aluminum 1911, steel ramp replacement? ...

jborushko · December 2, 2009, 01:45 PM

gots me a kimber pro-carry 2 (aluminum frame) and having feed it 5000 rounds 1000+ of that federal HST hollow points, the aluminum feed ramp in chewed up and no longer feeding hollow points reliably -i've already checked all other possibilities, i KNOW its the ramp-

anyway, i've seen the steel ramp inserts on the brownell's website http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=2...ED_RAMP_INSERT

how are these installed? obviously you mill out the old ramp and fit the new one, but how is it held in? do you pin it? or is there someother way of holding it and we have to get creative?

EDIT: i've looked for a ramped barrel but no luck - so unless somebody can point me in the right direction...
thanks for the help!

as we all know the aluminum frames are notorious for getting the feed ramps eaten away over time of feeding them hollow points, the anodizing on the ramp gets worn down leaving the soft aluminum open to abuse. im hoping to salvage my main carry piece.

i love my Kimber so i dont want to make it a ball round range gun only.

its deeper than the picture makes it look, but you can see the wear to the aluminum

omega · December 2, 2009, 02:45 PM

Here's a possible source of ramped barrels, but it would still have to be cut in. Sorry to see your Kimber suffering like this. Good luck.

http://www.kingsgunworks.com/newcatalog/page10.html

PS: There is no harm in trying to salvage the ramp yourself using a (dare I say it) Dremel tool. A less-is-better touch with a small stone (going up into and throating the barrel a bit if necessary) is worth a try. Quite honestly, you've got nothing to loose.

jborushko · December 2, 2009, 02:55 PM

polishing an anodized aluminum feed ramp is not fees-able as it will remove the anodizing that protects the aluminum even more than it already is (which is what caused the problem to begin with)

i would have to re-anodize the whole frame and the price makes that not a good option- but still an option (lol then i could anodize the frame something stupid like color GOLD, that would be funny). and i would still have this problem again in the future. im pretty set on either replacing the ramp with steel or finding a ramped barrel - thought the later has shown no results at all - thanks for the link thought ill check it out!

EDIT: i called Kings and they dont have a ramped barrel

omega · December 2, 2009, 03:03 PM

Quote:

polishing an anodized aluminum feed ramp is not fees-able as it will remove the anodizing that protects the aluminum even more than it already is (which is what caused the problem to begin with)

True, I'm aware of this, but thought you might want try a stop-gap solution. Also give Nowlin http://www.nowlinguns.com a try. They are willing to build barrel to your specs.

RickB · December 2, 2009, 07:47 PM

I believe the steel insert is secured by a screw that's threaded-in from the left side, the head being hidden by the slide stop. Evolution Gun Works used to install them, but I don't think they're doing in-house gunsmithing any more. I believe they will refer you to their former 'smith, though.

Harry Bonar · December 2, 2009, 08:43 PM

Sir;
Do not put a ramped barrel in a single-stack 1911. You'll have feeding problems.
I use a "plunge mill" of ramp diameter and cut it clear out. Then I insert a piece of drill rod, secure it with a pin (really not necessary) and mill the top off and shape it to standard feed ramp dimensions - works forever!
Harry B.

orionengnr · December 4, 2009, 07:30 PM

I bought a Kimber Stainless Ultra Carry about four years ago. The previous owner (or his "smith") had "polished" the ffed ramp with predictable results.

After some research and reading this thread (complete explanation and pics included):
http://forums.1911forum.com/showthre...ht=ramp+insert

I spoke with Chuck Rogers at Rogers Precision. He sounded like he knew what he was talking about so I sent it to him. In addition to milling the frame and installing the ramped insert, I asked him to Cera-Kote my frame black.

I was very impressed with the workmanship, and the turnaround time was reasonable as well. I don't remember the price but that goes to prove the saying about "the regret of poor quality remains long after the joy of a low price has gone". Whatever the cost, it was worth it. This was, and still is, my favorite pistol.

