Racoons and Blanks

muggsjunior · May 14, 2013, 05:12 AM

I have a racoon on my bird feeders at night. I don't want to kill him, so my first thought was primers in empty 45 Colt cases (a little negative reinforcement). However, the primers are backing out and jamming the cylinder. So, my question is: How do you make blanks?

Gster · May 14, 2013, 05:32 AM

I knew I seen these some place, here you go.
http://www.hornady.com/store/Blank-Cartridge-Die/

muggsjunior · May 14, 2013, 06:58 AM

Thanks for the tip on the dies. But how do I determine the proper load? I assume it would be reduced from a standard load with a bullet, but how much? I also assume I need to use some form of wadding under the crimp to keep the powder from escaping. Any ideas on what? I also had a thought: a reduced load, uncrimped, with paraffin wax sealing the end of the case. Anybody tried using wax in a revolver?

TimSr · May 14, 2013, 07:03 AM

Speer used to carry plastic bullets you pushed into an empty primed case for the sole purpose of non-lethal routing of pests. I'm not sure if they still do, but sounds like a better solution, but then, Im also wondering if the primer pockets are worn out on your cases if they are backing out when fired empty.

dahermit · May 14, 2013, 07:08 AM

Quote:

I have a racoon on my bird feeders at night. I don't want to kill him, so my first thought was primers in empty 45 Colt cases (a little negative reinforcement).

Having had extensive experience with raccoons (former trapper, present farm-land resident who kills between 18-20 raccoons each spring to keep them from eating my goose eggs), I wish to opine that the only "blank cartridge" that is going to keep raccoons out of your bird feeders is one with a 255 grain "stopper" in the case, over about 9-10 grains of Unique. If you pop blanks at them without hurting them, they will be back later in the night, and every night that they can get an easy meal. Frightening them away will not work. I shoot, poison, and trap them and have not seen a dent in their population. I have to do that every year, in the Spring, just before my geese begin to lay. If you are a softy and let them live, you will pay the price with evern more of them next year.

hodaka · May 14, 2013, 07:35 AM

I would kill them too but I would imagine that a wax plug over a primer would do the job of improvising a non-lethal load. If the primer didn't push it out I would add a grain or two of Unique.

muggsjunior · May 14, 2013, 07:57 AM

I agree the best option is to shoot him. I kill so many squirrels my dogs no longer take notice of the bodies. In the case of the raccoon however, it is my mother who has the problem with killing it. I'm trying to oblige. Though, I do enjoy having the raccoons chittering away by the creek at night. It's just one youngun' who's taken to sunflower seeds. Alas, I may have to "cork" a round, as I know they can be persistent.

I heard they stopped making the plastic bullets. I haven't seen any for sale recently, but I may look around.

The primer pockets should not be loose. I tried using just the primer in some once fired .357's with the same result, and my 45's have only been fired three times. I think that without a propellant charge the case is not being forced back onto the face of the revolver and is, therefore, not pushing the primer back into the case. The primer, of course, is backing out because of the opposing force of its detonation.

Thanks for the info so far.

Brian Pfleuger · May 14, 2013, 08:13 AM

Drill the flash hole larger and the primer won't come out.

But dahermit is right. Kill it or you're wasting your time.

DannyAbear · May 14, 2013, 08:15 AM

Drill the flash hole bigger and push the warmed up case into a block of parafin wax to make a 'bullet', then insert primer. works for me. Not fatal but must hurt enough to deture them

Mark this/these cases so they won't be used for any other loads..........

zplinker · May 14, 2013, 08:27 AM

At one time I had a Thompson Contender with .44 barrel and we drilled open the flash holes, warmed a sheet of parafin a bit, then pushed the cases through to load them. Primed with CCI mag primers, and it would shoot quarter sized groups at 30'. It also put that parafin bullet through 5 layers of cardboard! Sparrows and rats at a local elevator were prime targets. With sparrows liking to roost on sliding door tracks, we'd shoot a bit low, the parafin would shatter, wiping out the sparrow, and lubricating the track as well. Now thats a win-win.

m&p45acp10+1 · May 14, 2013, 09:07 AM

You can try to scare it off with blanks. If thar fails tie a rag to the feeder thar has been soaked with amonia. Resoak it every couple of days.

rg1 · May 14, 2013, 11:25 AM

Can't scare them away. Get a Hav-a-Hart trap, bait with bacon, peanut butter, dog or cat food, or anything else you might have. Catch the coon, they will be mad as heck. Haul them away about 5 miles or so. Careful letting them go. It's the only way to remove a problem raccoon without killing them. One note is to put a piece of plywood under the trap. They will dig and tear up the grass under the trap.

