Casting Hollow Point .45 Bullets

Maxem0815 · August 12, 2011, 05:45 AM

Has anyone here cast .45 hollow points? I have a universal hollow point kit for my case trimmer but they do not come out centered or with a large enough cavity to expand in media. I have been casting .577 hollow base Minie's and assume that the process would be identical however due to lack of molds and knowledge of which top punch to purchase has confused me to a point that I haven't started yet. The top punch seems to be the crucial part here.
Any help would be appreciated

Mace

**Shane Tuttle** · August 12, 2011, 06:11 AM

IllinoisCoyoteHunter just might be the man with the plan. Give him a day or two to chime in or PM/email him. He's been casting for a while and I think he's done .45ACP hollowpoints, IIRC. In fact, if memory serves, I have a sample batch from him of his hollowpoints...

PawPaw · August 12, 2011, 06:23 AM

You can either modify an existing mold to make hollow points, or you could just buy a hollow point mold. Lyman makes at least one for the .45 ACP. LINKY!

TXGunNut · August 12, 2011, 08:08 PM

A round nose hollow point sounds like fun, not sure the typical SWC has room for a meaningful cavity.

snuffy · August 12, 2011, 09:46 PM

Well I'm not yote hunter, but I have the same mold he has, mine's a four cavity.

That's whats known as a "cramer type " mold. Automatic pins that stay in the mold so you don't have to fiddle with a separate HP pin. Then try to keep that pin hot! If you look closely, there's 2 round HP pins and 2 penta point pins in the mold. I can cast all round ones, all pentas, or turn the pins around to cast solids. The 2 HP bullets are 200 grainers, the solids would be about 215 grains. These were cast from range lead that's about 12-14 BHN.

Do they expand??¿ They shore do!

That's the bullet tube media, about the consistency of modeling clay, but it's a soft wax. The two expanded boolits there, the left one is a round HP, the right is the penta point. These that I tested expansion on were cast from nearly pure lead with 2% tin, very soft. The range lead boolits in the pics will expand, but not as big or as completely.

IllinoisCoyoteHunter · August 13, 2011, 10:00 AM

Snuffy,

Ya beat me to it!

To get your HP's to expand properly and not shatter, it is a balance of lead hardness, velocity, and the size of your hollowpoint. ALL of these must be taken into account.

As Snuffy has shown, cast HP's can be extremely effective.

Most people try to drive them too hard with an alloy that is too hard which essentially makes them frangible and they retain very little of their original weight. (How do I know this....??

)

I don't know if Snuffy chrono'd those loads, but they were probably moderate loads. PLUS, he said he used an alloy that was pure lead (or really close).

Remember, softer bullets deform and trend to stay intact better than a harder boolit which can be brittle and fragment upon impact (if driven too fast).

SO, I hope this helps. I am BY NO MEANS an expert in this area of casting (or any other area for that matter). This should get you started.

BTW, make sure you use a decent lube and size your boolits appropriately. With lower to mid velocity loads I prefer to use a softer to medium soft lube. I have actually found BAC Lube to be great for just about every load I shoot (from 32 acp to 454 Casull). Others have had great luck with C-Red. I have used it, and it is a touch harder than BAC. Here is a link. It is cheap and it WORKS!!!

http://www.lsstuff.com/lube/

Good luck!

snuffy · August 13, 2011, 02:56 PM

ICH, I use the carnuba red now for all my boolits. It IS harder, needs a heater to be used in my Lyman 450. Because it is harder, I can be unconcerned about how I store the lubed/sized boolits. No problems with them sticking to each other and everything else the come in contact with. And it does not lead, even with the 2% tin/lead soft boolits.

Those loads were moderate, 5.5 W-231 does about 875 fps from my SA-1911 45. I could certainly open the throttle a bit with a slower burn rate powder like power pistol, probably get over 900 with those.

For anybody wondering where to get a mold like the one in the pic, Those come from Miha Prevec over in Slovenija, it's a group buy that takes most of a year to be organized, filled, then produced. Most of what I posted here is also on this thread I started back when I got the mold;

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=452382

Ideal Tool · August 13, 2011, 03:47 PM

Hello, Maxim. I have the Lyman 457122..The so-called 'Gould" hollow pt. weighs around 290gr. No real problem with hollow pt. pin..usually need to run pot a bit hotter..and if interuptions..simply dip pin into alloy for a few seconds to bring back up to temp. Never had an issue with top-punches..I assume you are concerned with collapsing hollow? No neeed to worry about that. I have been using flat-faced punches anyway to aleviate any punch/die runout. Best of luck!

Rifleman1776 · August 13, 2011, 04:50 PM

I used to cast hollow point bullets for my Ruger Old Army cap and baller. for Just for ease of casting. The center rod that makes the cavity holds the bullet after the mould is opened and they fall out readily. Shot fine. I used pure soft lead.

zxcvbob · August 13, 2011, 05:19 PM

I don't see how that mold works. Seems like the lube groove would keep the bullet from falling out of the mold (because the pin holds it centered) Does the pin slide out an 1/8" to provide clearance?

