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Old February 24, 2005, 02:00 PM   #1
iko
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S&W M&P/model 10 identification.

Heya. Long time occasional lurker, first time poster, etcetera...

I'm wondering if anyone out there has a pointer towards a good resource for identifying/dating a Smith and Wesson Military and Police revolver/Model 10.

It's a five-digit, numeric only serial number. I /thought/ that it was a 1940-45 date of manufacture, however, when I called up S&W's customer service to attempt to verify that, they came back with... 1906? That can't be correct, neh?

Much appreciated.
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Old February 24, 2005, 03:01 PM   #2
Mike Irwin
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Where are you getting the 5 numbers from?

Stamped on the butt?

If there's only 5 numbers stamped on the butt, yes, it would be very early.

S&W hit the 100,000 mark sometime early in the 1920s, IIRC.
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Old February 24, 2005, 03:25 PM   #3
care-less
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It probably is a very early M&P. It is not a model 10. Smith didn't start using model numbers until much later. Five digit serial number is an oldie.
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Old February 24, 2005, 06:59 PM   #4
Russ5924
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You may find something in www.handloads.com they show the Model 10 was made starting in 1899 On the right handside under information you will see the S&W info.
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Old February 24, 2005, 08:54 PM   #5
iko
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>>Mike Irwin:
>>Where are you getting the 5 numbers from?
>>Stamped on the butt?
>>If there's only 5 numbers stamped on the butt, yes, it would be very early.
>>S&W hit the 100,000 mark sometime early in the 1920s, IIRC.

I haven't had a firsthand look at the pistol in the better part of a decade. This is all part of attempting to sort out an intra-familial, across state lines, FFL transfer into California. (Send booze. And backup. In that order, please.)

I'm getting the serial# from my father's dealer, out in Utah. She's a competent gal, so I presume she gave me the frame serial#. And since this was originally my grandfather's pistol, a 1906 manufacture isn't entirely out of the question, it just strikes me as... odd.

Either way, I'm certainly going to have to verify things firsthand. But thanks for the double-check.
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Old February 24, 2005, 10:41 PM   #6
Sir William
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I don't think it is a M10 or a M&P. I think it is a Model of 1905. Have the lady send you the stamping from the sidees and top of the barrel, the assembly numbers from under the barrel and the Ser # from the butt. Ask her to describe the rear sight also.
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Old February 25, 2005, 12:13 PM   #7
Mike Irwin
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S&W's assembly numbers were often 5 digits, and many, many people mistake them for the actual serial number.

The important thing is to figure out where those numbers came from.

Over the years I've seen many very early .38 S&Ws, but I've seen many much later ones that people have mistaken for early ones because they're getting the serial number from the wrong spot.
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Old March 7, 2005, 09:15 PM   #8
iko
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Update for curiosity's sake:

You were correct, the "serial #" communicated to me was not the frame serial. Didn't find where they got it from in the quick visual inspection earlier today (joys of 10-day waiting periods, it'll have to wait for a more thorough going over), but the butt serial number puts it more in the timeframe I was expecting (V622xxx).

Thanks much for the insight.
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Old March 7, 2005, 10:59 PM   #9
Mike Irwin
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That's a World War II production gun.
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Old March 7, 2005, 11:52 PM   #10
BillCA
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What you have is a S&W "Victory" Model revolver.

Officially it is the .38 Military And Police "Victory" Model.
Serial numbers ranged from V-1 to V-769000. Made between 1942-1945, 242291 were manufactured. The butt of the gun should have an oval shaped lanyard ring. Finishes range from standard blue to (most) parkerized.

Many of these guns saw service with aircrews (instead of the 1911) in both the USAAF and the USN. They were also used by base MP's on the home-front and by defense plant security personnel, such as at Boeing, GM, Grumman, North American Aviation, et al. Some merchant sea captains were also armed with their personal "Victory" model.

Markings:
Most issued to the military were marked "U.S. Government Property" on the topstrap. You'll likely find the markings "GHD" somewhere on the frame (S&W inspector Guy H. Drewry). Guns marked "U.S. Navy" or "United States Navy" are collectible, as are 2" barreled specimens and those with Israeli markings.

Carefully inspect the caliber stamping on your gun's barrel. If it reads .38 S&W Special Ctg then the gun is chambered for that round. Some of the Victory models were exported to Great Britain. These will have barrels marked .38 S&W Ctg. The .38 S&W cartridge is shorter and fatter than the .38 Special (as well as lower powered). If a .38 Special cartridge fits easily into the cylinder it may have been converted after the war to .38 Special. Have a competent gunsmith check these guns out as some of these conversions were poorly done.

Most of the British .38 S&W's will have an ordinance stamp with a Crown and "BNP" on the left rear of the barrel. Markings of 38/200 indicate the British nomenclature for the .38 S&W cartridge.

In perfect condition your gun would be worth $400. In V.G. condition it is worth about $225 unless it is one of the collectible variants.

My father bought one of these in 1948 for about $30~$35. It's a decent shooter even though it's one of the "converted" .38 S&W guns. It is still "on duty" as a defensive gun at my 82 year old mother's house.
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