How many compete in IDPA with a J-frame

Alex Johnson · August 20, 2002, 03:48 PM

I just recently completed my fourth match in IDPA, to date all I've used is a Glock 22. However, I realize that this is not the gun that I carry, I bought it for IDPA and that's all it is used for. My carry gun is an old S&W model 60 in 38 special. I've finally decided to use the j-frame even though it's going to be a severe handicap, so I'm just curious who else uses these guns in IDPA.

braindead0 · August 20, 2002, 04:16 PM

I'm using an EAA Windicator with a 2" barell. Not quite the same thing (bigger I think) and 6-shots... but a shorty ;-)

Ricky T · August 20, 2002, 10:49 PM

The two local IDPA clubs in the Atlanta area sometimes hold BUG only matches. I shot those matches with my 642.

Neil Casper · August 20, 2002, 10:55 PM

I use my S&W 940 in BUG IDPA matches and have used it a few times in club IDPA matches just for the practice and the fun of it.

It definitely is a lot harder to shoot fast and accurate compared to a K-frame or HiPower.

braindead0 · August 21, 2002, 08:11 AM

I've never had much problem with the shorty and shooting IDPA, luckily the Windicator is pretty heavy (32oz I believe) so I've never had much trouble with follow ups.

And I can shoot both SSR and BUG ;-)

ACP230 · August 21, 2002, 09:32 AM

I shot a match with a Colt Cobra once. Even with my reloads it started to slam the joint on my middle finger. My finger got sore enough that I had to stick target pasters on it to take some of the sting out.
I think my Smith 649 would do better due to the rubber boot grips, but so far no BUG matches have been held in my area.
I'm thinking of buying a two and a half inch Smith 66 which would simulate a snubby fairly well, while having six shots and decent sights.

Alex Johnson · August 21, 2002, 11:09 AM

Figure I'll just buy about 4 speed loaders and a belt pouch to hold them. I'll be at a disadvantage for reloading, but I don't think that the accuracy will be too much of a problem. Aside from one incident where we engaged targets at 100 yards, most of the shooting we do is under 50 yards and I know that I can hit man size targets at that distance if I take my time.

Ricky T · August 21, 2002, 01:18 PM

ACP230 said: "I'm thinking of buying a two and a half inch Smith 66 which would simulate a snubby fairly well, while having six shots and decent sights."

While you can shoot the 66 in BUG class, you can only load 5 rounds in the gun.

braindead0 · August 21, 2002, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Aside from one incident where we engaged targets at 100 yards, most of the shooting we do is under 50 yards

Did you perhaps mean feet?? 100yds seems a bit long for IDPA..

ACP230 · August 21, 2002, 03:34 PM

There aren't any BUG matches here, as far as I know. I'd just shoot the short M66 in regular matches and hope the experience translates to me snubby shooting.

Alex Johnson · August 21, 2002, 04:55 PM

No, this last IDPA match they held in East Grand Forks, they had a segment of the match where you engaged 3 targets at 100 yards with 12 shots. You could do it in any shooting position you wanted too. This was a difficult stage due mainly to high winds and not knowing the bullets drop at 100 yards. Most people managed to connect with the target at least a couple times, I think the best score was about 7 hits. I'm going to make a point of learning how much my bullets drop at the 100 yards in the future in case they pull that one out of their hats again.

braindead0 · August 21, 2002, 05:04 PM

What reasonable defensive situation has you sniping people at 100yds? I guess a sniper attacking you and there's no cover to be found anywhere??

Alex Johnson · August 21, 2002, 11:04 PM

I recall reading an article by Massad detailing an incident that happend in the late 70's early 80's where at least one police officer was killed and several wounded when a man with a rifle engaged them from his front porch. None of the officers present had a rifle and one officer in particular was about a hundred yards away engaged the assailant with a 1911 pistol. The man was a competition shooter who had never tried shooting a target with a pistol at 100 yards. He was holding over the mans body by a considerable ammount but never connected with any of the several shots that he fired. After the incident was over, ended by another LEO with a shotgun slug, a neat cluster of the 1911 shooters bullets were found several inches over the spot that the assailant was standing. Good shooting under a stressful situation, but just the wrong estimation for elevation. This is anything but a common situation that somebody carrying a handgun for self protection would likely find themselves in, but it probably does happen more frequently for LEO's that all to common are found undergunned in some situations. It was an interesting scenario and one that was developed during the very beginning of the IDPA competition.

