Hunting large birds with 2 3/4 inch rounds?

[Deja vu]

What loads would you recommend for Turkeys?

I am looking to take grandpas old gun out for a round of hunting with a recent land owners hunt I have acquired. I went to my local Cabellas as all I could find in turkey loads are 3 - 3.5 inch magnum round. Does such a load exist for 2 3/4 inch rounds?

I am picking this gun for sentimental reasons. Sure I could take my 870 but I wanted to take grandpa turkey hunting again... It seems to older I get the more sentimental I get

[zoomie]

Lots of options online. I bet this kills them.

http://www.gandermountain.com/modper...3711&from=grid

[Deja vu]

that does look good. I think I may pull out the old credit card. Thank you! It does mean a lot to me!



*I may give the thread some more time before I place the order though

[Doyle]

Sure, a 2 3/4" load will kill a turkey. You just don't get the range that you can get with the 3 or 3 1/2" loads.

[mxsailor803]

Winchester and Remington make 2 3/4" turkey rounds. Its all I use. Never been a big recoil fan, so I stick to the "little 12ga" rounds.

[NoSecondBest]

Sure, a 2 3/4" load will kill a turkey. You just don't get the range that you can get with the 3 or 3 1/2" loads.

Range has nothing to do with it. It's a difference in pattern density with the same choke. The pellets don't go any farther with a 3" or a 3.5". In some cases, the velocity is actually reduced with the heavier loads and they don't have as much energy at the same distance the 2.75" shells have. If you don't believe it, look it up in the Lyman Shotshell reloading manual.

[idek]

http://www.midwayusa.com/find?sortby...ensionid=20783

^^^ MidwayUSA's listings of 2-3/4" turkey ammo

Range has nothing to do with it. It's a difference in pattern density with the same choke. The pellets don't go any farther with a 3" or a 3.5".

Is it not true to say that a shell with greater density out to a longer distance has greater effective range?

[Virginian]

Turkey hunting is shooting at a small part of a large bird. The key is knowing what kind of patterns your gun shoots with your intended loads and at what ranges so you know you have a killing combination, and being able to call them in to that range. You don't need a 3-1/2" magnum or a super duper named choke tube, but you do need to know what you are doing. It is very different from almost all other types of shotgun hunting other than slug hunting to me.

[hartcreek]

I load my own and I even use a Marlin #19 with 2 1/2 inch hulls if I feel like it.

[Doyle]

Range has nothing to do with it.

Range has EVERYTHING to do with it. You simply cannot get a reliable pattern at 50+ yards with a 2 3/4" shell - even with the best turkey choke. There just isn't enough pellets. That is why turkey hunters will suffer thru the punishing recoil of a 3 1/2"shell. They want those extra few yards that the big shells give you.

[NoSecondBest]

So far, Virginian-in-LA seems to have summerized the best answer. He's probably hunted turkeys a bit. I've shot around seventy-five myself and I have a pretty good idea of how shotgun patterns and effective range work. We're not talking handguns or rifles here. Like most questions asked on the internet, you get nineteen incorrect/bad answers for every good one and if you already don't know anything about the subject you can't sort them out.

[TimSr]

What did we ever do before all these fancy game-specific shells came out? #4 -#6 standard 2 3/4" game loads through a full choke. Shoot at paper to see how it patterns at different ranges.

[NoSecondBest]

Deja Vu,
Something that hasn't been mentioned here is that not all shotshells are made the same other than length. The best turkey loads are the ones with plated shot, either nickle or copper. Plated pellets will pattern significantly better than non-plated pellets. Also, not all different lengths have the same amount of shot in them by weight. Some 3" shells actually have more shot in them than other 3 1/2" shells. You need to read the box and see if the shot is plated and what weight of shot is in the shells. The next thing you have to do is try a few different shells in your gun/choke and see which ones pattern the best. Last, you need to find the effective range of your gun/pattern and work within that range. Forget about fifty yard shooting and concentrate on hunting technique. Call the birds in and work within the effective range of your gun. It's called "turkey hunting", not "turkey shooting". I've killed a ton of birds with the 2 3/4" shells but will admit to using 3" most often now days. However, I would have no qualms about going out with a 2 3/4" and not feel handicapped. Most of the birds I've shot were within twenty-five yards and some quite a bit closer. Three years ago I took out my grandfather's double barrel Ithaca shotgun, some forty year old 2 3/4" shotshells, and his favorite old Lynch box call. I called in three toms that morning and killed a nice tom. Probably one of my favorite hunts ever. He's been gone for almost thirty years and it was nice to get that gun out for what is probably its last time afield....at least for me.

