Wad cutters

[Benzene]

I'm confident that this forum would provide the best response I could get. What are the negatives involved in using cast lead wad cutters? I plan to use 125 gr cast lead bullets (from Lonestarbullet Co.). Thanks.

[Leftoverdj]

You did not state caliber, but I'll assume .38. Never heard of anyone using .38 WC as light as 125 grains. 148 is standard. I've run into moulds a little lighter and a little heavier, but I have never run into anyone at a serious match shooting anything but 148 WC. They are the gold standard for PPC shooters. You are unlikely to beat them for accuracy.

They also make a pretty decent small game load at short ranges. Normal velocity is about 800 fps and trajectory can be a problem past 25-30 yards.

[Benzene]

Thanks. You're correct, I was talking about .38 and I'll now surely use 148gr, the standard. Thanks for the information that they are the gold standard for PPC shooters, as well as for the much you stated in so few words about the WC.

Any comment about gun cleaning after shooting, say 500 rounds of these WC's. Thanks.

[brickeyee]

As long as you hold the velocity down there is very minimal barrel leading. Long term use can result in lead on the forcing cone, cylinder face, and almost everywhere else.

[Quantrill]

The .38 spec 148 grain (plus or minus a few grains usually due to what alloy is used) is the standard to which all accuracy must be compared. The only downer to it is that you can not drive them at high velocity or pressures will rise and leading may begin. I have three molds for the .38 wadcutter and use them all, as this is my most reloaded bullet. Quantrill

[Poygan]

Wadcutters are great for short range target useage...up to 50 yards thereabouts. Not too stable after that. Easy on you, the gun and your wallet. 148 grain is the standard although I have a four cavity mold that makes 2 X 105 grain and 2 X 70 grain wadcutters. I haven't experimented with these much because its difficult to get them to cast well because the small bullets don't heat the cavities very readily. Also, I believe 2.8 grains of Bullseye was the standard loading and with 7,000 grains in a pound, its quite economical.

If you find out you like wadcutters, consider casting your own. Wadcutter molds go reasonably on e-bay and you can get a push-through Lee sizer inexpensively. Lee may also make a tumble-lube wadcutter mold which means you wouldn't have to size the bullets, only swirl them in Lee's liquid Alox and let them dry. Scrounge some wheel weights or almost any kind of lead except pure lead - wadcutters don't have to be very hard.

[Benzene]

Thanks folks for all the information on wadcutters. How would you classify the wadcutter shown in the photo? Thanks again.

[j_mcdade]

The bullet shown in the image appears to be a typical semi-wadcutter. Don't know for sure if you want more specific information. If that is the case, let us know exactly what you are looking for...

Good Shooting,

Jim

[MADISON]

125 grain Wadcutter?
For as far back as I know the 146, 148 and 150 grain SWC are what is used for target work. I am afraid that if you used a 125 grain Wadcutter you woould push it too fast and lead your barrel.

[Benzene]

Thanks folks. The specimen shown in the photo is 148 gr lead. What charge of what powder is best suited for it? Has anyone experience using 231 with it? Thanks.

[brickeyee]

If it weighs 148 grain it probably has a flat base instead of a hollow base. Easier to cast.
The stock 148 wadcutter for accuracy work is really a hollow base wadctter. Some folks started using 'double ended' (flat front and back) wadcutters.
I doubt the accuracy battle will ever be finally settled.

[Poygan]

From your photo, it looks like a wadcutter thats trying to grow into a semi wadcutter. I would still call it a wadcutter. For loading data, go online or pick up some free reloading booklets that most if not all powder companies put out. IMHO, NEVER load with data that someone has given you online unless you can verify it with legitimate published data.

[Leftoverdj]

Yeah, that's a WC with a pimple on its nose. They are not uncommon and I have a couple of moulds that have that. The factory swaged hollow base are a hair more accurate, but they are also more expensive and more prone to leading.

I prefer the basic double ended WC and I am using the Lee six cavity tumble lube mould. I size them anyway because it is very possible to do a cast with the mould open by a couple of thous and get a few fat bullets mixed in. I'm using Rooster Jacket or Johnson's Paste Wax as lube because they are a lot less messy than Liquid Alox and work fine at these velocities.

3.1 of 231 is challenging 2.7 of Bullseye as the standard load these days, mostly because it shoots about as well and meters a lot easier. AA 2 also seems to be getting a little following.

[G56]

I shot 148 gr HBWC in PPC, I averaged about a thousand per month when I was shooting in competition and I shot for several years, my standard load was the hollow base wadcutter loaded with 3.1 gr of WW231 and a Federal primer, that's a good target load and pretty much standard.

[Quantrill]

The original target wadcutter used in National Match competition was seated over 2.7gr of Bullseye powder. This is still one excellent load but 700X and 231 now have their share of advocates. I have always used 2.5gr of 700X and not done too shabbily. Any of those fast powders will work. Quantrill

[Paul B.]

The bullet shown is basically a wadcutter (WC) with a slightly longer than normal nose, probably to try and get a bit more stability out at the 50 yard range.
I use Lyman #358495, a 148 gr. WC cast feom wheel weight (WW) metal over 3.0 gr. of W-231. Also, 2.5 and 2.7 grains of Bullesye have given me good results, but I've been getting my best groups with W-231.
A while back, I was given a smokin' deal on Winchester .38 Spl. target ammo. I almost hate to say this, but my home cast WC loads outshoot the expensive factory stuff.
Paul B.

[Benzene]

Thank you so very much for sharing your expertise. Any techniques on how to measure precisely 3.0 gr on the Lee 2000 Pro (with the Lee disks)? Thanks.

[Paul B.]

Ya got me there. I use an RCBS duomeasure and adjust it with an electronic scale. Never used the Lee.
Paul B.

[cheygriz]

The 148 GR swaged wadcutter over 2.8 grains of Bullseye has been winning championships for nearly a century. Some guns like 2.7 better, and some like 2.9 or even 3.0. But 2.7 or 2.8 are good places to start.

I haven't tried 231 with full wadcutters, but I've used a ton of it under 158 grain semi-wadcutters cast fairly hard. No good reason it shouldn't work as well with the full wadcutter.

[MADISON]

Here are 2 of my loads for 231:
HBW...3.0 grains of 231. Push it any faster and it will tumble.
Bevel Base Wadcutter 4.0 grains. It will not tumble.

Both loads were fired in a 686.

[G56]

HBW...3.0 grains of 231. Push it any faster and it will tumble.

Shooting in practice and competition I shot many thousands of 38 special loads in a S&W model 13 converted to a PPC revolver with a 6" bull barrel, the load was 3.1 gr of WW231 behind a Star 148 gr HBWC, that is considered a standard target load, very commonly used. Over several years time I never saw a bullet tumble, or even keyhole out to 50 yards using that load, it was an exceptionally accurate load.

[.45 Vet]

The powder measure should've come with a volumetric comparison chart of powder density by manufacturer. I found mine to be very optimistic, and had to resort to weighing charges and changing disks to find the right one.

I'm currently using the disk/cavity #28 for 2.75grs Bullseye under a 148gr. HBWC. You would be very wise to measure your way to the propper disk for the powder/weight of charge you want to use. If you still have the chart, use it as a rough guess for a starting point.

"Good Luck & Load Safely"