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Old November 4, 2002, 12:22 PM   #1
RdNckMaterialCulture
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What's the best PPK clone?

RIght now the most promising models (based mostly on price, to be honest) are the Makarovs and the CZ 70. What are some other good PPK-style pistols to consider? Any opinions on which are the best?
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Old November 4, 2002, 12:26 PM   #2
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Bersa is one of the best values. Check out the review on www.gunblast.com
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Old November 4, 2002, 12:29 PM   #3
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Thanks. I'll check it out.

Oh, and apologies if the PPK wasn't the originator of this style...it was the first of this style that I know of, so I tend to think of that shape as belonging first to the PPK. But I haven't really done my research, so I might be way off.
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Old November 4, 2002, 01:28 PM   #4
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Hey, that Bersa does look to be a much nicer pistol for only a little bit more money.

Any other options, currently produced or otherwise?
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Old November 4, 2002, 01:57 PM   #5
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Manhurin for a clone.
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Old November 4, 2002, 02:36 PM   #6
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SIG P232 is a wonderful "PPK" type gun. IMO, its much better than the Walther.

For a cheaper version, the Bersa (Argentine) is a good value for the money.

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Old November 4, 2002, 04:24 PM   #7
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Another vote for the SIG P232
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Old November 4, 2002, 04:27 PM   #8
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"Oh, and apologies if the PPK wasn't the originator of this style..."

Don't apologize. It is. Actually, it is derived from the Walther PP, but those two models originated this style.

The Bersas are probably the way to go; they are the best value for the money. I honestly prefer the 9x18 pistols (which are more Walther PP size), but the Bersa .380s are tough to beat.
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Old November 4, 2002, 07:37 PM   #9
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Check out the Bersa if you don't want a surplus. I was going for a Makarov, but a bargain on a Bersa came up. I've always liked the ppk style of pistol, but had heard horrible things about hammer bite and reliability issues. My Bersa, a Thunder 380 is stainless, shoots very well and I had not problems what so ever. I was shooting it and my Kimber and it is a very different feel (I can't believe I sold my Mustang) but you get use to it. I only shot 64 rounds, a box of umc and two mags of hrdra-shocks, but I'm sold!

tjg
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Old November 4, 2002, 07:57 PM   #10
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OK...do you want a gun styled after the PPK/same size/weight?
As far as I know there arent any real PPk Clones out there...just guns that are styled after them. For a gun the same size youre looking at Bersa/Firestorms and FEG's PMK/SMC series. The Bersa is the smoother of the two...but the FEG is a dependable little gun.
The Sig is another great choice, its just bigger than the rest. It fits the size range of the BDA/CZ 83 better than even the PP Walther.
For a good gun in the PPK realm...Bersa.
Shoot well
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Old November 4, 2002, 08:05 PM   #11
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I was looking at the Bersa's and really like those. I made a point to look up reviews on them, because they're "budget" guns, but I couldn't find anything negative about them, and most people really loved them.
I almost bought a CZ-70 recently, but didn't for a couple reasons. I read a lot of collector's stuff about them, and they seemed to have a lot of jamming problems. Also, while they're not large, they're fairly heavy for their size.
I basically decided against the CZ because it was only .32 (compared to the Bersa at .380) and was larger and heavier than the Bersa. They're both nice, but I'd trust the Bersa a bit more because of what I've read on top of the slightly larger caliber.
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Old November 4, 2002, 11:53 PM   #12
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feg model apk in .380. mcole
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Old November 5, 2002, 12:05 AM   #13
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Sig and CZ. CZ looks less like the Walther but it's a good pistol.
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Old November 5, 2002, 01:56 AM   #14
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I can't say much about the Sig, but the CZ 82/83 is not a PPK clone in any way, shape, or form. It has a manual safety that allows C&L. It is double-stack with an ambi safety. It is at least Walther PP size, and it doesn't look like a Walther at all.

It is a darn good pistol, though.

Eric is right. Almost all PPK-styled pistols are of a simplified design. The Manhurins really are Walthers under a license arrangement. Manhurin is a firm located in eastern France. From 1945-1955, West Germany was not permitted to manufacture arms. As I recall, the Walther factory was in East Germany, but the personnel etc. fled to the Western occupation zone.
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Old November 5, 2002, 03:49 AM   #15
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I would suggest taking a good look at the Bersa/Firestorm..... I have had one for about a year and really love it. It is well made and has had no problems to date. The bersa has had no ammo related problems to date either. Plus it is really accurate for what it is. I really dont think there is a better buy on the market for around 200 bucks.

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Old November 5, 2002, 06:59 AM   #16
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If you want a cheap reliable clone, the bersa is pretty good.
I think the sig 232 is better than the original PP/PPK/PPKS, IMHO.
It's a little spendy compared to the bersa, though.
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Old November 5, 2002, 12:48 PM   #17
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"I really dont think there is a better buy on the market for around 200 bucks."

There just isn't one. The Bersa is kind of in a weird price range, though. It is more than most of the Eastern European 9x18 pistols, but almost $100 less than the Grade A 9x18 pistols (CZ, Simson-Suhl, and Radom). It is considerably less than the "big name" .380s. It is the best buy at $200, almost by default.
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Old November 5, 2002, 11:39 PM   #18
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Makarovs are unbeatable if you take care of them, keep the firing pin channel clean. A mak is a better buy than, say, the PA-63 simply because the Maks behave better in the hand...the PA-63 is a bit to much of a recoil-brute due it's aluminum frame and wierd backstrap.

For the money, I'd rather have a SIGP230 than a PP/K.
Very smooth, reliable,I don't get the hammer bite. Better looking, IMHO.
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Old November 5, 2002, 11:42 PM   #19
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The Wolff Gunspring upgrade makes the PA-63 behave like a Mak. I would still recommend getting a Bulgarian first. The PA-63 is a perfect second 9x18 pistol.
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Old November 6, 2002, 12:21 AM   #20
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I'll agree with those who said the Bersa is one of the best deals out there.

I have a Russian (mis marked Bulgaria) Makarov and a Bersa Thunder .380. Both have been 100% reliable and both are very accurate.
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Old November 6, 2002, 01:34 AM   #21
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Uh, Johnny Quest, are you OK? Would you like an "intervention" or a meds adjustment? By the way I was a big JQ fan in my youth. But that was then, and this is... Tell us that you can fill in the blank. :-)
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Old November 6, 2002, 05:36 AM   #22
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Beautiful yet inexpensive. Bersa has got my vote!
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Old November 6, 2002, 11:55 AM   #23
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Manurhin.
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Old November 6, 2002, 01:07 PM   #24
jar
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My choices would be in this order.

SiG 230 or 232 with the alloy frame.



East German Makarov in 9mm Mak.



Bersa Thunder.

The NEW S&W modified PPK.

the CZ

Most everything else.

Walther PPK.
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Old November 6, 2002, 05:40 PM   #25
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Look at all these posts from people who picked the Bersa!

It just goes to show you that sometimes, inexpensive pistols (some of the uninformed call "saturday night specials") are, in fact quite good. It'd be a shame if some politician somewhere is plotting against the Bersa just because it's an inexpensive pistol. Oh, that's right--NOW they've got OTHER things to worry about. (Snicker)

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