needed crimp

VTR996 · October 10, 2001, 04:02 PM

I'm new to the rifle reloading,I'm reloading .223 and haven't seen where it is crucial to crimp or not. My lee directions say it's okay and my speer #13 says no cannalure no crimp, who do I believe? I'm using WW748 and BLC2 w std.and mag. primers cause Hornady don't list the mag. primer w/these powders but speer does.
I know with pistol ammo crimping makes a difference for various reasons ,how bout rifle?

Long Path · October 10, 2001, 04:36 PM

Kinda depends on your purpose, as well as what your results are. If you're shooting target, and get good results w/out a crimp, forget it.

If you're loading for hunting or the like, a crimp might be a good idea.

Be sure and make allowance for the slight increase in pressure when you crimp.

W/some loads, a crimp can bring about more uniform burning of the powder, which is why it's not a bad idea to experiment. Crimps are generally more important with auto rifles and with tube magazines. You don't say what you're shooting your .223 ammo out of?

--L.P.

pwiz · October 10, 2001, 05:05 PM

You really don't need a crimp on a .223. the rifle doesn't have any sort of recoil that would move the bullet and it would be a bit hard to move the bullet even if you carried a bunch in your pocket while hunting. The military expects the worst, so they crimp their bullets, crimp their primers, and waterproof their primers after seating too. Then you can put them in mud and water and still shoot them. I hope you don't have that kind of need.

pwiz

Dogjaw · October 13, 2001, 06:15 AM

When using bullets without a canalure(sp?) (groove for crimp) on the bullet, do not crimp it. Crimping can deform the bullet. I've even loaded Hornady Interlocks (which have a canalure) and not crimped them, both is bolt action and semi-autos. Go with Speer over Lee on the crimp issue.
Basically, the rifles that absolutely need a canalure and crimp are those with tubular magazines. If you don't crimp and it works at the range, it'll work while hunting. You spend time at the range to find out what works so you can use it hunting. The bullet doesn't know the difference between paper and animal.

Tom Matiska · October 13, 2001, 08:18 AM

Some semi autos do a pretty good imitation of an inertia puller when they slam the round into the chamber, and can require a crimp. Nosler #4 advises to use a taper crimp if necessary, as none of its .223 products have grooves and roll crimping can cause accuracy problems.

Tom

grunewaj · October 13, 2001, 09:42 PM

I'm going to start reloading .223 for my AR-15 for target shooting soon. I noticed Winchester and Remington had good prices on bullets (55gr. FMJ), but it seems as though they both have cannelures.
First: Are these decent bullets? How much better are the higher priced spread (eg. Speer or Hornady) than these likely to be?
Second: I don't plan on crimping. Is the cannelure going to affect reloading or the accuracy or should I make sure I get bullets without a cannelure?
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.

Dogjaw · October 14, 2001, 05:51 AM

There's nothing wrong with Winchester and Remington bullets. Best thing to do is try a box of each and see how they shoot in your gun ( that's half the fun of reloading). You do not have to crimp bullets with a cannelure. I shoot 30-06 all day long with no crimp or bullet movement. Taper crimping is done on pistol cartidges due to the recoil action of a light weapon (put a 357 mag in a 6# rifle and it's a pussycat).
I have to say there are times when I crimped the bullets and got better accuracy. My 250/3000 shoots 3/8", 100 yrd groups with Hornady Interlocks and a firm crimp. Just try with and without and stick with what works for you.

grunewaj · October 14, 2001, 07:08 AM

Thanks Dogjaw. That sounds like a plan.

October 10, 2001, 04:36 PM	#2
Long Path Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 1999 Location: N. Texas Posts: 5,899	Kinda depends on your purpose, as well as what your results are. If you're shooting target, and get good results w/out a crimp, forget it. If you're loading for hunting or the like, a crimp might be a good idea. Be sure and make allowance for the slight increase in pressure when you crimp. W/some loads, a crimp can bring about more uniform burning of the powder, which is why it's not a bad idea to experiment. Crimps are generally more important with auto rifles and with tube magazines. You don't say what you're shooting your .223 ammo out of? --L.P. __________________ "Welcome to The Firing Line, a virtual community dedicated to the discussion and advancement of responsible firearms ownership."T.F.L. Policy Page Will you, too, be one who stands in the gap? ____________

