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Old March 22, 2005, 03:03 PM   #76
12-34hom
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The Hood, where's all your proof, you talk about having 70 pages worth.

Let's see it, Know how to run a scanner and download it to this site?

Quote:
I know it was murder no need to debate that
Really, exactly how do you know, prove it. If you have the inventory papers - post them. Let's see all this proof, you say want justice, there are numerous members here with law degree's that can read and interpet them.

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Old March 22, 2005, 03:19 PM   #77
yorec
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I had determined to let this die and only observe this thread, having seen the ignorantly biased yet determined nature of the opposing opinion, but the appearance of The Hood is more than I can stand...

The only "facts" I see here were that the Grand Jury reviewed this situation and found that no criminal act was committed. Period - that's it. The rest is newsroom clutter and the shreiking of those with an axe to grind. (Anti law enforcement, friends of Pace, and maybe a few who are just frightened and/or misled by the first two groups misrepresentations)

Where is this proof of wrongdoing and/or cover up that we were told existed? 70 pages is quite an exhorbitant amount compared to what has actually been shown. All I see here is the eternal whines of "life long friends" that thier buddy was killed...

Sorry for your loss. Really - I'm not unsympathetic, but this hoopla is just that - hoopla.

So, where is this "proof" of murder?
Quote:
Ok, I know it was murder, No need for me to debate that.
Wrong - that IS the debate and your claim is erroneous and rings of falsehoods. I see absolutely nothing that would sway me to believe that what happened in that house was other than the Grand Jury ruled.

In fact, quite the opposite - your story keeps changing. (We've gone from contact shot to the mouth and coming "out the butt" to one entering the head exiting the waist with the second shot coming while he was down and yet we have seen a picture showing two entrance wounds to the chest to "prove" an opposing claim. An autopsy would prove the angle of the second shot... Got the report?) Couple that with the incoherant jibberish such as
Quote:
I know the facts, because I have investigated the case and throw 70 paper across the table to the County attorney and the Sheriff.
Was that an attempted assault you described perpetration against the Sheriff or you pursuing a wrongful death claim agains the SO? (Neither of which would be any kind of proof of anything at all.)

And
Quote:
This cops are out of control and have taken control...
Nice attempt to fan the flames of a fire that burns in many folks all the time anyway, but it has nothing to do with the facts of the case. It is also an outrageous generalization and is patently false.

Quote:
THERE WAS NO METH FOUND!

I have the inventory papers
Really? Post them. Let's see - finally some hard evidence to gaze upon. (Even though, if such was the case, it was probably the result of erroneous reporting by the newspaper anyway and would do nothing of itself to prove wrongful death. But in the interest of actually seeing something solid and proving jsut a wee bit of credibility to yourself... Please show us.)

And finally:
Quote:
What I need is help in getting Justice.

Can you people offer any advice for me?
Sure. Unless you're looking for help in taking some sort of physical action against the police. That would be stupid.

A lawsuit? - naw I think you have no case. But then again, the standard for civil suits is less than that for criminal trials so there's always a chance. (Besides you might get someone like Artsmom on the jury. ) Your claims would never hold up in criminal court - so said the grand jury already - but there's alway that chance in civil court, just ask O.J. A settlement might even be offered in the interest of saving some of the rest of us taxpayers' money in a defese. Hope taking my money away form the other uses makes you feel better.

Time heals all wounds. Your friend died in a terribly violent confrontation in which his death was found to be legally justifiable. My condolences.
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Old March 22, 2005, 03:28 PM   #78
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ATW525 - People with your cavalier attitude about others' lives should not be carrying a gun. You are wishing death upon someone you know little to nothing about. You also seem to show no consideration of what effect accidentally killing someone would have on the unfortunate police officer and his loved ones.
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Old March 22, 2005, 03:43 PM   #79
The Hood
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Well let me charge up my camera, I had been ask to hold back and not let anyone know I had these papers till after the Grand Jury, welp, that time has passed...

do you people really care?

