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Old July 24, 2002, 01:17 PM   #1
Skunkabilly
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What Does 'Ballistic Tip' Mean?

Heard this tossed around in my quest for the holy rail of urban .308 loads. What's a 'ballistic tip'?
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Old July 24, 2002, 01:29 PM   #2
CITADELGRAD87
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It's a plastic or other non mettalic insert that makes a hollow point more aerodynamic, but still perform like a hollow point.

I think.
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Old July 24, 2002, 01:42 PM   #3
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Check here.

http://www.nosler.com/balltiphunt.html
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Old July 24, 2002, 01:47 PM   #4
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Fancy marketing name for a bullet with a plastic nosecap in a HP bullet as mentioned above. Even comes in cool colors for different calibers. Great for marketing. Everyone likes neat colors on their bullets.

Good SHooting
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Old July 24, 2002, 02:20 PM   #5
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How is a Winchester Silvertip different? Is it a softpoint?
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Old July 24, 2002, 03:24 PM   #6
CITADELGRAD87
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Silvertips are just hollow points without jackets. Their composition makes them more silver than grey. My experience is limited to handgun silvertips, the rifle caliber ones may be jacketed.

But they are not ballistic tips.
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Old July 24, 2002, 03:41 PM   #7
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Silvertips for rifles use an aluminum tip over a large hollw cavity, the effect of which is that (like Remington's Bronze point) the metal cap is driven backwards expanding the bullet dramaticly. (read this as TOO much for a hunting bullet IMO) Its like a Hydra-Shock in a rifle. You'll get .30 cal hole going in, and a tennis ball sized wound going out (on deer sized game) Sure, it kills , but it wastes a LOT of meat in doing so. Wonderbullets like these can also fragment "on the surface" with almost NO penetration.

Ballistic tips are very similar and great for varminting, but I wouldn't hunt with one.

Where the idea of an "Ultimate Ubran 308" load being an explosive varmint round came from is anyone's guess.
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Old July 24, 2002, 04:17 PM   #8
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Little known fact:

Some variants of the Nosler Ballistic Tips are actually more streamlined than their same-weight Sierra MatchKing counterparts, with a better Ballistic Coefficient!

That only comes into play in ranges that may be a bit too far to wisely hunt at, but for my 1000 yard target matches, it meant a good bit of bullet drop.

As for hunting with the Ballistic Tip, I am loathe to use them in either antelope or deer-sized game. My own non-scientific tests in 300 meter gallon milk jugs of Jell-O, and a 200 meter armadillo (Possum on the half-shell) all point to the fact that there ain't much left of the bullet once it connects with it's intended target. Little copper sparklies all over the place, and a mashed colored plastic nose. (6.5-06, 120gr Ballistic Tip, 3200fps) This probably points to a bullet that's too lightly constructed. Partitions would be a better choice in the Nosler lineup if you wanna salvage something to eat after you take the shot.
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Old July 24, 2002, 04:22 PM   #9
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So for 'urban use' would you pick a Winchester Silvertip over something like a Nosler Ballistic Tip bullet?
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Old July 24, 2002, 04:31 PM   #10
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That's a loaded question.

"Urban Use".


Just might tie this thread to the "Handloads for Defense" thread under General Discussion.

I dunno, either way the ER doctor or coroner is gonna have his hands full. I sure's hell wouldn't wanna get centerpunched by a Ballistic Tip, especially if it's moving at belted magnum velocities. (Which is probably another reason I chose to load it for my rifle, besides the excellent BC of the bullet)

The folks at Thunder Ranch, and the Chandler/Iron Brigade are probably better qualified to answer that one. Considering they gravitate towards the .223 and .308 in their rifle courses, I'm assuming it's because of good commercial ammo availability (Black Hills comes to mind) and demonstrable accuracy potential. I'd wager the lion's share of ammo used is either FMJ or BTHPM. Don't know, I ain't going to the class until sometime next year.
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Old July 24, 2002, 04:41 PM   #11
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Quote:
Silvertips are just hollow points without jackets. Their composition makes them more silver than grey. My experience is limited to handgun silvertips, the rifle caliber ones may be jacketed.
Nope. Handgun Silvertips aren't jacketless HPs. They use an aluminum jacket. Check it out for yourself.
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Old July 24, 2002, 07:30 PM   #12
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For the Winchester Supreme™ rifle cartridges, the 'Silvertips' are Ballistic Silvertips™ with silver (actually grey) Nosler Ballistic Tip™ bullets, at least for their .22-250 rounds.