I added a set of wood grips and some night sights and Voila! Poor man's Ultra CDP.

I cannot speak highly enough of Chuck Rogers and Rogers Precision. His process will give your favorite pistol new life.

CowTowner · December 7, 2009, 06:43 AM

Quote:

Do not put a ramped barrel in a single-stack 1911. You'll have feeding problems.

Mr. Bonar, can you elaborate please sir?
I own 2 Para's and both came with ramped barrels new from the factory.
Is your comment specific to replacement of an originally non-ramped barrel?
I have been told for years this practice improved feeding in single-stack 1911's.

omega · December 7, 2009, 10:09 AM

The eternal quest for the lighter 1911 does come at a price.

An alloy frame ramp can withstand a lifetime of round-ball feedings, but if the end product user insists on relegating the weapon to a jacketed hollow point diet, then this is the eventual disease.

You know it. We know it. Kimber knows it. The plastic gun makers know it.

If a good and nobly designed plastic/alloy gun is constructed with steel slide rail inserts, any stand-up manufacturer would be better served to make the gun with a steel ramp insert as well.

Alas, very few pistoleers are truly aware of such a detail, and the capitalist desire for a manufacturer's profit supersedes the obligation for creating a durable product.

RickB · December 7, 2009, 07:43 PM

Of course, the typical handgun gets "a box of shells" a year through it, so that crummy aluminum frame will last only two or three lifetimes.

Nobody should have just one 1911 anyway, so get a steel-framed gun for most of the shooting, and then the alloy gun gets most of the packing. I've had my Commander for ten years, and have probably put fewer than 500 rounds through it, while putting 30,000+ rounds through two steel-framed guns. The Commander's always worked, so I've had no need to shoot it a lot to "prove" that it will work.

jborushko · December 7, 2009, 09:32 PM

i do have more than one 1911 (nine actually). i like to practice with my carry piece with my carry ammunition, often. but i feel confident that after getting a steel ramp put in. will be back to blasting holes in no time.

2003flht · December 7, 2009, 10:23 PM

Okay.... I just read this post, and you guys had me FREAKING out!

I just ran to the safe and pulled out my Kimber Ultra Carry II. I needed to see the feed ramp! Well, mine has a ramped barrel...

I was expecting to see an aluminum feedramp all buggered up.

Did Kimber realize the problem and change to a ramped barrel? Or did someone repair mine before? (I did buy it used several years ago.)

PS> sorry if i hijacked the thread. I'm was paranoid about my feedramp though!

jborushko · December 7, 2009, 10:52 PM

i believe that the ULTRA- carry only comes in 3" and therefore only comes with a ramped barrel. mine is a PRO-carry II, which is 4" barrel - i dont know if they changed to a ramped barrel later on. but i bought mine about 3 or 4 years ago. so *shrugs*

2003flht · December 8, 2009, 07:31 AM

yes, mine is definetaly ramped.... phewwwwww! Thats too bad for the others. Hopefully someone out there still does these repairs though.

arkieron · December 9, 2009, 09:24 AM

I have not yet experienced this disease in my Tactical. But after Kimber willingly installing replacement night sights on my used pistol without charge, I would not hesitate to send them mine for solution. I don't believe that this is the right frame for heavy range shooting. On the other hand, I shoot the dickens out of my Glock 34.

orionengnr · December 9, 2009, 09:46 PM

Quote:

i believe that the ULTRA- carry only comes in 3" and therefore only comes with a ramped barrel.

Nope. I have owned one Ultra Carry with the ramped barrel, and one that required the ramp insert I mentioned in post #7 above.
I also have an Ultra CDP with the alloy ramp--if I shoot it enough, one day I'll have to get the ramp insert done to it as well.

jborushko · December 9, 2009, 09:59 PM

ah... my mistake. right-o

obviously they changed it up a bit at some point

jborushko · December 11, 2009, 12:26 AM

well the part is ordered from brownell's. it is a EGW part so *shrugs*

ill let everyone know how it turns out when it comes in and i have time to run my frame through the mill!

jansson84 · January 25, 2010, 08:17 PM

I have a Mitchell Arms frame which has no ramp, it's cut for a ramped barrel. Does anyone have the dimensions of the EGW ramp insert and instructions?

