I prolly was lucky my friend tilted the odds in my favor enough to wake a whacko up enough to back off the muzzle of a loaded , and ready to go off in a fraction of a second more .44!!!! :D No lawsuits, no cops , no mess! If this would have happened inside my house I think it would have had a different outcome if I couldn't have retreated like I did outside! :)
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Old April 27, 2005, 08:55 PM   #19
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Frank's right. Not an argument; not even a case for argument. Juries have decided hundreds of cases like this. If you cap a person for simple tresspass? Well, remember the first rule of prison: never drop your soap in the shower.
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Old April 27, 2005, 09:07 PM   #20
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Quote:
Seems that the general firearm owning public believes that shooting someone who is trespassing is a justified act.
Perhaps in Texas??
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Old April 27, 2005, 09:16 PM   #21
Puppy
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With regards to my original post in this thread I was attempting to point out that sometimes trespassing isnt always a simple mistake on the trespassers part.

In which I used my 6' tall stockade fence as an example of someone having to exert "extraordinary effort" in order to trespass on my property, therefore I could only reasonably conclude that a trespasser under those conditions to be a "dangerous threat" if I stumbled across them.

Just to clarify one more time - this doesnt mean I would automatically start shooting, it simply means if I catch someone trespassing in my backyard - they are going to be treated as a "dangerous threat".

Of course these are seperate issues from the home invasion, but I posted that reply becouse I thought it demonstrated the fact I am not some trigger happy retard looking for an excuse to plug someone becouse they are in/on my property.
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Old April 27, 2005, 10:12 PM   #22
FrankDrebin
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With regards to my original post in this thread I was attempting to point out that sometimes trespassing isnt always a simple mistake on the trespassers part.
Sorry if I misunderstood, but I thought your post was validating the first post that talked about the idea that most gun owners allegedly think it's OK to shoot trespassers....Also, in this state, it's not "trespassing" unless the property is posted, so your 6 foot stockade fence and locked gates wouldn't necessarily mean that someone in your backyard was fulfilling all of the elements of the misdemeanor crime of trespassing. In this state anyway.


Quote:
Bottom line: no lawsuit, I felt safe and in control, I prolly was lucky my friend tilted the odds in my favor enough to wake a whacko up enough to back off the muzzle of a loaded , and ready to go off in a fraction of a second more .44!!!! No lawsuits, no cops , no mess! If this would have happened inside my house I think it would have had a different outcome if I couldn't have retreated like I did outside!
You were going to shoot a crazy bum outside your house who you had no reason to believe was armed?? There was just a State Trooper here who shot a crazy bum. I think he's gonna be in some trouble....The usual community people were at the guy's funeral talking about what a great guy he was. Lemme see if I can find the article...

http://www.freep.com/news/locway/magoo27e_20050427.htm
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Old April 27, 2005, 11:54 PM   #23
Mike Irwin
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Whether or not a yard enclosed by a fence and locked gate is considered part of your "castle domaine," and can be defended as such, is up to the individual laws of your state.

I pointed a revolver at a drunk who was in my backyard (I also have a 6-foot fence and locked gate) several years ago.

He was in my yard taking a whizz, and when I opened the sliding glass door and told him to stop ******* on my azaleas, he turned and charged at me. He stopped dead in his tracks, and then turned and scrambled back over the fence.
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Old April 28, 2005, 12:19 AM   #24
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Slightly off topic.

Wow! The guy had aunt that was an attonery and was still homeless. Why did all these "friends and faimly" at his funeral not help this poor man be less homeless before he was shot?!?! Nasty situation for all involved.

Years ago, when I lived in Las Vegas, I realized that some form of martial art was needed to supplement firearms. Lots of people become "mentaly impared" for one reason or another and get out of hand. Had I shot every homeless or intoxicated person who approached me "in an aggressive manner" Vegas would have been much more sparse.
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Old April 28, 2005, 05:25 AM   #25
FrankDrebin
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Lots of those wackos prefer to be homeless and don't want to avail themselves of the social safety net, such that it is, that the rest of us pay for.
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