AssaultTortoise · May 14, 2013, 11:40 AM

Drill your flash hole out and put in a magnum primer. Get some large glue sticks from wall-mart and press them into the case then cut flush with a razor blade. I mark the rim of the cases with a file and color the base with a marker to set them apart. They pack a punch and will put a major dent in plywood. May not kill a raccoon outright but would defiantly send it screaming.

Ambidextrous1 · May 14, 2013, 11:51 AM

"Anybody tried using wax in a revolver?"

Bill Jordan did that regularly, when demonstrating his speed in drawing & shooting.

On pages 46 and 47 in "No Second Place Winner", you will find pics of Jordan racing against the clock: His total time from reflex to 'hit' was 320 milliseconds; his best recorded time was 270 milliseconds.

He used 'wax bullets' for these events.

g.willikers · May 14, 2013, 11:52 AM

Why not use an airsoft pistol?
Non lethal to satisfy your Ma', but they hurt enough to maybe send him on his way.

Brian Pfleuger · May 14, 2013, 12:40 PM

Anything you do that "hurts" him will only make him associate you with pain. In other words, he'll run if he sees any hint of you around. Won't do a thing to his 2AM visits, unless you plan to sit around all night waiting.

Do something that is permanently there, like smalls bad, since birds don't smell, or kills him. Don't do things that will cause open wounds and infection. That's just mean. Either kill him or don't, don't wound.

serf 'rett · May 14, 2013, 01:53 PM

Got to agree with the Pizza Killer and others on this one. Either eliminate the problem or set up a second feeder for handling the increasing number who will soon be showing up for supper.

It was a minor annoyance when the skunk was eating the food left out for the shop’s cat each night. But everything changed at 2:00pm of the day she walked into the machine shop with her six kits.

muggsjunior · May 14, 2013, 02:07 PM

If I decide to shoot, It will be to kill. There is no excuse for intentionally wounding any animal. I figured the wax would melt, not become a usable projectile. Thanks again for all your help.

444 · May 14, 2013, 02:39 PM

I have done the thing with wax many times. I used to shoot them in the basement.

Drill out the primer pocket a little, then mark the case with a Sharpie so you don't load it with powder. Then use the case like a cookie cutter. Across the basement, these are quite accurate. It is similar to shooting a wadcutter. I used them in .38 Special and .45 Colt.

SSA · May 14, 2013, 02:45 PM

Make your bird feeders inaccessible to the racoons.
Harsh language and a stick will work to chase them away, but if they can get food, expect them back.

Strafer Gott · May 14, 2013, 02:51 PM

Sounds like you are looking for a racoon enrager. The only blanks that might have a chance at running them off are artillery simulators, and you'll probably
have to bracket the critter to be effective. It won't kill them outright, but maybe they'll be deaf enough to get hit crossing the road.

Clark · May 14, 2013, 07:32 PM

The more you know, the more you will want the raccoon dead.

With a 22LR you must hit the brain or spine.

But the 45 Colt can stop them with a body shot.

Body shots are much easier to do.

paulmcm · May 14, 2013, 09:34 PM

There is an infinite supply of raccoons - train your raccoon to leave the feeders alone. A small fence charger works like a charm. 600 V AC and they learn to avoid the feeders. If you kill them or ship them out - the just get replaced with new untrained coons.

Fishing_Cabin · May 14, 2013, 09:54 PM

Im with Peetza...

Kill it or leave it alone totally. If you have 1 'coon you have tons more usually. Its best to get rid of one once they become a problem (with respect to game laws). I do same at my parents place, just because they don't leave once they get used to coming by. I use a 12ga with extra full choke and number 8 shot from the porch. Distance is less then 20 feet. I found after trying a .22 rifle and pistols its the cleanest kill. We tried everything else here, and its the best solution if you cant legally relocate them with a trap.