[bamaranger]

Let me start by saying that I do the same thing now and again, ....carry my Grandad's old pump gun, the one I took my first gobbler with in 1980, on a spring hunt. Fixed full choke, 28" bbl., solid rib, all steel and walnut, Savage Model of 1921! The proverbial blast from the past. But note that I have been advised by competent authority not to shoot the ammo I am about to describe in Pap's old gun. But that is another story.

What is missing from the OP on his "grandpa's old gun" is choke information. I am going to make the assumption that the old gun is fixed "full" choke. I cannot in good faith recommend that any untested modified, or any other more open choke constriction go gobbler hunting. There are some "modified" barrels that shoot considerably tighter than one might think, especially with modern ammo and some testing would yield if one's modified gun would be acceptable. But I hesitate to give a go ahead for every modified gun.

Also, some grandad's are younger than others, and it may be that the gun in question has choke tubes, if so, than the OP needs to acquire, minimally, a standard full tube, and optimally, a special turkey choke.

All that said, there are indeed "short magnums, or baby magnums", 2-3/4" mags that typically throw 1-1/2 oz of lead shot, a quarter oz more than standard heavy field loads. I have in my assortment some old 2-3/4" mags that throw 1-5/8 oz of shot, very well I might add, from my 3" guns. All (well the big 3 anyhow) the domestic ammo makers offer baby mags or short mags, some searching should yield results.

When bamaboy was 16, we used some of the vintage 1-5/8 oz (#6 lead) loads for him to take his first two gobblers...cleanly, at 32 and 46 paces, respectively. The short mags kicked a tad less than 3" shells, so I thought. and him being a bit lanky, the short mags seemed a good choice.

Let me add that it is not unusual for any shotgun not to deliver its payload precisely at the point of aim, again, some simple test shots will tell. If that is the case with the "old gun", then some type of adjustable sights, or Kentucky windage will be called for.

Don't move......he's coming!!!!!!!!!!!!

[jmr40]

Range has nothing to do with it. It's a difference in pattern density with the same choke.

Of course it does. At longer ranges smaller payloads get big holes in the patterns sooner than shells with more shot in them. Going to larger shells means you can also go up in shot size without sacraficing the number of pellets. This also adds a bit to range. Now you could make a good argument that the difference is small and not worth the added recoil and I wouldn't strongly disagree.

The 3" shells are only a minor advantage for turkey hunting and 3 1/2" shells are just not worth the recoil to me. I shoot 3", but wouldn't feel handicapped with only 2 3/4" shells. To be honest I can't think of a bird I've ever killed that I couldn't have killed with the shorter shells.

Where the longer shells really shine is with steel shot.

You don't have to buy "turkey" shells. Just any loaded with #6, #4 or #5 shot will do. I'm betting you're more likely to find #6's, which would be my choice anyway. Smaller shot means more pellets which helps make up for pattern density. You should be able to make hits on the head out to at least 30-35 yards with proper choke.

[bamaranger]

JMR, I gotta disagree, "just any shell" is not good advice. Somebody could take a 1-1/8 oz field load, or heaven forbid, a 1 oz load, (bulk packed) and will not be as well prepared as another with true turkey loads. Cheap loads have soft shot, cheap wads, and do not pattern as well as premium stuff. The buffering, hardened, plated shot from premium turkey loads offer a distinct advantage in pattern and thus range. A true turkey load, especially a short mag, or certainly a 3" mag, can throw near twice the amount of shot "just any shell" does, and that higher payload means denser patterns, more range.

I'm not advocating long ranging turkeys, at 30 yds and less, the old standby 1-1/4 12 ga load will do the job. If one can consistently pick and choose 30 yd and less shots, good for them. But I would rather have a bit more reach when I botch the range estimation, more lead in the air to combat obstacles, and more pellets on target when things go right.