I have been working these case for 3 months now and find that most people have blinders and could care less. I havn't seen MY old Friend since 1992 and I stand up for the Hoods of this United States of America when cops shoot, not once, but twice a man with no pants on. Then with my wife who is a 25 years life insurance investagator have a problem with what we find out, BUT the powers that run things have whitewashed the whole thing in their offices. It's clearly a wrongfull death.

and for 16 cops to walk over a soul and not give no mercy to him..We are not talking about a gang of killers, This is our serve and protect people.

I can post many papers, what will you be doing?? helping me fight for Justice or debating if it was murder? come on, the second was uncalled for...RIGHT???

Where does Justice start??? Not in S.W. Iowa.......

Hood
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Old March 22, 2005, 03:49 PM   #80
yorec
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I see no proof in that post either.

Quote:
come on, the second was uncalled for...RIGHT???
I have no way of knowing that, but if the first one was called for and caused death a second can not be deemed wrongful. Two shots to stop a threat are a very standard trainning practice and more than two are not uncommon at all. They are trainned to shoot until a threat is neutralized, wounded men can be dangerous too.

And apparently the Grand Jury that did have access to all the facts thought there was nothing criminal in it.
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:06 PM   #81
The Hood
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yorec
some peoples blinders will never open, so please take your blinded thoughts elsewhere. your questions make no sense, but maybe I'm assuming you knew about this case and I shouldn't.

do you need the link to all the news reports so you can get up to date? or do you already know how you vote?
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:15 PM   #82
The Hood
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Check out the Farm house, to begain with why did they use the force they used. not ather house within eye's view.

Files to big to download
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:16 PM   #83
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Just do the civil suit and be done with it. Use the 70 pages of evidence and if the jury finds that the SWAT member did commit murder then you can get a lawyer to file re-charges against the member.

Most of the folks here won't do anything unless they have proof. You have proof so go through it and scan what you think would be the most damning evidence and post it here. It may allow some of the members to change their minds. But they aren't going to go off half-cocked just on a few peoples say so.

And no, I'm not an authority lover. I think that LEO's should be brought up on charges if there is proof of criminal behavior but just because this is an LEO doesn't mean that he's automatically guilty until proven innocent, they have the same Rights of innocense until proven guilty.

Like it or not, the Grand Jury decided that the LEO didn't do a criminal act. If you feel that they were wrong then submit your evidence and then start a grass roots movement with fact, not fiction or the voicing of having evidence but not sharing said evidence with those that you seek action.

Wayne
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:20 PM   #84
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Quote:
ATW525 - People with your cavalier attitude about others' lives should not be carrying a gun. You are wishing death upon someone you know little to nothing about. You also seem to show no consideration of what effect accidentally killing someone would have on the unfortunate police officer and his loved ones.
I think Joint/Strike said it best...

Quote:
I would be thrilled if LEO's broke in and killed every meth manufacturer in the country!
Drug pushers are scum and I won't apologize for wishing they were dead. If that offends your sensitive feelings, I really can care less.
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:28 PM   #85
The Hood
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If I may

Throw everything out and start when he was shot.

in the 4 foot wide doorway that was 6 feet from the door the cops came in was a man yelling *** with his hands above his head gets shot. He slumbs over the counter and looks up and get another slug through the mouth with the fire from the barrel burning his face.

are cops suppost to do that?

there was many other ways to arrest this man, and the sheriff had done many times by himself.

the force that went there along with off duty cops went for one thing. and they covered there tracks with friends in the court house.

all I can do is tell you that this kind of stuff happens and no one cares.
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:31 PM   #86
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The fact is that no one has proven he was a drug dealer!!!! That's just what the cops want you to think..and it works
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:34 PM   #87
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ATW525 - So now the woman you wished death upon is a drug pusher? Where do you get that?
I doubt any LEO here would want you as a partner after reading what you have said.
Speaking of sensitive feelings, perhaps you are the one with feelings so sensitive you wish death upon someone with little regard as to whether they are what you think they are, you are so offended.
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:35 PM   #88
The Hood
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how bout I tell you he just came from church and a guy had one hellua deal on a pistol that not one of you would turn down.........


how about if Brett had became a Preacher and was working with people that had drug problems......