One note as to trapping a 'coon. Use a good solid trap that cant be pushed open (spring loaded), and also not only put either plywood, blocks, or rocks under it, but put some stobs on either side and tie the trap to it so the 'coon cant turn it over.

Lost Sheep · May 14, 2013, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimSr

Speer used to carry plastic bullets you pushed into an empty primed case for the sole purpose of non-lethal routing of pests. I'm not sure if they still do, but sounds like a better solution,

They still make them. But I believe their primary purpose was quiet (relatively) target practice. And cheap, all the components except the primer are reusable (until you eventually lose the plastic bullets).

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimSr

but then, Im also wondering if the primer pockets are worn out on your cases if they are backing out when fired empty.

Primers are held in the cases by the fact that the back pressure of full power rounds presses the head of the case up against the breechface. If there is not appreciable pressure pressing the case against the breechface, the pressure of the primer exploding into the flashhole pushes the primer out of the pocket.

The solution is to enlarge the flash hole, reducing the back pressure on the primer.

When loading wax bullets (do a search on the term, there are MANY threads) you will find they do very well for practice and for discouraging varmints. But be aware that even primer-only wax projectiles can do a LOT of damage. They will go through windows, dent steel doors, etc.

Some people have even cast their own bullets from hot glue.

Most convenient is the fact that certain brands of hot glue sticks happen to be .451" (or thereabouts) in diameter. I wonder if the glue stick manufacturer is a shooter?

Enlarge the flash hole (for primer-only noisemakers with no projectile or for use with spitball, wax, plastic or glue bullets). Mark the cases so you never use them for lead bullets, NEVER yield to the temptation to put powder in the case. Note that some people up the power level by drilling out the flash hole entirely and using shotgun primers.

Good luck

edit: paulmcm's advice is probably going to be the most effective, however. Raccoons are smart enough to stay away until you go to bed. Electricity never sleeps, and after a few weeks you can even turn if off - the raccoon won't know. They can't read on on/off switch.

Lost Sheep

May 14, 2013, 05:12 AM	#1
muggsjunior Junior Member Join Date: December 23, 2012 Posts: 13	Racoons and Blanks I have a racoon on my bird feeders at night. I don't want to kill him, so my first thought was primers in empty 45 Colt cases (a little negative reinforcement). However, the primers are backing out and jamming the cylinder. So, my question is: How do you make blanks?

May 14, 2013, 05:32 AM	#2
Gster Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 2012 Location: N.central Pa. Posts: 302	I knew I seen these some place, here you go. http://www.hornady.com/store/Blank-Cartridge-Die/ __________________ Gun control means: Being able to hit what you are shooting at.

May 14, 2013, 08:13 AM	#8
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	Racoons and Blanks Drill the flash hole larger and the primer won't come out. But dahermit is right. Kill it or you're wasting your time.

May 14, 2013, 08:15 AM	#9
DannyAbear Member Join Date: November 20, 2006 Location: Baton Rouge, La. Posts: 72	. Drill the flash hole bigger and push the warmed up case into a block of parafin wax to make a 'bullet', then insert primer. works for me. Not fatal but must hurt enough to deture them Mark this/these cases so they won't be used for any other loads..........

May 14, 2013, 09:07 AM	#11
m&p45acp10+1 Senior Member Join Date: May 3, 2009 Location: Central Texas Posts: 3,930	You can try to scare it off with blanks. If thar fails tie a rag to the feeder thar has been soaked with amonia. Resoak it every couple of days. __________________ No matter how many times you do it and nothing happens it only takes something going wrong one time to kill you.

May 14, 2013, 06:58 AM	#3
muggsjunior Junior Member Join Date: December 23, 2012 Posts: 13	Thanks for the tip on the dies. But how do I determine the proper load? I assume it would be reduced from a standard load with a bullet, but how much? I also assume I need to use some form of wadding under the crimp to keep the powder from escaping. Any ideas on what? I also had a thought: a reduced load, uncrimped, with paraffin wax sealing the end of the case. Anybody tried using wax in a revolver?