braindead0 · August 22, 2002, 08:05 AM

I suppose it's a reasonable scenario for an LEO, but.. If I was in that situation, I'm sure I could find a way to get out of the line of fire or at least get to a rifle. I have no problem firing at 100yd targets, with an appropriate pistol... my 2" CCW weapon isn't the one

9x45 · August 22, 2002, 11:36 AM

What happened to most shots should be kept at 3-15 yards for IDPA matches?

braindead0 · August 22, 2002, 11:45 AM

Well, from what I can tell.. the official wording is 75% of shots in a match with the occasional COF requiring longer shots (35yard I think). Which would certainly allow for a COF with lots of long shots.

Not that I've been doing this long, but this is the first I've heard of 100yd targets.

**Johnny Guest** · August 22, 2002, 12:20 PM

- - -and one with my Colt Agent. Had fun but didn't cover myself with glory in either match.

I think it is a very good thing to not only practice with the small carry sidearms, but to do so under match stress at least once or twice a year. It brings to mind some problems you don't see, just burning a box of ammo in a relaxed plinking or target setting.

In years past, I won a lot of Cokes and beer, shooting an old M36 at 100 and even 200 yards. It CAN be done, but it's a whole 'nother ball game.

Best,
Johnny Guest

mr. pitiful · August 26, 2002, 10:03 PM

Glad to see you make it to the match Alex. There is a steel challenge match on the fourteenth, and I will be designing the courses the week after at our regular IDPA match. And I promise, no 100 yard shots, that was a bit far for me. Was not my favorite stage. Our next club match will have some fun stuff.

Todd
A.K.A mr. pitiful

Poohgyrr · August 27, 2002, 12:48 PM

Between work and family obligations I've missed too many of our 1st Sunday of the month IDPA matches.

We're planning a BUG sidematch soon, and I plan to use my 640 in that. Otherwise, I'm taking a snub .357 or .44 Spec to the next match to see how I do compared to my favorite Hi Power. Every match is fun, and keeps my head on straight about my abilities.

G3 · September 9, 2002, 01:03 PM

If a j-frame can't shoot the stage successfully, than the stage is most likely not realistic. The weapon most used to kill police officers is still the .38 revolver.

106RR · September 15, 2002, 04:33 AM

I used a 442 in a BUG match. These are usually side matches with a fairly short (10 yds) COF. Any BUG is legal. The gamers will use G26, S&W15 2",etc. The true IDPA shooters will use what they carry. We have had Tomcats, P32, Rossi 38, and a lot of j frames.

106RR · September 15, 2002, 04:33 AM

I used a 442 in a BUG match. These are usually side matches with a fairly short (10 yds) COF. Any BUG is legal. The gamers will use G26, S&W15 2",etc. The true IDPA shooters will use what they carry. We have had Tomcats, P32, Rossi 38, and a lot of j frames.

August 20, 2002, 03:48 PM	#1
Alex Johnson Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2000 Location: Grand Forks, ND Posts: 784	How many compete in IDPA with a J-frame I just recently completed my fourth match in IDPA, to date all I've used is a Glock 22. However, I realize that this is not the gun that I carry, I bought it for IDPA and that's all it is used for. My carry gun is an old S&W model 60 in 38 special. I've finally decided to use the j-frame even though it's going to be a severe handicap, so I'm just curious who else uses these guns in IDPA. __________________ I thoroughly disapprove of duels. I consider them unwise and I know they are dangerous. Also, sinful. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet retired spot and kill him. - Mark Twain

August 20, 2002, 04:16 PM	#2
braindead0 Senior Member Join Date: February 28, 2002 Location: Canton, Oh Posts: 896	I'm using an EAA Windicator with a 2" barell. Not quite the same thing (bigger I think) and 6-shots... but a shorty ;-) __________________ DoD# 2223 Meum scapha volitare plenum anguillae

August 20, 2002, 10:49 PM	#3
Ricky T Senior Member Join Date: July 20, 1999 Location: ATL, GA Posts: 197	The two local IDPA clubs in the Atlanta area sometimes hold BUG only matches. I shot those matches with my 642. __________________ "Less yacking and more cacking" SDH

August 20, 2002, 10:55 PM	#4
Neil Casper Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Ohio Posts: 44	I use my S&W 940 in BUG IDPA matches and have used it a few times in club IDPA matches just for the practice and the fun of it. It definitely is a lot harder to shoot fast and accurate compared to a K-frame or HiPower. __________________ "I AM my brothers keeper."