IllinoisCoyoteHunter · August 13, 2011, 06:36 PM

Yes, the HP pins slide out to allow the boolit to fall off the pins.

Cut the sprue, turn mold upside down, open mold, and push pins. The bullets fall off. It is a very nice design that allows for fast casting and keeps the pins hot.

Maxem0815 · August 14, 2011, 06:33 AM

Thanks for the input. As for speed I will be driving the bullets at about 750 to 850 fps using black powder or triple 7, they will be pure led possibly 1% calcium. I intend to do some hunting with them using an antique revolving carbine. I now need to order the mold and cast bullets.
Thanks Again
Mace

zxcvbob · August 14, 2011, 08:25 AM

Calcium lead? Are you sure that's a good idea?

TXGunNut · August 14, 2011, 10:23 AM

Good catch, zxcvbob. As you pointed out awhile back in a post about using old automotive batteries:

They've changed the formula quite a bit in the last few years. Used to be, I think the plates were made with pure lead. Then they added antimony (which is still OK.) Now they harden the lead with calcium. I don't know if calcium lead is usable or not, but if it gets mixed with antimony lead, the calcium and antimony will react to form an intermetallic compound that separates out in the dross, and reacts with water to form stibine gas -- it's related to cyanide but more deadly.

Also there's really not much lead in a battery. It's mostly lead oxide paste and sulphate. That *can* be smelted back into lead, but it takes lots of high heat and it releases sulphurous fumes.

Just cut the top posts off and keep them, and recycle the rest of the battery.-zxcvbob

August 12, 2011, 05:45 AM	#1
Maxem0815 Junior member Join Date: May 23, 2011 Posts: 216	Casting Hollow Point .45 Bullets Has anyone here cast .45 hollow points? I have a universal hollow point kit for my case trimmer but they do not come out centered or with a large enough cavity to expand in media. I have been casting .577 hollow base Minie's and assume that the process would be identical however due to lack of molds and knowledge of which top punch to purchase has confused me to a point that I haven't started yet. The top punch seems to be the crucial part here. Any help would be appreciated Mace

August 12, 2011, 06:11 AM	#2
Shane Tuttle Staff Join Date: November 28, 2005 Location: Montana Posts: 9,443	IllinoisCoyoteHunter just might be the man with the plan. Give him a day or two to chime in or PM/email him. He's been casting for a while and I think he's done .45ACP hollowpoints, IIRC. In fact, if memory serves, I have a sample batch from him of his hollowpoints... __________________ If it were up to me, the word "got" would be deleted from the English language. Posting and YOU: http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/posting

August 12, 2011, 06:23 AM	#3
PawPaw Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2010 Location: Central Louisiana Posts: 3,137	You can either modify an existing mold to make hollow points, or you could just buy a hollow point mold. Lyman makes at least one for the .45 ACP. LINKY! __________________ Dennis Dezendorf http://pawpawshouse.blogspot.com

August 12, 2011, 08:08 PM	#4
TXGunNut Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2010 Location: If you have to ask... Posts: 2,860	A round nose hollow point sounds like fun, not sure the typical SWC has room for a meaningful cavity. __________________ Life Member NRA, TSRA Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call Lonesome Dove My favorite recipes start out with a handful of used wheelweights.

August 12, 2011, 09:46 PM	#5
snuffy Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2001 Location: Oshkosh wi. Posts: 3,055	Well I'm not yote hunter, but I have the same mold he has, mine's a four cavity. That's whats known as a "cramer type " mold. Automatic pins that stay in the mold so you don't have to fiddle with a separate HP pin. Then try to keep that pin hot! If you look closely, there's 2 round HP pins and 2 penta point pins in the mold. I can cast all round ones, all pentas, or turn the pins around to cast solids. The 2 HP bullets are 200 grainers, the solids would be about 215 grains. These were cast from range lead that's about 12-14 BHN. Do they expand??¿ They shore do! That's the bullet tube media, about the consistency of modeling clay, but it's a soft wax. The two expanded boolits there, the left one is a round HP, the right is the penta point. These that I tested expansion on were cast from nearly pure lead with 2% tin, very soft. The range lead boolits in the pics will expand, but not as big or as completely. __________________ The more people I meet, the more I love my dog They're going to get their butts kicked over there this election. How come people can't spell and use words correctly?

