bullets casting metals for 98 Mauser

nagib otayek · February 15, 2007, 10:57 PM

I own a 98 Mauser carbine in 7 mm. caliber. Once this was the venezuelan issue rifle and after modernizing, a lot of the rifles got into civilian hands as souvenirs or for hunters like myself. Finding ammo is next to impossible. I have around 40 rounds, but a lot of empties. Being a reloader and a firearms fan since my youth, I managed to make a mould that give satisfactory bullets of 165 grains. Unfortunately I failed at making the lubricating grooves. My question is may anyone have an idea or instruction on the possibility of reducing leading, or the use of some other metal instead of lead to make the bullets? Is soldering bar a possibility? I haven't used the sample bullets I made for the sake of safety and aware of the possible danger they could represent. Please if You got a solution. I would apreciate it.

Majic · February 16, 2007, 02:31 PM

If you can swage the bullet down enough and cut one small groove you could try paper patching the bullet. Moulds are not expensive so why not just buy one? The 7mm is a very common bullet and the vast majority of Mausers were made in 7mm.

nagib otayek · February 16, 2007, 04:12 PM

As I referred, here in my country it is very difficult to find reloading elements and tools of the trade. I have been recycling cartridges made in 1946 !!. that sometimes I get my hand on. Venezuela's Military Idustrial Company (CAVIM) stopped the production of the 7.57 cartridges in 1984. Most of the occasional shooting in my carbine was using recycled surplus. Pulling out the bullets, discarding the propellant, firing the empty cases, substituting the fired primer with Large Pistol primers (can't find rifle primers). Then resize the neck slightly. Priming sometimes requires a little glue. I have some supply of IMR 3031 and 4198. May be I'm taking some of your precious time telling all this, but here due to legal and political inestability, the rules are always changing. In the last 4 years I had to get an ownership and transport license, three times for the same rifle, a Winchester 94 Big Bore. Now all licenses are again suspended. The U.S. is still Paradise of the shooting sports.
I made all the equipment for reloading the 7.57 by hand and a lot of try and error.
Please Majic, complete the favor. Is swaging the bullet made by forcing it in the mould? and how do you patch the bullets?
I reload and shoot many other guns , that I have the proper dies and components collected over decades and for all purposes I have used a homemade lubricant half beeswax and half cow grease with excellent results.
Is it a solution dipping the bullets in the melted compound and passing a steel brush down the barrel every ten or so shots.?

The funny thing about all this story is that in the seventies the venezuelan government sold thousands of these fine rifles to american companies for as little as 15 US $.a piece.

Webleymkv · February 16, 2007, 10:44 PM

You may get more responses in the Art of Rifle or Reloading forums. If you PM a Moderator, they'll probably bump it for you.

yodarkritch · February 24, 2007, 11:29 AM

Rooster Red and Lee Liquid alox bullet lubes are surface lubes that can be applied to a bullet that dry as a waxy coating, may or may not be sticky. if it is, swirl the lubed bullets amongst some Motor-Mica to smooth them out.

Unless you push your loads HOT it should serve you well with conservative or light loads.

If you are in Brazil, the company that BOUGHT Alox might tell you what they offer subtituting for Alox 2138F (an excellent bullet lube nolonger in production).

Yodar

cracked butt · February 25, 2007, 03:38 PM

One way to get away from leading might be to make a mould that casts bullets undersized for rifles grooves and paper patch the bullets. You should be able to use somehting like bearing grease or your beeswax/fat concocoction.

Another suggestion: If you have a bullet that is the same diameter or slightly larger than the groove diameter than the rifles grooves, you could turn lube grooves using a lathe- make a master bullet to use to make a mould using something like plaster of paris or clay from (I've used similar materials to make fishing lures, just make sure to 'fire' the mould before using to remove the water from it- green clay or plaster will give you explosions). These moulds will be delicate and might not be usable for more than a few bullets.

