Switching from jacketed to lead bullets in rifle?

My Toy · December 1, 2013, 03:59 PM

I've been shooting nothing but jacketed bullets in my Marlin 336XLR and wanted to try some Oregon Trail lead bullets. My question is should I de-copper my barrel before shooting lead or is the usual cleaning with Hoppe's and bore brush sufficient?

oldpapps · December 1, 2013, 04:28 PM

Yes or no, as you want.

I have found, nothing that I can document, that accuracy suffers for both lead and jacketed at a change over IF I don't fully and completely clean out the barrel.
OK, switching on a pistol, not so much.

I use 'Butch's Bore Shine' [only outside - that stuff stinks!] for jackets/copper and a lot of scrubbing.

Hoppies and brushes normally take care of lead, again a lot of scrubbing.

I have herd stories of barrels doing nasty things when going from lead to jacketed. Don't know if these stories are true but I always think to myself that barrel must have been all but slick with lead. Who knows, I don't.

Safety first and enjoy,

OSOK

jepp2 · December 1, 2013, 05:07 PM

Quote:

My question is should I de-copper my barrel before shooting lead or is the usual cleaning with Hoppe's and bore brush sufficient?
My Toy is offline Report Post

My goal is to remove all the copper from the bore after each range session.

My experience is that you will have less leading IF you remove all copper prior to shooting lead. And using Hoppe's does not remove copper from my barrel bores. There are many good copper removing solvents out there. You can choose the one you want.

A pause for the COZ · December 1, 2013, 05:28 PM

You know I cant really speak for guys who kick up the FPS to near jacketed.
But I switch back and forth between lead and jacketed with out any ill effects that I can see.
I do usually shoot my jacketed loads on a clean barrel then switch to cast.
Cast bullets seem to like a fouled barrel better any way.

Maybe it makes a difference if your shooting hard cast... Dont know.

Normal harness and cast bullets speeds. I have no Issues.

rodfac · December 2, 2013, 02:40 PM

I do a lot of cast bullet shooting in my long guns....I clean the jacketed fouling out each time I switch over as per NRA recommendations in their old Cast Bullet manual. I've seen the difference, sometimes cutting the cast bullet groups in half, by cleaning before shooting them. Also, it takes 5-6 rounds of lead alloy bullets to re-season the bore for cast bullets.

Going the other way doesn't seem to matter as much. In fact, I've used full power jacketed rounds to clean out persistent leading in my barrels, again, following NRA recommendations. It works well, only takes 2-3 rounds and you're back to go again.

NRA says that it's not necessary to get absolutely anal about jacketed deposits, and that a normal cleaning with Hoppe's, a brush and some patches usually suffices. For real gilt edge accuracy, you'd want to get it somewhat better, but then I'm not a bench rest shooter with either kind. A light cleaning is good enough to get me 2" gps or less with a scoped Sako .308 and a bit more than that with a vintage Krag and its original sights.

For more in depth information on this, try out the Cast Boolits forum, or the Cast Bullet Assn. forum.

HTH's Rod

m&p45acp10+1 · December 2, 2013, 05:58 PM

I have never fired cast lead from a rifle that I shoot jacketed bullets out of. I have a Marlin 1895 GG that I have over 1500 rounds of lead through that has never seen a factory load, or jacketed bullet. I doubt it ever will.

I have been wanting to start casting for one of my Mosin Nagant rifles. I still plan to when the supply for molds catches back up. Before I would ever run a lead round though it I would remove all copper the way I do for hand guns. I first work on getting out the carbon, and some of the copper with solvent. I patch out till patches come out clean. I then run a saturated patch of ammonia. (Cost about $3 for a half gal. at Lowe's. I then wait a half our. I patch with a damp patch, and see if it is showing blue. If it is blue I saturate a nylon brush with ammonia, and brush for at least 10 in and out passes then a damp patch. Wait a few minutes run a damp patch again. I repeat till no more blue stuff.

Most copper eliminators use ammonia. If it says blue patches mean there is still fouling it has ammonia. Ammonia causes copper to oxidize making the blue stuff you see on the patches.

When done I run a couple of clean dry patches, then an oiled one. Wait a few minutes then a few dry patches. The more fouling there is the longer it takes. I have had some barrels that I have cleaned for friends that patches with standard cleaner came out looking clean. Then when checked with the ammonia using a plastic patch loop that left patches as blue as the sky on a sunny day.