Lacking the EGW insert, what size drill rod should I instead? Any pics would be helpful.

triggerman770 · January 29, 2010, 09:26 AM

you would be better off putting a ramped barrel in(and less expensive.
there is no metal to back the ramp insert so additional work would have to be done to secure the insert. check Nowlin for the barrels

Harry Bonar · January 30, 2010, 04:29 PM

Sir;
I've fixed these before; Mill straight down taking the old ramp clear out and insert a piece of drill rod (shrink fit) and then pin it. Reshape to original specs - will never move or wear. It doesn't hurt to use red loc-tite with the pin.
Harry B.

Idahogunsmith · February 4, 2010, 03:53 PM

Most feeding issues a usually not feed ramp /frame issues but a poorly regulated magazine. If the slide is driving the bullet nose into the feeding ramp isn't pointed in the wrong direction? It should be pointed up towards the upper top middle of the chamber. Your magazines might need to be reshaped a tad using the magazine reforming tool. Can be bought online from midway or brownell

Next a ramped barrel fixes most problems, including running super hot loads that is how they got started. But really with slide removed How much gap do you have between the bottom rear of the barrel and the ramp should be around 1/32 of an inch or as close to .0315 as possible if it is great then file the back of the barrel down to it sets back that far rear lug located on bottom of barrel just in back of the link pin . After this file works is done on the rear lug face.

Remember as ways modify an inexpensive part first in this case a magazine, then a barrel. Mag less the $50, Barrel less then $200, frames ? Lots more

Then if all these tips don't work replace the ramp. Chances are one of these tricks will work.

jborushko · February 4, 2010, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Most feeding issues a usually not feed ramp /frame issues but a poorly regulated magazine. If the slide is driving the bullet nose into the feeding ramp isn't pointed in the wrong direction? It should be pointed up towards the upper top middle of the chamber. Your magazines might need to be reshaped a tad using the magazine reforming tool. Can be bought online from midway or brownell

Next a ramped barrel fixes most problems, including running super hot loads that is how they got started. But really with slide removed How much gap do you have between the bottom rear of the barrel and the ramp should be around 1/32 of an inch or as close to .0315 as possible if it is great then file the back of the barrel down to it sets back that far rear lug located on bottom of barrel just in back of the link pin . After this file works is done on the rear lug face.

Remember as ways modify an inexpensive part first in this case a magazine, then a barrel. Mag less the $50, Barrel less then $200, frames ? Lots more

Then if all these tips don't work replace the ramp. Chances are one of these tricks will work.

1. they dont sell ramped barrels for this model that i've been able to find, so a custom barrel is more than $200

2. i've run this through will ALL my 1911 mags and all of them, now with traditional hollow points hang up on the dimple in the feed famp. these mag include wilson combat, colt, kimber, chip mccormick, ect.

3. the anodized coating of the aluminum is worn through exposing the soft aluminum, so that problem MUST be corrected period.

4. the ramp to barrel gap is correct

5. im already invested on the idea of cutting out the ramp and replacing it with steel so at the very least i wont have a worn through anodized coating ever again on the feed ramp

6. when jacking a round slowly then visually the round is pointed where its supposed to be. obviously i cant tell at full speed

when i get back from Haiti i will have some time off to go into the shop, and i will cut away at the ramp and insert the steel. ill do a big pic post of all that in about 5 months (when i get back and get it done)

Quote:

Harry Bonar

thats pretty much what is going to happen except i wont have to shape the ramp to much as its a prefab part, other than fitting

Devon · February 6, 2010, 06:39 PM

May not be the hollow points doing it, I've seen mag followers chew up feed ramps also. The folded metal followers have nothing to keep it from nibbling away at the feed ramp. Can you post a pic of your magazines?

jborushko · February 7, 2010, 01:08 AM

plastic followers on all my wilson comat mags - which are the only mags that go in the kimber.