August 21, 2002, 08:11 AM	#5
braindead0 Senior Member Join Date: February 28, 2002 Location: Canton, Oh Posts: 896	I've never had much problem with the shorty and shooting IDPA, luckily the Windicator is pretty heavy (32oz I believe) so I've never had much trouble with follow ups. And I can shoot both SSR and BUG ;-) __________________ DoD# 2223 Meum scapha volitare plenum anguillae

August 21, 2002, 09:32 AM	#6
ACP230 Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2000 Posts: 708	I shot a match with a Colt Cobra once. Even with my reloads it started to slam the joint on my middle finger. My finger got sore enough that I had to stick target pasters on it to take some of the sting out. I think my Smith 649 would do better due to the rubber boot grips, but so far no BUG matches have been held in my area. I'm thinking of buying a two and a half inch Smith 66 which would simulate a snubby fairly well, while having six shots and decent sights. __________________ "To disarm the people (is) the best & most effectual way to enslave them." George Mason.

August 21, 2002, 11:09 AM	#7
Alex Johnson Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2000 Location: Grand Forks, ND Posts: 784	Figure I'll just buy about 4 speed loaders and a belt pouch to hold them. I'll be at a disadvantage for reloading, but I don't think that the accuracy will be too much of a problem. Aside from one incident where we engaged targets at 100 yards, most of the shooting we do is under 50 yards and I know that I can hit man size targets at that distance if I take my time. __________________ I thoroughly disapprove of duels. I consider them unwise and I know they are dangerous. Also, sinful. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet retired spot and kill him. - Mark Twain

August 21, 2002, 01:18 PM	#8
Ricky T Senior Member Join Date: July 20, 1999 Location: ATL, GA Posts: 197	ACP230 said: "I'm thinking of buying a two and a half inch Smith 66 which would simulate a snubby fairly well, while having six shots and decent sights." While you can shoot the 66 in BUG class, you can only load 5 rounds in the gun. __________________ "Less yacking and more cacking" SDH

August 21, 2002, 03:34 PM	#10
ACP230 Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2000 Posts: 708	There aren't any BUG matches here, as far as I know. I'd just shoot the short M66 in regular matches and hope the experience translates to me snubby shooting. __________________ "To disarm the people (is) the best & most effectual way to enslave them." George Mason.

August 21, 2002, 04:55 PM	#11
Alex Johnson Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2000 Location: Grand Forks, ND Posts: 784	No, this last IDPA match they held in East Grand Forks, they had a segment of the match where you engaged 3 targets at 100 yards with 12 shots. You could do it in any shooting position you wanted too. This was a difficult stage due mainly to high winds and not knowing the bullets drop at 100 yards. Most people managed to connect with the target at least a couple times, I think the best score was about 7 hits. I'm going to make a point of learning how much my bullets drop at the 100 yards in the future in case they pull that one out of their hats again. __________________ I thoroughly disapprove of duels. I consider them unwise and I know they are dangerous. Also, sinful. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet retired spot and kill him. - Mark Twain

August 21, 2002, 05:04 PM	#12
braindead0 Senior Member Join Date: February 28, 2002 Location: Canton, Oh Posts: 896	What reasonable defensive situation has you sniping people at 100yds? I guess a sniper attacking you and there's no cover to be found anywhere?? __________________ DoD# 2223 Meum scapha volitare plenum anguillae

