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Old April 5, 1999, 07:55 PM   #1
Jim March
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Over in rec.guns, we were talking about the ballistic possibilities of the smallest functional combat handguns made, the NAA Minirevolvers in .22Magnum. See them at www.naaminis.com - they're cool. Also totally undetectable in a pocket, making them roundly disliked by "the powers that
be".

Anyhow, they have a 5shot cylinder that is nearly perfectly sized for a 12gauge shotgun barrel. Said cylinder is easy to remove because that's the only way to load the little barstards (note: small gun with potent ammo equals KICK. Biiiiig kick. Lotsa fun at ranges showing people who mistake
them for toys that they *ain't*. Bring Band-Aids.)

So you take that cylinder, load it with 5 Magnum rimfire rounds, stick it in a 3" Magnum shotgun shell in front of a healthy charge. The shotgun powder blast should crank off all five rimfire projectiles, which would pepper the target prior to obliterating it with a flying chunk of stainless steel with five "cookie cutter" holes.

The possibilities for a truly confoosed coroner are endless.

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Old April 6, 1999, 12:56 AM   #2
Art Eatman
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NAA revolvers kick? Noisy, yes; kick, no. I have found that a first shot tends to go high, if I'm in a hurry, so my aiming point is below the belt. The next four are easily put into a reasonably small group...

Your shotgun blast could send pieces of your shotgun's barrel flying out in quite a few directions. You'd be putting a lot of weight in front of the charge, and the "shot load" could well have the effect of a barrel plugged with mud...

How about a little 12-gauge plastic cylinder which could be sealed to hold about an ounce of mercury? Or drill a 1/4" hole down into a jacketed hollow-point bullet in some largish pistol caliber? Add mercury, or strychnine, or? Aw, heck, go milk a rattlesnake!
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Old April 6, 1999, 12:33 PM   #3
cornered rat
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I would recommend a 10ga loaded with weasels.

Or, better yet: catch a rattlesnake. stick it into a tube, with the head protruding. Attach pop-up fins to the tube to stabilize it. Fire at the target.

12ga muck-shot with statists in it would be nasty...but how could we fit enough of them into a small shell? We could just use the RPG/Panzerfaust design and have the payload outside of a barrel, on a stick. However, the concept of stick-up-the-ass could violate the original copyright by NYPD

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Old April 10, 1999, 02:12 PM   #4
Kodiac
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I liked the solid copper hollow point sabot... They looked wicked lined up on the sidesaddle...
Effective? You better believe it! Thos erounds would fly to any range and plaster the target but good!



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Old April 10, 1999, 05:25 PM   #5
David Schmidbauer
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Why not just use some 12 gauge Quik-Shoks? I've seen what these do to a block of Ballistic Gell. It "cuts" the block into 4 pieces. Other 12 guage slugs just make a "normal" cavity (large but normal )

If you want a devistating slug Quik-Shok is the one to use.



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Old April 10, 1999, 07:21 PM   #6
Fargo
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David,

Where would I be able to purchase some 12 gauge Quik-Shoks?

Thanks,
Fargo
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Old April 10, 1999, 08:49 PM   #7
David Schmidbauer
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Hell... if I knew that I'd have some. I only got to see them during testing. I'm wanting about 100 to test in my 1201.

Maybe someone else can help us.



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Old April 11, 1999, 11:19 PM   #8
Art Eatman
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I thought of a really neat sick'n'twisted load, but then I thought, "Naahhh, that's too sick and twisted, even for me." This group is already too sick and twisted...
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Old April 12, 1999, 08:02 AM   #9
KNIGHT
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In the book "Patriot Games" author Tom Clancy talks about a really cool 12g round. It is a 12g shell loaded with darts! Like the one you can get at Wal-Mart for the Shootin-Darts BB gun! waht do you think of that!