-i need to pick some up for my Colt New Agent- im still rocken the colt mags with that, but they have the metal followers-

also i've had fail to feeds where the hollow point is just hung up on the feed ramp with the lip of the bullet just buried into the aluminum

December 2, 2009, 01:45 PM	#1
jborushko Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2009 Location: Tacoma WA Posts: 469	aluminum 1911, steel ramp replacement? ... gots me a kimber pro-carry 2 (aluminum frame) and having feed it 5000 rounds 1000+ of that federal HST hollow points, the aluminum feed ramp in chewed up and no longer feeding hollow points reliably -i've already checked all other possibilities, i KNOW its the ramp- anyway, i've seen the steel ramp inserts on the brownell's website http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=2...ED_RAMP_INSERT how are these installed? obviously you mill out the old ramp and fit the new one, but how is it held in? do you pin it? or is there someother way of holding it and we have to get creative? EDIT: i've looked for a ramped barrel but no luck - so unless somebody can point me in the right direction... thanks for the help! as we all know the aluminum frames are notorious for getting the feed ramps eaten away over time of feeding them hollow points, the anodizing on the ramp gets worn down leaving the soft aluminum open to abuse. im hoping to salvage my main carry piece. i love my Kimber so i dont want to make it a ball round range gun only. its deeper than the picture makes it look, but you can see the wear to the aluminum __________________ EDIT: yeah i always "edit" my posts Last edited by jborushko; December 2, 2009 at 03:02 PM.

December 2, 2009, 02:45 PM	#2
omega Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2009 Location: homeless Posts: 140	Here's a possible source of ramped barrels, but it would still have to be cut in. Sorry to see your Kimber suffering like this. Good luck. http://www.kingsgunworks.com/newcatalog/page10.html PS: There is no harm in trying to salvage the ramp yourself using a (dare I say it) Dremel tool. A less-is-better touch with a small stone (going up into and throating the barrel a bit if necessary) is worth a try. Quite honestly, you've got nothing to loose. __________________ end up with the right regrets Last edited by omega; December 2, 2009 at 02:50 PM.

December 2, 2009, 02:55 PM	#3
jborushko Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2009 Location: Tacoma WA Posts: 469	polishing an anodized aluminum feed ramp is not fees-able as it will remove the anodizing that protects the aluminum even more than it already is (which is what caused the problem to begin with) i would have to re-anodize the whole frame and the price makes that not a good option- but still an option (lol then i could anodize the frame something stupid like color GOLD, that would be funny). and i would still have this problem again in the future. im pretty set on either replacing the ramp with steel or finding a ramped barrel - thought the later has shown no results at all - thanks for the link thought ill check it out! EDIT: i called Kings and they dont have a ramped barrel __________________ EDIT: yeah i always "edit" my posts Last edited by jborushko; December 2, 2009 at 03:01 PM.

December 2, 2009, 08:43 PM	#6
Harry Bonar Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2004 Location: In the Vincent, Ohio general area. Posts: 1,804	ramp Sir; Do not put a ramped barrel in a single-stack 1911. You'll have feeding problems. I use a "plunge mill" of ramp diameter and cut it clear out. Then I insert a piece of drill rod, secure it with a pin (really not necessary) and mill the top off and shape it to standard feed ramp dimensions - works forever! Harry B.

December 7, 2009, 10:09 AM	#9
omega Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2009 Location: homeless Posts: 140	The eternal quest for the lighter 1911 does come at a price. An alloy frame ramp can withstand a lifetime of round-ball feedings, but if the end product user insists on relegating the weapon to a jacketed hollow point diet, then this is the eventual disease. You know it. We know it. Kimber knows it. The plastic gun makers know it. If a good and nobly designed plastic/alloy gun is constructed with steel slide rail inserts, any stand-up manufacturer would be better served to make the gun with a steel ramp insert as well. Alas, very few pistoleers are truly aware of such a detail, and the capitalist desire for a manufacturer's profit supersedes the obligation for creating a durable product. __________________ end up with the right regrets

December 2, 2009, 07:47 PM	#5
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,518	I believe the steel insert is secured by a screw that's threaded-in from the left side, the head being hidden by the slide stop. Evolution Gun Works used to install them, but I don't think they're doing in-house gunsmithing any more. I believe they will refer you to their former 'smith, though.

