.358 Winchester build

[reynolds357]

I have a model 600 .308 that I bought used a few years ago. Remington had about as good quality control then as they do now. The chamber was cut entirely wrong. There is a huge ring at the front of the fired brass. Having said that, my options are reaming it to Ackley or re-barreling. I have never used a Shaw barrel. I have heard praises and horror stories about them. I was thinking of building a .358 Win with about an 18" barrel. What are your thoughts on Shaw for that project? Their price is right, but I really want the rifle to shoot at worst 1.5 min.

[taylorce1]

Take a look at IT&D Customs for the barrel work. It might be a little faster than ER Shaw.

[natman]

Have you considered reboring? You will need a fair amount of muzzle diameter to rebore to .358, but it might be easier and cheaper than rebarreling. For one thing, you won't have to worry about the barrel fitting the stock.

[taylorce1]

Reboring is an option if there is enough meat around the barrel, however the "ring" on the brass may not be cleaned up by reboring the barrel. JES reboring has an excellent reputation for doing this service. His price for a three grove rebore is around $250.

[reynolds357]

A re-bore is not going to clean up the chamber and is going to most likely get too close to the drill holes for the vent rib. I thought about setting back the barrel a few threads and re-cutting the chamber, but lining up pre-drilled sights is probably past my gun-smithing ability. Its past the time I want to invest in the project anyway. My friend who builds customs and bench guns despises working on anything with sights, so I wont put him on the spot.

[reynolds357]

Taylor, thanks for the info on IT&D customs. I am kind of wanting to stay with a budget barrel on this project. I will either do the work myself or send it to one of my friends who will do it for $100 to 125 (depending on how complete I order the barrel.) For this particular project, Douglas is a bit north of what I want to spend. I dont mind buying a Lilja for a target rifle, but this is going to be my new brush rifle.
Any opinion on Shaw's barrels?


I have a shot out .300WSM I am considering sending to have re-bored to .325 WSM. I am assuming .325 is enough over size to be an option. I am new to the re-boring option. I had not even heard about it until I joined this forum. When I mentioned it to the guy who taught me what I know about gunsmithing, and who builds my bench guns, he looked at me like I just arrived from Mars. Having said that, I am going to try it on one rifle anyway.

[Paul B.]

I usually go with Douglas barrels when I have a rifle rebarreled but while I've never used a Shaw barrel, I have heard good things about them. Personally, if it were my rifle and I was going to rebarrel to .358 Win., I'd probably look at a 20" barrel. I once had a Remington M600 and gave it to a 17 Y.O. kid with his parent's OK. It too was in .308. I replaced it with a Remington M660 and restocked into something not quite so ugly.
The only suggestion I would offer is get the barrel with the prope 1 in 12" twist. I have 4 rifles in .358 Win.. Two have that 1 in 16" twist and two have a proper 1 in 12" twist. The 1 in 16's are bolt actions and the 1 in 12"s are lever actions. The two lever guns shoot groups half the size of the bolt actions.
Paul B.

[reynolds357]

Paul, thanks for the info on twist rates. I had not yet researched the twist rate for the .358. I was going to check my .350 Rem mag and order this barrel twisted the same as it. It probably is a 1 in 12, but I have not checked it. It loves 250gr Speer spitzers. I am going to have to quit hunting with it. It is still in 100% condition and is too valuable to take to the woods. I did not know what it was worth until someone recently tried to buy it. I paid $350 for it when I was 13 years old. Needless to say its worth a lot more than that now.

[WIN1886]

I wish the .358 Winchester was more popular.....being it is very capable of taking all North American game out to at least medium range and a short range powerhouse caliber to boot ! Rather than impressive fat belted cartridges with the word magnum attached to scare the game into submission it would humbly kill with efficiency any game the average hunter would seek out !

[PetahW]

.

If the chamber ring is rearward from the shoulder, a rebarrel'll be necessary; if it's in the neck area of the chamber, a rebore should clean it up.

Any rebore to .358" must have a minimum bbl OD @ the muzzle of .600" ( aka .125" bbl wall thickness), or Jes (and most other reborers) will refuse the job.


.

[Jim Watson]

A friend had almost the same project, save that his 600 was a Mohawk without the rib. He dillied and dallied over it, new products came out, and he ended up with a .338 Federal barrel instead of .358. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.
I think his shop put on a Douglas barrel.
I don't know the benchrest magazine article payola accuracy, but it is ample to have slain whatever he turned it against.

[reynolds357]

The ring is in the shoulder. Its actually toward the base of the shoulder. The easiest thing would be to ream it to A.I., but I really do want a .358.
Decisions, Decisions.

[Savage99]

The 600 is an entry level rifle that lacks so many of the features a hunter who appreciates fine rifles.

Find a rifle with at least control round feeding that's finished well.

