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Old June 21, 2000, 02:28 PM   #1
CMOS
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It's time for me to play with some slugs in the Benelli however, after asking a few questions, I have gotten totally different advice as to what choke I am able to use.

3 different questions, 3 different answers. I have been told that I can shoot slugs out of the IC, M, and full chokes. I suspect that someone is wrong here.

Now, I have been told that the Brenneke (sp?) slugs are quite impressive so what exactly is the scoop with chokes and this type of slug?

BTW, I prefer to work with the tightest choke possible so that I can shoot shot or the slugs.

Thanks for your help.

CMOS

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Old June 21, 2000, 04:46 PM   #2
jthuang
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Well, I have always been told that you can shoot slugs out of IC, M and F but it's advisable to shoot slugs regularly only out of IC. The tighter chokes apparently do not improve accuracy and the slugs can damage those choke tubes.

That's totally hearsay though so feel free to correct me. Must be something to it though, as all slug barrels I've seen are cylinder or IC choke.

Buckshot actually tends to pattern better with cylinder or IC choke. Tighter constriction in a conventional choke generally causes the pellets to bang against each other. This deforms the pellets and causes heck with their aerodynamics -- thus causing "flyers" in your buckshot pattern, not a good thing if you are facing a hostage situation with a buckshot loaded scattergun (not a good situation anyway, eh?).

Cylinder choke will cause less pellet deformation so the pellets will fly better. The key is to pattern your individual gun with your individual load so you know how tight (or open) your buck pattern is at typical combat ranges.

I have not heard anything stellar about Brenneke slugs, only that they are more popular in Europe than here in the Union. Foster and sabot slugs seem to be more popular here. Foster slugs are more commonly used for defense (e.g., Federal's tactical slug load) and hunting. Sabot slugs, like the BRI offering, are extremely accurate, especially out of rifled slug barrels. But the 12 bore sabot slugs are in actuality only 0.50" caliber so you have a bit lighter (and presumably less effective) slug.

The Vang Comp (http://www.vangcomp.com) system and the Patternmaster (http://www.patternmaster.com) choke tube supposedly give tighter buck patterns while retaining the ability to shoot slugs accurately. You may want to investigate these two options.

HTH,

Justin

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Justin T. Huang, Esq.
late of Kennett Square, Pennsylvania
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Old June 29, 2000, 10:50 AM   #3
CMOS
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Other comments?

CMOS

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Old June 29, 2000, 12:03 PM   #4
Dave McC
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OK, first....

Hardnfast rules about slugs and shotguns are non existent. One of the best slug shooters I ever ran across was a Model 91 16 ga, full choke and it cloverleafed slugs at 100 yards. Twice, out of two tries.

As a loose rule, use an open choke, and in smoothbores the Forster(proper name, not Foster) type and the Brenneke slugs are most accurate, but YOU need to test out the best.
That means testing out a bunch of different ones, and nobody I know LIKES benching with slugs. It's a must do, however...

BTW, I've Brenneked several deer up to live weights of 170 lbs or so. Quick, humane kills and short trails. Damage on a Broadside hit is fearsome.However, the deer 870 likes the Winchester Forsters types,and they're cheaper.

BTW, same applies to buck. I could double pattern size in my 870 simply by shifting brands. Again, test to see what works in your weapon.

Finally, 00 usually impacts lower than slugs, so you want to check that out also.
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Old June 29, 2000, 12:08 PM   #5
DorGunR
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CMOS,
You don't want/need a choke for slugs period.
So if you have interchangable chokes for your smothbore then use the most open choke you have....possibly IC.

Take care & happy shooting.

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Old June 29, 2000, 01:41 PM   #6
CMOS
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Thanks Dave and Dor.

Let me elaborate a bit more. I tend to use my Benelli for self defense purposes hence I would like to be able to insert a certain choke and be able to use it for buckshot and slugs without a choke change. I'd like to keep a few slugs on a stock saddle or on the sling and be able to do a tactical reload (very quick and easy on the Benelli's) to replace a buckshot shell with a slug if I ever "needed" to do so.

Based on the responses I will test a couple of slug types with the modified choke as I like to keep the buck patterns as tight as possible. If any of you more knowledgeable gentlemen see any flaw in this plan please let me know your thoughts.