August 21, 2002, 11:04 PM	#13
Alex Johnson Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2000 Location: Grand Forks, ND Posts: 784	I recall reading an article by Massad detailing an incident that happend in the late 70's early 80's where at least one police officer was killed and several wounded when a man with a rifle engaged them from his front porch. None of the officers present had a rifle and one officer in particular was about a hundred yards away engaged the assailant with a 1911 pistol. The man was a competition shooter who had never tried shooting a target with a pistol at 100 yards. He was holding over the mans body by a considerable ammount but never connected with any of the several shots that he fired. After the incident was over, ended by another LEO with a shotgun slug, a neat cluster of the 1911 shooters bullets were found several inches over the spot that the assailant was standing. Good shooting under a stressful situation, but just the wrong estimation for elevation. This is anything but a common situation that somebody carrying a handgun for self protection would likely find themselves in, but it probably does happen more frequently for LEO's that all to common are found undergunned in some situations. It was an interesting scenario and one that was developed during the very beginning of the IDPA competition. __________________ I thoroughly disapprove of duels. I consider them unwise and I know they are dangerous. Also, sinful. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet retired spot and kill him. - Mark Twain

August 22, 2002, 08:05 AM	#14
braindead0 Senior Member Join Date: February 28, 2002 Location: Canton, Oh Posts: 896	I suppose it's a reasonable scenario for an LEO, but.. If I was in that situation, I'm sure I could find a way to get out of the line of fire or at least get to a rifle. I have no problem firing at 100yd targets, with an appropriate pistol... my 2" CCW weapon isn't the one __________________ DoD# 2223 Meum scapha volitare plenum anguillae

August 22, 2002, 11:36 AM	#15
9x45 Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2000 Location: Southern California Posts: 505	What happened to most shots should be kept at 3-15 yards for IDPA matches?

August 22, 2002, 11:45 AM	#16
braindead0 Senior Member Join Date: February 28, 2002 Location: Canton, Oh Posts: 896	Well, from what I can tell.. the official wording is 75% of shots in a match with the occasional COF requiring longer shots (35yard I think). Which would certainly allow for a COF with lots of long shots. Not that I've been doing this long, but this is the first I've heard of 100yd targets. __________________ DoD# 2223 Meum scapha volitare plenum anguillae

August 22, 2002, 12:20 PM	#17
Johnny Guest Moderator Emeritus Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,115	Shot one with a Mod 37 - - - - - -and one with my Colt Agent. Had fun but didn't cover myself with glory in either match. I think it is a very good thing to not only practice with the small carry sidearms, but to do so under match stress at least once or twice a year. It brings to mind some problems you don't see, just burning a box of ammo in a relaxed plinking or target setting. In years past, I won a lot of Cokes and beer, shooting an old M36 at 100 and even 200 yards. It CAN be done, but it's a whole 'nother ball game. Best, Johnny Guest __________________ MOLON LABE! Amendment II ensures the rest of the Bill of Rights. Blog: Expert Witness

August 26, 2002, 10:03 PM	#18
mr. pitiful Member Join Date: March 26, 2000 Posts: 42	Glad to see you make it to the match Alex. There is a steel challenge match on the fourteenth, and I will be designing the courses the week after at our regular IDPA match. And I promise, no 100 yard shots, that was a bit far for me. Was not my favorite stage. Our next club match will have some fun stuff. Todd A.K.A mr. pitiful

August 27, 2002, 12:48 PM	#19
Poohgyrr Senior Member Join Date: June 26, 2002 Location: Northern CA Posts: 151	Between work and family obligations I've missed too many of our 1st Sunday of the month IDPA matches. We're planning a BUG sidematch soon, and I plan to use my 640 in that. Otherwise, I'm taking a snub .357 or .44 Spec to the next match to see how I do compared to my favorite Hi Power. Every match is fun, and keeps my head on straight about my abilities. __________________ John Northern CA "Life brings sorrows and joys alike. It is what a man does with them - not what they do to him - that is the true test of his mettle." T. Roosevelt

September 9, 2002, 01:03 PM	#20
G3 Senior Member Join Date: September 25, 2000 Location: Central Indiana Posts: 138	If a j-frame can't shoot the stage successfully, than the stage is most likely not realistic. The weapon most used to kill police officers is still the .38 revolver.

September 15, 2002, 04:33 AM	#21
106RR Senior Member Join Date: July 10, 2002 Posts: 216	I used a 442 in a BUG match. These are usually side matches with a fairly short (10 yds) COF. Any BUG is legal. The gamers will use G26, S&W15 2",etc. The true IDPA shooters will use what they carry. We have had Tomcats, P32, Rossi 38, and a lot of j frames.