August 13, 2011, 10:00 AM	#6
IllinoisCoyoteHunter Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2008 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 1,527	Snuffy, Ya beat me to it! To get your HP's to expand properly and not shatter, it is a balance of lead hardness, velocity, and the size of your hollowpoint. ALL of these must be taken into account. As Snuffy has shown, cast HP's can be extremely effective. Most people try to drive them too hard with an alloy that is too hard which essentially makes them frangible and they retain very little of their original weight. (How do I know this....?? ) I don't know if Snuffy chrono'd those loads, but they were probably moderate loads. PLUS, he said he used an alloy that was pure lead (or really close). Remember, softer bullets deform and trend to stay intact better than a harder boolit which can be brittle and fragment upon impact (if driven too fast). SO, I hope this helps. I am BY NO MEANS an expert in this area of casting (or any other area for that matter). This should get you started. BTW, make sure you use a decent lube and size your boolits appropriately. With lower to mid velocity loads I prefer to use a softer to medium soft lube. I have actually found BAC Lube to be great for just about every load I shoot (from 32 acp to 454 Casull). Others have had great luck with C-Red. I have used it, and it is a touch harder than BAC. Here is a link. It is cheap and it WORKS!!! http://www.lsstuff.com/lube/ Good luck! __________________ ~~IllinoisCoyoteHunter~~ ~NRA LIFE MEMBER~ ~NRA CERTIFIED INSTRUCTOR~

August 13, 2011, 02:56 PM	#7
snuffy Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2001 Location: Oshkosh wi. Posts: 3,055	ICH, I use the carnuba red now for all my boolits. It IS harder, needs a heater to be used in my Lyman 450. Because it is harder, I can be unconcerned about how I store the lubed/sized boolits. No problems with them sticking to each other and everything else the come in contact with. And it does not lead, even with the 2% tin/lead soft boolits. Those loads were moderate, 5.5 W-231 does about 875 fps from my SA-1911 45. I could certainly open the throttle a bit with a slower burn rate powder like power pistol, probably get over 900 with those. For anybody wondering where to get a mold like the one in the pic, Those come from Miha Prevec over in Slovenija, it's a group buy that takes most of a year to be organized, filled, then produced. Most of what I posted here is also on this thread I started back when I got the mold; http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=452382 __________________ The more people I meet, the more I love my dog They're going to get their butts kicked over there this election. How come people can't spell and use words correctly?

August 13, 2011, 03:47 PM	#8
Ideal Tool Junior member Join Date: October 6, 2010 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,080	Hello, Maxim. I have the Lyman 457122..The so-called 'Gould" hollow pt. weighs around 290gr. No real problem with hollow pt. pin..usually need to run pot a bit hotter..and if interuptions..simply dip pin into alloy for a few seconds to bring back up to temp. Never had an issue with top-punches..I assume you are concerned with collapsing hollow? No neeed to worry about that. I have been using flat-faced punches anyway to aleviate any punch/die runout. Best of luck!

August 13, 2011, 04:50 PM	#9
Rifleman1776 Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 3,309	I used to cast hollow point bullets for my Ruger Old Army cap and baller. for Just for ease of casting. The center rod that makes the cavity holds the bullet after the mould is opened and they fall out readily. Shot fine. I used pure soft lead.

August 13, 2011, 05:19 PM	#10
zxcvbob Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2007 Location: S.E. Minnesota Posts: 4,720	I don't see how that mold works. Seems like the lube groove would keep the bullet from falling out of the mold (because the pin holds it centered) Does the pin slide out an 1/8" to provide clearance? __________________ "Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth

August 13, 2011, 06:36 PM	#11
IllinoisCoyoteHunter Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2008 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 1,527	Yes, the HP pins slide out to allow the boolit to fall off the pins. Cut the sprue, turn mold upside down, open mold, and push pins. The bullets fall off. It is a very nice design that allows for fast casting and keeps the pins hot. __________________ ~~IllinoisCoyoteHunter~~ ~NRA LIFE MEMBER~ ~NRA CERTIFIED INSTRUCTOR~

August 14, 2011, 06:33 AM	#12
Maxem0815 Junior member Join Date: May 23, 2011 Posts: 216	Thanks for the input. As for speed I will be driving the bullets at about 750 to 850 fps using black powder or triple 7, they will be pure led possibly 1% calcium. I intend to do some hunting with them using an antique revolving carbine. I now need to order the mold and cast bullets. Thanks Again Mace

August 14, 2011, 08:25 AM	#13
zxcvbob Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2007 Location: S.E. Minnesota Posts: 4,720	Calcium lead? Are you sure that's a good idea? __________________ "Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth

August 14, 2011, 10:23 AM	#14
TXGunNut Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2010 Location: If you have to ask... Posts: 2,860	Good catch, zxcvbob. As you pointed out awhile back in a post about using old automotive batteries: They've changed the formula quite a bit in the last few years. Used to be, I think the plates were made with pure lead. Then they added antimony (which is still OK.) Now they harden the lead with calcium. I don't know if calcium lead is usable or not, but if it gets mixed with antimony lead, the calcium and antimony will react to form an intermetallic compound that separates out in the dross, and reacts with water to form stibine gas -- it's related to cyanide but more deadly. Also there's really not much lead in a battery. It's mostly lead oxide paste and sulphate. That can be smelted back into lead, but it takes lots of high heat and it releases sulphurous fumes. Just cut the top posts off and keep them, and recycle the rest of the battery.-zxcvbob __________________ Life Member NRA, TSRA Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call Lonesome Dove My favorite recipes start out with a handful of used wheelweights.