Silvertip™ bullets for their hangun ammo is entirely different of course. Not sure if they are Nosler.
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Old July 25, 2002, 12:08 AM   #13
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<----------big fan of Noslers

Nosler I think was the first bullet maker to have plastic tipped rifle bullets. The Ballistic Tip rifle bullets are known for their fine accuracy - better in some rifles than so called match bullets.

Read Nosler's description about each bullet - some are indeed intended for varmints, some for deer and antelope, some for bigger game. Nosler states the BT will expand at velocities as low as 1600 fps. The famous Nosler Partition(a tougher bullet) will only expand down to about 2000 fps.

Skunky, can I assume you have no interest in Ruger #1's ? I assume you're shooting an M1A ? The BT's I know of have no crimping channellure, which is recommended for autoloaders. If you load them be damn careful they can't seat deeper in the case during feeding.
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Old July 25, 2002, 12:16 PM   #14
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Something not touched upon with the balistic tip designs.


For feeding reliability the balistic tips really aid feeding, if you manage to pull the plastic insert from the core of the bullet you'll be greated by one of the most blatantly nasty looking hollow points you've ever seen on a rifle bullet(atleast with the ones meant for varminting). Try to feed a bullet with a hollow point like that that doesn't have a sharp pointy tip and you'll have headaches left and right with feeding, the chances of having the bullet NOT get stuffed down into the case upon feeding will be dramatically improved if you can have nice pointy bullets. I don't crimp for my AR15 or my AR10 and have had no problems using any of the bullets out there without a crimping canneleur.



The Speer 52grn hollow point has a large broad opening at the tip and I don't always have success feeding them through my AR15s, but I have never once had a problem feeding any of the Balistic tip style bullets through my AR15s and that includes the Hornady Vmax, Sierra BlitzKing, and Nosler Balistic Tip.




Others have mentioned that some of the balistic tips are meant for varminting while others are meant for large game, definitely true. Bullet construction differs quite a bit between the varminting bullets and the ones meant for larger game.




As for Winchester's Silver Tip loads, there is one out there for rifles that uses Noslers. It's the "Combined Technology" 165 grain and probably 150grain loads, the bullet is definitely a Nosler balistic tip type bullet only with the proprietary Winchester balisticlean coating or whatever they call it.




Also, if using a semiauto and you try to go too light on the bullet weights(like using the Speer 125grain TNT or the Hornady Vmax 110grain for the 308Win) the cycling of the rifle may be adversely effected, middle to heavier weight bullets are likely to cycle the action more reliably.
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Old July 25, 2002, 06:04 PM   #15
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Quote:
Nosler I think was the first bullet maker to have plastic tipped rifle bullets. The Ballistic Tip rifle bullets are known for their fine accuracy - better in some rifles than so called match bullets.
Winchester Supreme Silvertip in .308 comes with Noslers. They work very well in my AR10. The "combined" ammunition will mention Olin and Nosler on the box.
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Old July 25, 2002, 07:36 PM   #16
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They have a platic peg that fills the hollowpoint and aids expansion. They are all I shoot in my 30-06AI. I was able to get a .75 inch with them at 200yds. I have taken 8 deer with them. If I were going for big game where penetration is key, I'd use Partitions. I have never had a shoot not fully penetrate on a whitetail.

tjg
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Old July 25, 2002, 08:12 PM   #17
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Does Hornady pay a royalty or anything for their V-Max Ballistic Tip-like bullet to Nosler?
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Old July 25, 2002, 09:12 PM   #18
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Names like "Balistic Tip" would be trademarked and reserved for use by the company but I really don't know if the Balistic Tip design is patented.


Bullets like these have been around for awhile, like others mentioned the old tips used to be made of metals like aluminum or maybe bronze. Making the switch over to polymer isn't a huge conceptual leap or anything, just saves weight while likely behaving in the same manner.



As for varmint bullets, I prefer the Vmax or the Sierra BlitzKings to a Nosler as I've found them to be slightly lighter construction than the Bal. Tip which is something I desire for my use with 223Remington. The polymer tips of the Vmax and BlitzKings seem to also be larger which take up a larger internal space within the bullet core, making for a larger cavity and likely makes for more violent expansion.

Though the Noslers might be more appropriate for higher speed chamberings like the 22-250 and 220Swift.

Here's a picture of a cross section I did on a 50grn Bal. Tip, 40grn Vmax, and 40grn BlitzKing(in that order from left to right).
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