I have hunted with my .358 Winchesters since 1953. I have a number of them. At least get a Ruger 77.

Here are some of my .358's. The 99 and the Steyr Daimler at the bottom of the picture are so chambered.

picture was too large. I may try later.

[reynolds357]

I appreciate fine rifles. I keep most of them in the safe.
You definitely have a nice collection of .358's. The only thing I do not like about the 600 is the plastic trigger guard and magazine cover. I dont like that stupid vent rib either, but that will be gone with a re-barrel. A CNC machined billet aluminum trigger guard helps the look of them tremendously.
I saw the picture, I could scroll around it.

[taylorce1]

I wouldn't call the 600 an entry level rifle, and as much as I appreciate CRF I can't discount the success Remington has had with the push feed. For a lot of hunters, there is nothing finer than a Remington in their favorite cartridge. If you're not hunting dangerous game there really isn't any need for a CRF action in most cases. The Remington push feeds are usually reliable as far as feeding goes, and I've even had a 1903 fail to feed properly and jam on me.

[ammo.crafter]

Look up 358 Bellm.

The barrel needs to be chambered correctly.

[reynolds357]

The Bellm is interesting, but I dont want to do any bolt face work. Its not as fast as the .358 Winchester. I believe there is probably just enough rim on the case to be annoying in a bolt action.

[Savage99]

Broken push feed extractor. Not only do they break like junk but a person who knows machinery can see that they look like junk.

[Paul B.]

Reybolds. AFAIK only Remington and Ruger chambered riles for he .350 Rem. Mag. and both came with a 1 in 16" twist as I recall. I have two Ruger M77s a Brownibf BLR and a Savage M99 all in .358 Win. Not sure on the browning but I suspect like the Savage it has a 1 in 12" twist. The two Rugers are 1 in 16" and the two lever guns outshoot the two bolt actions. THey'r sitting in a limbo state right now and have been ever since I bought my .35 Whelens. The Ruger M77 and Remington M700 have 1 in 16" twists and the custom Mauser has a 1 in 14" twist. I found it in a groups of rifles being sold from an estate sale at a gun show. I picked it up and shoulder it and she said, "Marry me." I did and it's been an elk slayer supreme. The last elk i took was this last January at 350 yards. So much for the BS that the .35 Whelen is a short range brush gun.
The only thing I agree on that Savage 99 said is on the Remington extractor. The one on mine broke and Remington had changed the design so my gunsmith had one hell of a time finding one. I will say this about it though. The gun probably had 3,000 or more rounds cycled though it before it gave up the ghost. I'd take a close look at your extractor and if it's one with a rivet, it could let go at that point. That's where mine failed.
Paul B.

[reynolds357]

I have never had a problem with the 600 extractor. I think I could make one if I absolutely had to, but Brownells sells them for $27.

[Savage99]

See that fine line that's about 3/8" behind the bolts lug?

That line marks where the locking lug section is brazed onto the bolt body on those bolts!

Will they fire if the bolt handle is closed but the locking lug section's braze has let go?

[Savage99]

Here are some quality hunting rifles.

The 99 and one at the bottom are .358's!

[Paul B.]

"See that fine line that's about 3/8" behind the bolts lug?

That line marks where the locking lug section is brazed onto the bolt body on those bolts!

Will they fire if the bolt handle is closed but the locking lug section's braze has let go?"

Not sure. Whether it did or not is irrelevant at least regarding the gun going off. The locking lugs would do their job. Whee it might be a problen is if the shooter was facing someting like an enraged mama bear that thought her cubs were in danger. You'd best make that one shot count.
Seriously though, the only Remington problems I ever saw while working for a gunsmith was bolt handles that came off Remington 788s. I've heard of M700s sheding bolt handles but never the bolt head. Even if it sheared off completely odds are the locking lugs would be still in place in their slots so that nothing would/should blow back. I would also think that if such a thing would occur, it would be due to a bolt jammed in place by very high pressure and if that were the case the bolt handle would come off first.
Not saying that's a perfect answer BTW, just how I happen to see it. I don't think I'd really be that far of from what would happen. Even if the bolt turned to partially unlock. I do believe the lugs would hold as long as at least 50 per were still in contact.
As long as we're getting picky, I just checked out two Winchester M70s from 1968/69, a 1980's .300 Win. Mag. and two Featherweights, all push feed Winchester and guess what. The too had "welded bolt heads. (Actually brazed via an electrical induction process. Keeps th head and lugs from getting too hot while effecting a good hold.) If we're gonna pick on one, might as well pick on all the usual subjets, right?
Paul B.

[reynolds357]

I am not really worried about the bolt head falling off. If I ever decide its a design flaw and become worried about failure, I will Tig it.

[Keg]

I think rebarreling to 358 Win would be an awesome project.... I would then install a soft recoil pad and mount a compact type scope....JMO