Don't beleive nothing you read, The flock gathers
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:40 PM   #89
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You're right, she's probably a fine, upstanding citizen who accidently walked in the wrong living room, not realizing it was the home of a convicted felon and the place where he manufactured his meth and kept his two dozen illegal weapons.... happens all the time...
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:50 PM   #90
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ATW525 - Thank you for your self-damming response.
When in ignorance or doubt, wish death upon somebody.
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Old March 22, 2005, 04:59 PM   #91
wayneinFL
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I've read every post here, and haven't seen any evidence. Just a bunch of internet stories. And newspaper stories.

Internet stories- Yeah, I'm 6'5" and 23 and I'm a doctor. I look like Fabio. Wanna see the picture?

Newspaper stories- Every time I've been involved or someone I trust has been in a story that made it to newspapers or t.v., I found half of what was in the news media was B.S.

This proves to me:

1. newpaper stories and gossip on the internet isn't to be trusted.

2. the officer was right to keep his mouth shut to the media.

I won't repeat some of the views that have been beat into the ground. I do see a lot of the cop-shot-an-unarmed-man stuff. So what if he was unarmed? If the officer shot a man he reasonably believed was armed, and ready to kill him he was justified. Period.



If the Hood has evidence otherwise he should post it here. All I hear is B.S. and excuses. You don't want to post it, fine. Then send me your mailing address; P.O. box is okay. I'm wjbarricklow@hotmail.com. I'll send you $10 for copies and postage- mail those 70 pages to me, if they exist.
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Old March 22, 2005, 05:21 PM   #92
artsmom
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I see we are at a standstill, so I won't repeat this.

For those of you who are willing to take a grand jury's word for this, I suppose you are all content with the O.J. Simpson verdict, correct? I am willing to take the grand jury's verdict, but I still want to form my own opinion, rather than have 12-34hom provide one for me. Any objections to that?

A public service department should never hide behind a "No comment" and they should be able quickly and readily provide the facts and answers to anything as grave as a homicide. It what we should expect as the public, and what they should offer to the public.

As for the girlfriend's version, we are going to have to go with that, unless maybe someone wants to dispute it with the other side's version. No other version being offered by Fullmer, the guy who shot?
The police department? Any of the other agencies? Anyone? No? Then she wins by default.
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Old March 22, 2005, 05:29 PM   #93
The Hood
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I got hundreds of papers

this ain't nothing you can be brought up to speed with in a few posts.
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Old March 22, 2005, 05:31 PM   #94
The Hood
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I believe I have most all the papers.
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File Type: jpg MVC-278S.JPG (17.2 KB, 52 views)
File Type: jpg MVC-279S.JPG (13.2 KB, 48 views)
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Old March 22, 2005, 05:35 PM   #95
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and police reports
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Old March 22, 2005, 05:37 PM   #96
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I have no blinders.

And yes, I am interested in this event. One thing we need to ask is whether the force used to apparently merely retrieve a stolen pistol was justified. Does simple theft justify a SWAT raid? Whatever happened to the knock on the door?

I feel that a very important issue is raised here. Are we as a society going to tolerate armed police raids on the suspicion of theft before other, more peaceful options are explored?

What right does the state have to threaten at the barrel of a gun for the return of stolen property? I cannot organize a posse to raid my neighbor’s house because he stole my lawnmower… why can the state?

Furthermore, I want to know how a ATF agent leaves a handgun unsecured and unattended in a vehicle with someone he cannot trust.

I’m telling you that this whole chain of events stinks to high heaven, from the investigation into gun-for-drug deals to the raid. It seems that several people on this forum don’t respect the fact that a citizen (read non-LEO) can question the actions of those who are supposed to uphold the law.