Most Americans who shoot medium bore cast bullets use a gas check fitted the bullets base made of copper to reduce gas cutting of the bullet which causes leading. You might be able to make gas checks from aluminum cans if you can fabricate a set of punches to cut and form the checks.

As for alloys, there really isn't anything better than lead that I can think of- solder is usually 50/50 or 60/40 lead/tin over here. All of my bullet casting uses salvaged wheel weights.

cracked butt · February 25, 2007, 03:51 PM

For safety, lead bullets are fairly forgiving as long as you use light loads. Lead bullets are a lot softer than copper (or steel) jacketed bullets and will squeaze down to fit the bore and gooves of your rifle if they are oversized.

You'll want to 'slug' the bore of your rifle- use a piece of lead bigger than the bore of your rilfe, grease it up real good, and pound it through the bore using a wooden dowel. This will give you some of the critical dimensions of your rifle bore for sizing bullets. You'll want a bullet that is approximately 0.001" larger than the rifles groove depth, with a nose that has bearing surface also 0.001" larger than the distace across the lands. Bigger is better as long as you can chamber a loaded round, if you start getting too big, the neck of the case will fit too tight in the chamber.

Here's a website I'd suggest as a resource- some of the guys there have done just what you are trying to do i only because moulds weren't/aren't available for the rifle that they are shooting. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/

TEDDY · February 25, 2007, 05:42 PM

why fight the problem lee has a 130 gr mold for 7 mm with gas checks I belive it is double cavity for around $18 midsouthshooters.com/brass from graf.com very reasonable.
you should be able to shoot it to 2300 fps mybe more with gas checks and hard cast. are you trying to commit suicide useing solder only.ww will do fine
get a couple of loading manuals and order reloading cat their fun to read
have fun and be careful.I've loaded for 50yrs and never fired a primer I did not intend to

nagib otayek · February 26, 2007, 05:59 PM

I'm not using solder, nor did I ever shoot reloads that are not listed in manuals, like, Lyman's, Hornady's and other reliable sources. These couple of weekends I managed to solve the problem of the bullets, using copper tubing lengths resized to 7mm. These I insert in the mould before casting the lead. I'm getting 175 grains round nosed, half jacketed bullets. I have also used instead of the lead tubings, strips of an aluminum alloy, curved so the ends of each strip meet forming a circle or a belt 7 mm diameter inside the mould; to my surprise in the few reduced charge rounds I have tried (4 or 5) the aluminum seems better than the copper jackets. I don't know why. I haven't had the time to evaluate accuracy.

All the solutions suggested are good. Some are great. But Teddy You left me wondering! Is soldering material harder than the brass used in the X bullets or does it have some properties that make it dangerous?

February 15, 2007, 10:57 PM	#1
nagib otayek Member Join Date: May 11, 2006 Posts: 61	bullets casting metals for 98 Mauser I own a 98 Mauser carbine in 7 mm. caliber. Once this was the venezuelan issue rifle and after modernizing, a lot of the rifles got into civilian hands as souvenirs or for hunters like myself. Finding ammo is next to impossible. I have around 40 rounds, but a lot of empties. Being a reloader and a firearms fan since my youth, I managed to make a mould that give satisfactory bullets of 165 grains. Unfortunately I failed at making the lubricating grooves. My question is may anyone have an idea or instruction on the possibility of reducing leading, or the use of some other metal instead of lead to make the bullets? Is soldering bar a possibility? I haven't used the sample bullets I made for the sake of safety and aware of the possible danger they could represent. Please if You got a solution. I would apreciate it.