December 1, 2013, 03:59 PM	#1
My Toy Member Join Date: August 8, 2008 Posts: 45	Switching from jacketed to lead bullets in rifle? I've been shooting nothing but jacketed bullets in my Marlin 336XLR and wanted to try some Oregon Trail lead bullets. My question is should I de-copper my barrel before shooting lead or is the usual cleaning with Hoppe's and bore brush sufficient?

December 2, 2013, 02:40 PM	#5
rodfac Senior Member Join Date: January 22, 2005 Location: Kentucky Posts: 3,624	I do a lot of cast bullet shooting in my long guns....I clean the jacketed fouling out each time I switch over as per NRA recommendations in their old Cast Bullet manual. I've seen the difference, sometimes cutting the cast bullet groups in half, by cleaning before shooting them. Also, it takes 5-6 rounds of lead alloy bullets to re-season the bore for cast bullets. Going the other way doesn't seem to matter as much. In fact, I've used full power jacketed rounds to clean out persistent leading in my barrels, again, following NRA recommendations. It works well, only takes 2-3 rounds and you're back to go again. NRA says that it's not necessary to get absolutely anal about jacketed deposits, and that a normal cleaning with Hoppe's, a brush and some patches usually suffices. For real gilt edge accuracy, you'd want to get it somewhat better, but then I'm not a bench rest shooter with either kind. A light cleaning is good enough to get me 2" gps or less with a scoped Sako .308 and a bit more than that with a vintage Krag and its original sights. For more in depth information on this, try out the Cast Boolits forum, or the Cast Bullet Assn. forum. HTH's Rod __________________ Cherish our flag, honor it, defend it in word and deed, or get the hell out. Our Bill of Rights has been paid for by heros in uniform and shall not be diluted by misguided governmental social experiments. We owe this to our children, anything less is cowardice. USAF FAC, 5th Spl Forces, Vietnam Vet '69-'73.

December 2, 2013, 05:58 PM	#6
m&p45acp10+1 Senior Member Join Date: May 3, 2009 Location: Central Texas Posts: 3,930	I have never fired cast lead from a rifle that I shoot jacketed bullets out of. I have a Marlin 1895 GG that I have over 1500 rounds of lead through that has never seen a factory load, or jacketed bullet. I doubt it ever will. I have been wanting to start casting for one of my Mosin Nagant rifles. I still plan to when the supply for molds catches back up. Before I would ever run a lead round though it I would remove all copper the way I do for hand guns. I first work on getting out the carbon, and some of the copper with solvent. I patch out till patches come out clean. I then run a saturated patch of ammonia. (Cost about $3 for a half gal. at Lowe's. I then wait a half our. I patch with a damp patch, and see if it is showing blue. If it is blue I saturate a nylon brush with ammonia, and brush for at least 10 in and out passes then a damp patch. Wait a few minutes run a damp patch again. I repeat till no more blue stuff. Most copper eliminators use ammonia. If it says blue patches mean there is still fouling it has ammonia. Ammonia causes copper to oxidize making the blue stuff you see on the patches. When done I run a couple of clean dry patches, then an oiled one. Wait a few minutes then a few dry patches. The more fouling there is the longer it takes. I have had some barrels that I have cleaned for friends that patches with standard cleaner came out looking clean. Then when checked with the ammonia using a plastic patch loop that left patches as blue as the sky on a sunny day. __________________ No matter how many times you do it and nothing happens it only takes something going wrong one time to kill you.

December 1, 2013, 04:28 PM	#2
oldpapps Senior Member Join Date: September 22, 2011 Location: Middle America Posts: 518	Yes or no, as you want. I have found, nothing that I can document, that accuracy suffers for both lead and jacketed at a change over IF I don't fully and completely clean out the barrel. OK, switching on a pistol, not so much. I use 'Butch's Bore Shine' [only outside - that stuff stinks!] for jackets/copper and a lot of scrubbing. Hoppies and brushes normally take care of lead, again a lot of scrubbing. I have herd stories of barrels doing nasty things when going from lead to jacketed. Don't know if these stories are true but I always think to myself that barrel must have been all but slick with lead. Who knows, I don't. Safety first and enjoy, OSOK

December 1, 2013, 05:28 PM	#4
A pause for the COZ Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 2012 Location: Braham, Minnesota Posts: 1,314	You know I cant really speak for guys who kick up the FPS to near jacketed. But I switch back and forth between lead and jacketed with out any ill effects that I can see. I do usually shoot my jacketed loads on a clean barrel then switch to cast. Cast bullets seem to like a fouled barrel better any way. Maybe it makes a difference if your shooting hard cast... Dont know. Normal harness and cast bullets speeds. I have no Issues.