May 14, 2013, 07:03 AM	#4
TimSr Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2013 Location: Rittman, Ohio Posts: 2,074	Speer used to carry plastic bullets you pushed into an empty primed case for the sole purpose of non-lethal routing of pests. I'm not sure if they still do, but sounds like a better solution, but then, Im also wondering if the primer pockets are worn out on your cases if they are backing out when fired empty.

May 14, 2013, 07:35 AM	#6
hodaka Senior Member Join Date: April 23, 2006 Location: South Texas Posts: 2,010	I would kill them too but I would imagine that a wax plug over a primer would do the job of improvising a non-lethal load. If the primer didn't push it out I would add a grain or two of Unique.

May 14, 2013, 07:57 AM	#7
muggsjunior Junior Member Join Date: December 23, 2012 Posts: 13	I agree the best option is to shoot him. I kill so many squirrels my dogs no longer take notice of the bodies. In the case of the raccoon however, it is my mother who has the problem with killing it. I'm trying to oblige. Though, I do enjoy having the raccoons chittering away by the creek at night. It's just one youngun' who's taken to sunflower seeds. Alas, I may have to "cork" a round, as I know they can be persistent. I heard they stopped making the plastic bullets. I haven't seen any for sale recently, but I may look around. The primer pockets should not be loose. I tried using just the primer in some once fired .357's with the same result, and my 45's have only been fired three times. I think that without a propellant charge the case is not being forced back onto the face of the revolver and is, therefore, not pushing the primer back into the case. The primer, of course, is backing out because of the opposing force of its detonation. Thanks for the info so far.

May 14, 2013, 08:27 AM	#10
zplinker Senior Member Join Date: February 21, 2011 Location: way out here Posts: 262	At one time I had a Thompson Contender with .44 barrel and we drilled open the flash holes, warmed a sheet of parafin a bit, then pushed the cases through to load them. Primed with CCI mag primers, and it would shoot quarter sized groups at 30'. It also put that parafin bullet through 5 layers of cardboard! Sparrows and rats at a local elevator were prime targets. With sparrows liking to roost on sliding door tracks, we'd shoot a bit low, the parafin would shatter, wiping out the sparrow, and lubricating the track as well. Now thats a win-win.

May 14, 2013, 11:25 AM	#12
rg1 Senior Member Join Date: November 6, 2001 Posts: 1,125	Can't scare them away. Get a Hav-a-Hart trap, bait with bacon, peanut butter, dog or cat food, or anything else you might have. Catch the coon, they will be mad as heck. Haul them away about 5 miles or so. Careful letting them go. It's the only way to remove a problem raccoon without killing them. One note is to put a piece of plywood under the trap. They will dig and tear up the grass under the trap.

May 14, 2013, 11:40 AM	#13
AssaultTortoise Member Join Date: December 14, 2012 Posts: 39	45colt Glue Stick bullet would work Drill your flash hole out and put in a magnum primer. Get some large glue sticks from wall-mart and press them into the case then cut flush with a razor blade. I mark the rim of the cases with a file and color the base with a marker to set them apart. They pack a punch and will put a major dent in plywood. May not kill a raccoon outright but would defiantly send it screaming.

May 14, 2013, 11:51 AM	#14
Ambidextrous1 Member Join Date: June 17, 2002 Location: El Paso, Texas Posts: 29	"Anybody tried using wax in a revolver?" Bill Jordan did that regularly, when demonstrating his speed in drawing & shooting. On pages 46 and 47 in "No Second Place Winner", you will find pics of Jordan racing against the clock: His total time from reflex to 'hit' was 320 milliseconds; his best recorded time was 270 milliseconds. He used 'wax bullets' for these events. __________________ Rich (in name only) NRA Benefactor Member CRPA Gold Bear Member, Fort Bliss Rod & Gun Club

May 14, 2013, 11:52 AM	#15
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Why not use an airsoft pistol? Non lethal to satisfy your Ma', but they hurt enough to maybe send him on his way. __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