December 4, 2009, 07:30 PM	#7
orionengnr Senior Member Join Date: July 9, 2004 Posts: 5,173	I feel your pain... I bought a Kimber Stainless Ultra Carry about four years ago. The previous owner (or his "smith") had "polished" the ffed ramp with predictable results. After some research and reading this thread (complete explanation and pics included): http://forums.1911forum.com/showthre...ht=ramp+insert I spoke with Chuck Rogers at Rogers Precision. He sounded like he knew what he was talking about so I sent it to him. In addition to milling the frame and installing the ramped insert, I asked him to Cera-Kote my frame black. I was very impressed with the workmanship, and the turnaround time was reasonable as well. I don't remember the price but that goes to prove the saying about "the regret of poor quality remains long after the joy of a low price has gone". Whatever the cost, it was worth it. This was, and still is, my favorite pistol. I added a set of wood grips and some night sights and Voila! Poor man's Ultra CDP. I cannot speak highly enough of Chuck Rogers and Rogers Precision. His process will give your favorite pistol new life.

December 7, 2009, 07:43 PM	#10
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,518	Of course, the typical handgun gets "a box of shells" a year through it, so that crummy aluminum frame will last only two or three lifetimes. Nobody should have just one 1911 anyway, so get a steel-framed gun for most of the shooting, and then the alloy gun gets most of the packing. I've had my Commander for ten years, and have probably put fewer than 500 rounds through it, while putting 30,000+ rounds through two steel-framed guns. The Commander's always worked, so I've had no need to shoot it a lot to "prove" that it will work.

December 7, 2009, 09:32 PM	#11
jborushko Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2009 Location: Tacoma WA Posts: 469	i do have more than one 1911 (nine actually). i like to practice with my carry piece with my carry ammunition, often. but i feel confident that after getting a steel ramp put in. will be back to blasting holes in no time. __________________ EDIT: yeah i always "edit" my posts

December 7, 2009, 10:23 PM	#12
2003flht Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Location: Connecticut Posts: 199	Okay.... I just read this post, and you guys had me FREAKING out! I just ran to the safe and pulled out my Kimber Ultra Carry II. I needed to see the feed ramp! Well, mine has a ramped barrel... I was expecting to see an aluminum feedramp all buggered up. Did Kimber realize the problem and change to a ramped barrel? Or did someone repair mine before? (I did buy it used several years ago.) PS> sorry if i hijacked the thread. I'm was paranoid about my feedramp though! __________________ "Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming...Wow! What a ride!" Give a Liberal a fish, he'll ask for seconds. Teach a Liberal to fish, he'll sign up for unemployment...

December 7, 2009, 10:52 PM	#13
jborushko Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2009 Location: Tacoma WA Posts: 469	i believe that the ULTRA- carry only comes in 3" and therefore only comes with a ramped barrel. mine is a PRO-carry II, which is 4" barrel - i dont know if they changed to a ramped barrel later on. but i bought mine about 3 or 4 years ago. so shrugs __________________ EDIT: yeah i always "edit" my posts

December 8, 2009, 07:31 AM	#14
2003flht Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Location: Connecticut Posts: 199	yes, mine is definetaly ramped.... phewwwwww! Thats too bad for the others. Hopefully someone out there still does these repairs though. __________________ "Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming...Wow! What a ride!" Give a Liberal a fish, he'll ask for seconds. Teach a Liberal to fish, he'll sign up for unemployment...