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Old April 12, 1999, 01:17 PM   #10
fal308
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Knight,
You're talking about the flechette rounds. Basically they're fin-stabilized darts. "Flechette-loaded shotgun ammunition was developed about 1950 by Irwin R. Barr formulated the concept of employing high-velocity, low-drag, finned projectiles for increased range and reduced time of flight in small-caliber, distribution-type ammunition. He proposed to employ the concept in rounds for the 50 machine gun, for 12 gauge shotguns and for .45 caliber pistols and submachine guns." Quote from page 464 of The World's Fighting Shotguns by Thomas F. Swearengen. This book is generally considered the text on fighting shotguns and related developments.
Chapter Ten of this volume deals with shotgun ammunition types including multilpe-projectile, buckshot, flechette, single-projectile, the U.S. Navy Silent Shotgun Shell, tear gas, explosive, flares and nonlethal riot-control ammunition.
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Old April 12, 1999, 03:18 PM   #11
James K
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I think they loaded a fletchette round for the 105mm Howitzer. Now that is one mean shotgun.
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Old April 15, 1999, 09:04 PM   #12
RCH
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O.K. I like the rattlesnake idea, but how about some real rounds? The gun shows usually have the exotic stuff and I know some degenerates have played around with their shells..

Some things I have seen:

Triple Slug- three small slugs stacked one behind the other.

Buck & Ball- A short slug with buckshot behind it.

Ball and Chain- Don't know the exact name, but this is two pieces of buckshot that is connected by a wire. Imagine that flying/spinning as it hits the target!
If memory serves correctly, I recall something similiar done on ships with cannons to take out the enemy's masts, sails, & rigging.

Dimes- A nutty friend of mine loaded some shells with, you guessed it, dimes. A good answer for BGs who ask you for some change...Shooting them at a 50 gallon drum, he noticed that they impacted at different angles..
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Old April 15, 1999, 10:40 PM   #13
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RCH: I saw the "Macho Gaucho" load (two balls connected by a wire) in an unsolicited catalog I recieved from Firequest. My question is, would it actually spin as intended?
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Old April 15, 1999, 11:18 PM   #14
Art Eatman
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Mort: Unless there was something aerodynamically tricky in the shape of the balls of the load, I doubt it would spin. The balls would separate, however, and make a helluva cheesecutter...
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Old April 16, 1999, 09:11 AM   #15
Mort
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.....but not necessarily horizontally, rendering them somewhat useless.
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Old April 16, 1999, 01:20 PM   #16
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Not that it is applicable in this case but the American Rifleman ran an article when I was a kid, (a long time ago) about using various chained cannonball attaching devices during the Civil War. It was amusing. I guess there was panic as the connected cannonballs went all over the place, cut down some trees and killed a cow. None of the eventual targets were in the line of sight.
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Old April 16, 1999, 11:20 PM   #17
Art Eatman
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The chained cannonball was more useful in the days of sailing ships, to try to dismast or to wipe out the sails of an opponent.
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Old April 17, 1999, 01:17 AM   #18
JHolmes
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Langrage, I believe it was called? Hell, it's only been 18 years since I've read about it...
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Old April 17, 1999, 10:25 AM   #19
Art Eatman
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JHolmes: By Jove! I forget just *what* we called it!
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Old April 19, 1999, 03:54 PM   #20
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FYI Jim Keenan there is a flechette round for the 105 mm howitzer it is called a "beehive" round and was used for perimeter defense. It is a VERY EFFECTIVE round against ground personnel. It has no match.
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Old April 19, 1999, 06:57 PM   #21
James K
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That's the one. I thought it was called the "beehive", but didn't want to expose my ignorance if wrong. Like I said, though, THAT is one MEEEAAN shotgun!
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Old April 26, 1999, 07:26 AM   #22
finger1
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Rock salt has anyone ever shot or been shot at with rock salt? seriously
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Old April 26, 1999, 10:00 AM   #23
John G
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How do you reseal shotgun rounds after you've altered their loads?

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Old April 27, 1999, 10:15 AM   #24
fal308
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finger1
Back in my misspent youth, my friends and I were shot at several times by railroad detectives with rocksalt. One time they just missed me and hit my friend. He soaked in a tub for hours and had trouble sitting for a week.
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Old May 4, 1999, 12:59 AM   #25
headroom
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Wyatt Earp used to put a couple dozen dimes in his shotgun, it was supposed to be make some real damned nasty holes.
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