May 14, 2013, 12:40 PM	#16
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	Anything you do that "hurts" him will only make him associate you with pain. In other words, he'll run if he sees any hint of you around. Won't do a thing to his 2AM visits, unless you plan to sit around all night waiting. Do something that is permanently there, like smalls bad, since birds don't smell, or kills him. Don't do things that will cause open wounds and infection. That's just mean. Either kill him or don't, don't wound. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

May 14, 2013, 01:53 PM	#17
serf 'rett Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2009 Location: Stuttgart, AR Posts: 1,569	Got to agree with the Pizza Killer and others on this one. Either eliminate the problem or set up a second feeder for handling the increasing number who will soon be showing up for supper. It was a minor annoyance when the skunk was eating the food left out for the shop’s cat each night. But everything changed at 2:00pm of the day she walked into the machine shop with her six kits. __________________ A lack of planning on your part does not necessarily constitute an emergency on my part.

May 14, 2013, 02:07 PM	#18
muggsjunior Junior Member Join Date: December 23, 2012 Posts: 13	If I decide to shoot, It will be to kill. There is no excuse for intentionally wounding any animal. I figured the wax would melt, not become a usable projectile. Thanks again for all your help.

May 14, 2013, 02:39 PM	#19
444 Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2000 Location: Ohio Posts: 3,968	I have done the thing with wax many times. I used to shoot them in the basement. Drill out the primer pocket a little, then mark the case with a Sharpie so you don't load it with powder. Then use the case like a cookie cutter. Across the basement, these are quite accurate. It is similar to shooting a wadcutter. I used them in .38 Special and .45 Colt. __________________ You know the rest. In the books you have read How the British Regulars fired and fled, How the farmers gave them ball for ball, From behind each fence and farmyard wall, Chasing the redcoats down the lane, Then crossing the fields to emerge again Under the trees at the turn of the road, And only pausing to fire and load.

May 14, 2013, 02:45 PM	#20
SSA Senior Member Join Date: August 1, 2010 Posts: 641	Make your bird feeders inaccessible to the racoons. Harsh language and a stick will work to chase them away, but if they can get food, expect them back.

May 14, 2013, 02:51 PM	#21
Strafer Gott Senior Member Join Date: May 12, 2011 Location: New Mexico Posts: 1,315	Sounds like you are looking for a racoon enrager. The only blanks that might have a chance at running them off are artillery simulators, and you'll probably have to bracket the critter to be effective. It won't kill them outright, but maybe they'll be deaf enough to get hit crossing the road.

May 14, 2013, 07:32 PM	#22
Clark Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 1999 Location: WA, the ever blue state Posts: 4,678	The more you know, the more you will want the raccoon dead. With a 22LR you must hit the brain or spine. But the 45 Colt can stop them with a body shot. Body shots are much easier to do. __________________ The word 'forum" does not mean "not criticizing books." "Ad hominem fallacy" is not the same as point by point criticism of books. If you bought the book, and believe it all, it may FEEL like an ad hominem attack, but you might strive to accept other points of view may exist. Are we a nation of competing ideas, or a nation of forced conformity of thought?

May 14, 2013, 09:34 PM	#23
paulmcm Junior Member Join Date: November 17, 2012 Posts: 1	There is an infinite supply of raccoons - train your raccoon to leave the feeders alone. A small fence charger works like a charm. 600 V AC and they learn to avoid the feeders. If you kill them or ship them out - the just get replaced with new untrained coons.

May 14, 2013, 09:54 PM	#24
Fishing_Cabin Senior Member Join Date: February 10, 2010 Posts: 720	Im with Peetza... Kill it or leave it alone totally. If you have 1 'coon you have tons more usually. Its best to get rid of one once they become a problem (with respect to game laws). I do same at my parents place, just because they don't leave once they get used to coming by. I use a 12ga with extra full choke and number 8 shot from the porch. Distance is less then 20 feet. I found after trying a .22 rifle and pistols its the cleanest kill. We tried everything else here, and its the best solution if you cant legally relocate them with a trap. One note as to trapping a 'coon. Use a good solid trap that cant be pushed open (spring loaded), and also not only put either plywood, blocks, or rocks under it, but put some stobs on either side and tie the trap to it so the 'coon cant turn it over.