When I hunted my Grandad's gun, I did/do so with standard 1-1/4oz loads, (#6) but recognize I am handicapping myself. That old gun with standard loads will put about 60-70 pellets on a sheet of copy paper at 30 yds. My real turkey gun will deliver over 3 times that. There's really no comparison.

[hartcreek]

It all comes down to how much you practice. The head on a turkey is about the size of some sparrows. I used to walk the ditch bank behind my folks place and practice on sparrows as the birds made a mess out of the cherries so the orchardist his not care if I was there. I have used short copper wire-#8 in my Mossberg and found most anythng would work. Since I purchases a bag of #8 shot that is what I use for my Marlin and my 150+ year old BP 16 gage. For my Mossberg I just use cheep trap/skeet loads and get to hunting. Where I hunt if there are turkeys there is usually a group of them. Turkey hunting is also open here to bow and cross bow hunting.

[FITASC]

Range has EVERYTHING to do with it. You simply cannot get a reliable pattern at 50+ yards with a 2 3/4" shell - even with the best turkey choke. There just isn't enough pellets. That is why turkey hunters will suffer thru the punishing recoil of a 3 1/2"shell. They want those extra few yards that the big shells give you.

Perhaps they should work on their calling so they can get the turkey to come in closer??????

[Doyle]

FITASC, I certainly won't disagree with you there. Good calling will make or break a hunt. However, even the best callers will get turkeys that hang up. Usually, they'll hang up just outside of whatever range you have that day.

[FITASC]

I have seen folks make some amazing shots at distance with both rifle and shotgun, but to ME, the real hero is the patient guy who knows how to bring them in close enough to use a sub gauge.........
Again, IMO, poor calling skills result in folks wanting a shotgun to act like a 22-250

JMO, YMMV.

Sometimes you just have to pass on the shot. I like a 28 gauge fior upland and wild chukar and pheasant can be a challenge, but as Clint said in that movie....."A man has to know his limitations".......It's about the hunt, not about the kill....

[ejb69]

At close range even light target loads will kill a turkey.

[bamaranger]

Close enough range and you can probably kill one with a .22 rat shot or a switch.

There are all sorts of things that can go wrong while you wait for a bird to get "close enough", and one is best advised to take the first good shot you get.

Here is a list of stuff that has spoiled set ups for me:
-a horse wandered in
-a cow wandered in
-coyote snuck in
-another hunter
-a deer
-a drunk on a golf cart (no lie) though the bird was not in range yet
-a power line mow crew
-a hen
-another gobbler
-etc

If you have a good shot, you better take it, things can go wrong fast. Put multiple birds on scene, and your chances of getting picked off and getting no shot go up markedly.

I am NOT advocating long shots at gobblers. My average over the years is about 30 yds. But "sub gauge" gobbler hunting, hunting gobblers with target loads and other such things mentioned (sparrows?) is just plain bad advice borders on a stunt and sensationalism, or simply makes no sense.

The object is to get a clean kill, to do that at reasonable ranges, and to be able to do that on the limited number of opportunities one may get in a season. Yes it is about the hunt. But.....if that's all it's about, , we should just trade our guns for cameras. We seldom advise anybody to use the lightest legal cartridge for deer, why does it seem that folks are advising just that for gobblers?

MINIMALLY, 1-1/4 oz of shot (the 20 ga mag will throw this, and heavy 12 ga field loads this is standard) , and 1-1/2 as in a short mag 12, is better. Hevi- "Space shot" is a wonder, but I have no experience with it, but understand it adds a complete new dimension to the 20 ga. If limited to 1-1/4 oz of shot, I would look hard at #6 lead for denser patterns.

[Panfisher]

Sure are a fair number of turkeys killed around here by youngsters with 20 ga shotguns. More shot does NOT guarantee better patterns, one of the worst patterning loads I ever shot was a 3 inch 12 with 2 Oz of shot. One of the best was actually a heavy pheasant load beautiful pattern. Whatever you choose, pattern it so you know if it patterns well at 30 or 40 yards.

[mehavey]

Plain old 2¾"/#5 lead shot/choked has been doing fine for a 100 years.
The turkeys haven't changed... only the advertising agencies.

[T. O'Heir]

You simply cannot get a reliable pattern at 50+ yards with any shot shell. over 50 is too far period.
Load of Number 2's and an extra full choke will do nicely at realistic ranges.