October 13, 2001, 09:42 PM	#6
grunewaj Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2001 Location: North Carolina Posts: 133	I'm going to start reloading .223 for my AR-15 for target shooting soon. I noticed Winchester and Remington had good prices on bullets (55gr. FMJ), but it seems as though they both have cannelures. First: Are these decent bullets? How much better are the higher priced spread (eg. Speer or Hornady) than these likely to be? Second: I don't plan on crimping. Is the cannelure going to affect reloading or the accuracy or should I make sure I get bullets without a cannelure? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. __________________ The government consists of a gang of men exactly like you and me. They have, taking one with another, no special talent for the business of government; they have only a talent for getting and holding office. Their principal device to that end is to search out groups who pant and pine for something they can't get and to promise to give it to them. Nine times out of ten, that promise is worth nothing. The tenth time is made good by looting A to satisfy B. In other words, government is a broker in pillage, and every election is sort of an advance auction sale of stolen goods. -- H. L. Mencken

October 14, 2001, 07:08 AM	#8
grunewaj Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2001 Location: North Carolina Posts: 133	Thanks Dogjaw. That sounds like a plan. __________________ The government consists of a gang of men exactly like you and me. They have, taking one with another, no special talent for the business of government; they have only a talent for getting and holding office. Their principal device to that end is to search out groups who pant and pine for something they can't get and to promise to give it to them. Nine times out of ten, that promise is worth nothing. The tenth time is made good by looting A to satisfy B. In other words, government is a broker in pillage, and every election is sort of an advance auction sale of stolen goods. -- H. L. Mencken

October 10, 2001, 04:02 PM	#1
VTR996 Senior Member Join Date: September 19, 2001 Location: OKLAHOMA Posts: 195	needed crimp I'm new to the rifle reloading,I'm reloading .223 and haven't seen where it is crucial to crimp or not. My lee directions say it's okay and my speer #13 says no cannalure no crimp, who do I believe? I'm using WW748 and BLC2 w std.and mag. primers cause Hornady don't list the mag. primer w/these powders but speer does. I know with pistol ammo crimping makes a difference for various reasons ,how bout rifle?

October 10, 2001, 05:05 PM	#3
pwiz Member Join Date: April 23, 2001 Posts: 61	You really don't need a crimp on a .223. the rifle doesn't have any sort of recoil that would move the bullet and it would be a bit hard to move the bullet even if you carried a bunch in your pocket while hunting. The military expects the worst, so they crimp their bullets, crimp their primers, and waterproof their primers after seating too. Then you can put them in mud and water and still shoot them. I hope you don't have that kind of need. pwiz

October 13, 2001, 06:15 AM	#4
Dogjaw Senior Member Join Date: October 6, 2001 Location: S.W. Michigan Posts: 560	When using bullets without a canalure(sp?) (groove for crimp) on the bullet, do not crimp it. Crimping can deform the bullet. I've even loaded Hornady Interlocks (which have a canalure) and not crimped them, both is bolt action and semi-autos. Go with Speer over Lee on the crimp issue. Basically, the rifles that absolutely need a canalure and crimp are those with tubular magazines. If you don't crimp and it works at the range, it'll work while hunting. You spend time at the range to find out what works so you can use it hunting. The bullet doesn't know the difference between paper and animal.

October 13, 2001, 08:18 AM	#5
Tom Matiska Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2000 Location: Wilkes-Barre, Pa Posts: 1,029	Some semi autos do a pretty good imitation of an inertia puller when they slam the round into the chamber, and can require a crimp. Nosler #4 advises to use a taper crimp if necessary, as none of its .223 products have grooves and roll crimping can cause accuracy problems. Tom

October 14, 2001, 05:51 AM	#7
Dogjaw Senior Member Join Date: October 6, 2001 Location: S.W. Michigan Posts: 560	There's nothing wrong with Winchester and Remington bullets. Best thing to do is try a box of each and see how they shoot in your gun ( that's half the fun of reloading). You do not have to crimp bullets with a cannelure. I shoot 30-06 all day long with no crimp or bullet movement. Taper crimping is done on pistol cartidges due to the recoil action of a light weapon (put a 357 mag in a 6# rifle and it's a pussycat). I have to say there are times when I crimped the bullets and got better accuracy. My 250/3000 shoots 3/8", 100 yrd groups with Hornady Interlocks and a firm crimp. Just try with and without and stick with what works for you.