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Old March 22, 2005, 05:40 PM   #97
yorec
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Quote:
Well let me charge up my camera, I had been ask to hold back and not let anyone know I had these papers till after the Grand Jury, welp, that time has passed...
Great idea - a simple matter to take pics of documents so others can see your proof.
Quote:
do you need the link to all the news reports so you can get up to date? or do you already know how you vote?
No, no, no! Internet chat and newspaper articles are not proof - they are full of lies, BS, and erroneous opinion. I want to see real proof.
Quote:
Check out the Farm house, to begain with why did they use the force they used. not ather house within eye's view.
Uh, not familiar with it - is the local of a shooting somehow indicitive of justification? Fill us in here...
Quote:
Files to big to download
No - dont' chicken out that easily. File sizes are easy to change so that the uploading of a picture can be done. Don't know how, we can walk you thorugh it. Don't need all 70 pages anyway - just asking for a few to establish the slightest hint of credibility. (Which you don't have as yet as far as I'm concerned...)

And thanks to wayneinFL for putting his money where his mouth is on that matter! I'd not volunteer $10 of my money to someone whose word I doubt in the first place. Take him up on it!
Quote:
in the 4 foot wide doorway that was 6 feet from the door the cops came in was a man yelling *** with his hands above his head gets shot. He slumbs over the counter and looks up and get another slug through the mouth with the fire from the barrel burning his face.
Again - proof of this claim? Your version of the events is not proof and is still unsuported by real evidence. Remember the old saying - "Opinions are like a@#$%^#@. Everyone has one and it stinks..... And this one still stinks to me. Must be my BS detector, sigh.
Quote:
The fact is that no one has proven he was a drug dealer!!!! That's just what the cops want you to think..and it works
Ok - was there or was there not a meth lab in use in the house? Anyway - what's the relationship to wrongful death? (I don't care if he was a dope dealer or not. I don't personally believe all dope dealers need to be shot, imprisoned yes, just not shot. But it also doesn't in any way preclude them from such if they pose a threat individuals encountering them.)
Quote:
how bout I tell you he just came from church and a guy had one hellua deal on a pistol that not one of you would turn down.........

how about if Brett had became a Preacher and was working with people that had drug problems......
Uh - more proof or are these hypothetical suggestions to muddy the water?
Quote:
Don't beleive nothing you read, The flock gathers
First thing you've said I can wholeheartedly agee with!!! Congrats.

Quote:
As for the girlfriend's version, we are going to have to go with that, unless maybe someone wants to dispute it with the other side's version. No other version being offered by Fullmer, the guy who shot?
I'll take the Grand Jury decision, thanks.
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Old March 22, 2005, 05:41 PM   #98
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Cool Hood, ya posted while I was writing - off to check out your pics!
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Old March 22, 2005, 05:41 PM   #99
The Hood
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people. I not trying to jurk your chain, I know what I know and it's not good, but for the State of the State, we must go with the State and not rock the boat.

untill you have something like this hit home, you will never reallize that this happens and we just agree to believe what we are told and what best for us.

This shooting wasn;t right and never will be. Debating what I believe already from countless hours not wanting to believe that our law enforcement would just out right kill someone, but I have found that that happens and we should not take a stand for justice when it does
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Old March 22, 2005, 05:51 PM   #100
yorec
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All right, now we're getting somewhere.... sort of.

You have some copys of documents relating to the incident, appears. But the only thing I can tell about the incident from the pics you posted was that he was hit twice in the chest - of which one round exited a the waist area, just above the right buttock. So that collaborates with both your statements that it came out his butt and waist area - I can understand that these statements, which appear contradictory on the face were both true. But I still don't see the "shot in the face" claim. Looks like two to the chest to me...

Care to post the officer's report in detail enough we can read the officer's own words, what he saw when he entered up until the time he shot?
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