December 9, 2009, 09:24 AM	#15
arkieron Member Join Date: January 10, 2009 Location: Fort Smith Posts: 45	Why not Kimber I have not yet experienced this disease in my Tactical. But after Kimber willingly installing replacement night sights on my used pistol without charge, I would not hesitate to send them mine for solution. I don't believe that this is the right frame for heavy range shooting. On the other hand, I shoot the dickens out of my Glock 34.

December 9, 2009, 09:59 PM	#17
jborushko Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2009 Location: Tacoma WA Posts: 469	ah... my mistake. right-o obviously they changed it up a bit at some point __________________ EDIT: yeah i always "edit" my posts

December 11, 2009, 12:26 AM	#18
jborushko Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2009 Location: Tacoma WA Posts: 469	well the part is ordered from brownell's. it is a EGW part so shrugs ill let everyone know how it turns out when it comes in and i have time to run my frame through the mill! __________________ EDIT: yeah i always "edit" my posts

January 25, 2010, 08:17 PM	#19
jansson84 Junior Member Join Date: January 25, 2010 Location: Bergen County, NJ Posts: 9	Ramp insert I have a Mitchell Arms frame which has no ramp, it's cut for a ramped barrel. Does anyone have the dimensions of the EGW ramp insert and instructions? Lacking the EGW insert, what size drill rod should I instead? Any pics would be helpful.

January 29, 2010, 09:26 AM	#20
triggerman770 Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2009 Location: Metro Atlanta Area Posts: 125	if it has no ramp.. you would be better off putting a ramped barrel in(and less expensive. there is no metal to back the ramp insert so additional work would have to be done to secure the insert. check Nowlin for the barrels __________________ Small Arms Restoration, Inc. smallarmsrestoration.net Proud member of Georgia Carry.org www.georgiacarry.org

January 30, 2010, 04:29 PM	#21
Harry Bonar Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2004 Location: In the Vincent, Ohio general area. Posts: 1,804	ramp Sir; I've fixed these before; Mill straight down taking the old ramp clear out and insert a piece of drill rod (shrink fit) and then pin it. Reshape to original specs - will never move or wear. It doesn't hurt to use red loc-tite with the pin. Harry B.

February 4, 2010, 03:53 PM	#22
Idahogunsmith Junior Member Join Date: January 27, 2010 Location: Boise Idaho Posts: 9	Now hold yer horses Most feeding issues a usually not feed ramp /frame issues but a poorly regulated magazine. If the slide is driving the bullet nose into the feeding ramp isn't pointed in the wrong direction? It should be pointed up towards the upper top middle of the chamber. Your magazines might need to be reshaped a tad using the magazine reforming tool. Can be bought online from midway or brownell Next a ramped barrel fixes most problems, including running super hot loads that is how they got started. But really with slide removed How much gap do you have between the bottom rear of the barrel and the ramp should be around 1/32 of an inch or as close to .0315 as possible if it is great then file the back of the barrel down to it sets back that far rear lug located on bottom of barrel just in back of the link pin . After this file works is done on the rear lug face. Remember as ways modify an inexpensive part first in this case a magazine, then a barrel. Mag less the $50, Barrel less then $200, frames ? Lots more Then if all these tips don't work replace the ramp. Chances are one of these tricks will work.

February 6, 2010, 06:39 PM	#24
Devon Junior Member Join Date: January 1, 2005 Location: Kansas Posts: 14	May not be the hollow points doing it, I've seen mag followers chew up feed ramps also. The folded metal followers have nothing to keep it from nibbling away at the feed ramp. Can you post a pic of your magazines?

February 7, 2010, 01:08 AM	#25
jborushko Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2009 Location: Tacoma WA Posts: 469	plastic followers on all my wilson comat mags - which are the only mags that go in the kimber. -i need to pick some up for my Colt New Agent- im still rocken the colt mags with that, but they have the metal followers- also i've had fail to feeds where the hollow point is just hung up on the feed ramp with the lip of the bullet just buried into the aluminum __________________ EDIT: yeah i always "edit" my posts Last edited by jborushko; February 7, 2010 at 02:50 AM.

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