Thanks again.

CMOS

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Old June 29, 2000, 01:52 PM   #7
DorGunR
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CMOS,
For some reason I did not see Dave McC post before I posted but I have to agree 100% with what he said......only he said it better than I could have.
I ruined a deer hunting trip back in 1968 by using a new shotgun that I was too lazy to pattern before the trip. AFTER the trip I checked the pattern using 00 buckshot and I couldn't believe what a lousy pattern this gun threw. Each gun will pattern differently with the same load.....I KNEW that...oh well.
Take care.

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[This message has been edited by DorGunR (edited June 29, 2000).]
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Old June 30, 2000, 04:33 AM   #8
Dave McC
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CMOS, it sure won't hurt anything to use a Modified choke and test slugs. Let us know how it works out,please.

One minor caveat...

You mention keeping slugs on the sling.IMO, slings with lots of ammo are egregious. After the first shot, you've got a lb or so of ammo swinging back and forth, throwing off your aim.Not crazy about butt cuffs, but even THOSE are an improvement over that sling.

For adding ammo to a weapon, I like these in this order....

Mag extension
Side Saddle
Speedfeed stock(by rep and brief examination, don't own one.)
Butt cuff
Shell belt
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Old June 30, 2000, 07:45 AM   #9
CMOS
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Dave, agree with you on the point about carrying extra shells. I will most likely get a simple butt-cuff as I do not like the side saddles on the receivers nor do I like the "swinging pendulum" effect of the sling carry option and, I already have a mag tube extension . Ireally only plan to carry 2 slugs on the cuff anyway. If I need more than 2 slugs in the cuff and the 8 shells in the gun, I'm in pretty deep do-do anyway... .

I actually have a SpeedFeed stock on my 870 Marine Magnum. It's a great stock. It holds 4 extra shells that can be removed with the flick of finger but for damn sure the shells will not fall out unless you remove them yourself. I highly recommend it.

Thanks again for your comments.

CMOS

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Old June 30, 2000, 01:04 PM   #10
Dave McC
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Thanks for the input on the Speedfeed,CMOS. Buddy of mine is toying with the idea of upgrading one of his 870s to a full bore HD/ whatever tool.We talked about ammo options, and he's interested in the Speedfeed.
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Old June 30, 2000, 06:46 PM   #11
jfrancis
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I have a M1S90 that I use for HD and tactical 3-gun competition. It is fitted with a Patternmaster choke which patterns WAY tighter than any of the Benelli chokes that came with the gun. It is also happy shooting slugs (mainly Remington/Federal reduced recoil).

John Francis
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Old July 1, 2000, 09:02 AM   #12
Dave McC
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Thanks, John. What is the nominal choke on that Patternmaster?
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Old July 1, 2000, 09:21 AM   #13
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Dave, I'm not sure how to describe it in terms of IC, etc., but the Patternmaster will keep all 9 pellets of Federal Tactical 00 in the A-zone of an IDPA target (<8") at 25 yards. They run about $75-80 and worth every cent IMO. At more reasonable HD distances, head shots are quite possible with the same load. For the Benelli, it is an excellent alternative to the Vang Comp job as this is more expensive on the Benellis.

John Francis

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Old July 1, 2000, 12:25 PM   #14
Dave McC
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Thanks. With the IC tube in place, I get 20-24" groups with duty 00 at 25 yards, and that's with a lengthened forcing cone. I wonder if they come threaded for Rem Chokes?
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Old July 1, 2000, 07:37 PM   #15
jfrancis
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Dave, I'm pretty sure they do. I bought an Itheca 870 clone and had the barrel threaded for a Rem choke - then put a Patternmaster on it. Not quite equal to the Benelli - but what a difference to unchoked!

John Francis
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Old July 2, 2000, 05:32 AM   #16
Dave McC
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Thanks, John. One final favor, howzabout posting a site where they can be purchased?
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Old July 2, 2000, 05:30 PM   #17
jfrancis
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No problem Dave....

Check out Cabelas.com

or call 1-800-237-4444

They have the Patternmaster for Remingtons listed at $79.95..

John
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Old July 2, 2000, 08:44 PM   #18
jthuang
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You can also try straight from the source, at http://www.patternmaster.com

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