February 16, 2007, 04:12 PM	#3
nagib otayek Member Join Date: May 11, 2006 Posts: 61	Thank You Majic As I referred, here in my country it is very difficult to find reloading elements and tools of the trade. I have been recycling cartridges made in 1946 !!. that sometimes I get my hand on. Venezuela's Military Idustrial Company (CAVIM) stopped the production of the 7.57 cartridges in 1984. Most of the occasional shooting in my carbine was using recycled surplus. Pulling out the bullets, discarding the propellant, firing the empty cases, substituting the fired primer with Large Pistol primers (can't find rifle primers). Then resize the neck slightly. Priming sometimes requires a little glue. I have some supply of IMR 3031 and 4198. May be I'm taking some of your precious time telling all this, but here due to legal and political inestability, the rules are always changing. In the last 4 years I had to get an ownership and transport license, three times for the same rifle, a Winchester 94 Big Bore. Now all licenses are again suspended. The U.S. is still Paradise of the shooting sports. I made all the equipment for reloading the 7.57 by hand and a lot of try and error. Please Majic, complete the favor. Is swaging the bullet made by forcing it in the mould? and how do you patch the bullets? I reload and shoot many other guns , that I have the proper dies and components collected over decades and for all purposes I have used a homemade lubricant half beeswax and half cow grease with excellent results. Is it a solution dipping the bullets in the melted compound and passing a steel brush down the barrel every ten or so shots.? The funny thing about all this story is that in the seventies the venezuelan government sold thousands of these fine rifles to american companies for as little as 15 US $.a piece.

February 24, 2007, 11:29 AM	#5
yodarkritch Member Join Date: December 8, 2006 Location: central florida Posts: 51	bullets without lube groove Rooster Red and Lee Liquid alox bullet lubes are surface lubes that can be applied to a bullet that dry as a waxy coating, may or may not be sticky. if it is, swirl the lubed bullets amongst some Motor-Mica to smooth them out. Unless you push your loads HOT it should serve you well with conservative or light loads. If you are in Brazil, the company that BOUGHT Alox might tell you what they offer subtituting for Alox 2138F (an excellent bullet lube nolonger in production). Yodar __________________ Yodar Words MEAN things Homebrewing in Central Florida

February 25, 2007, 05:42 PM	#8
TEDDY Junior member Join Date: December 10, 2006 Location: MANNING SC Posts: 837	7 mm bullets why fight the problem lee has a 130 gr mold for 7 mm with gas checks I belive it is double cavity for around $18 midsouthshooters.com/brass from graf.com very reasonable. you should be able to shoot it to 2300 fps mybe more with gas checks and hard cast. are you trying to commit suicide useing solder only.ww will do fine get a couple of loading manuals and order reloading cat their fun to read have fun and be careful.I've loaded for 50yrs and never fired a primer I did not intend to

February 26, 2007, 05:59 PM	#9
nagib otayek Member Join Date: May 11, 2006 Posts: 61	I'm not using solder Teddy I'm not using solder, nor did I ever shoot reloads that are not listed in manuals, like, Lyman's, Hornady's and other reliable sources. These couple of weekends I managed to solve the problem of the bullets, using copper tubing lengths resized to 7mm. These I insert in the mould before casting the lead. I'm getting 175 grains round nosed, half jacketed bullets. I have also used instead of the lead tubings, strips of an aluminum alloy, curved so the ends of each strip meet forming a circle or a belt 7 mm diameter inside the mould; to my surprise in the few reduced charge rounds I have tried (4 or 5) the aluminum seems better than the copper jackets. I don't know why. I haven't had the time to evaluate accuracy. All the solutions suggested are good. Some are great. But Teddy You left me wondering! Is soldering material harder than the brass used in the X bullets or does it have some properties that make it dangerous?

February 16, 2007, 02:31 PM	#2
Majic Senior Member Join Date: May 24, 2004 Posts: 3,888	If you can swage the bullet down enough and cut one small groove you could try paper patching the bullet. Moulds are not expensive so why not just buy one? The 7mm is a very common bullet and the vast majority of Mausers were made in 7mm.

February 16, 2007, 10:44 PM	#4
Webleymkv Senior Member Join Date: July 20, 2005 Location: Indiana Posts: 10,446	You may get more responses in the Art of Rifle or Reloading forums. If you PM a Moderator, they'll probably bump it for you.

February 25, 2007, 03:38 PM	#6
cracked butt Senior Member Join Date: December 22, 2001 Location: southeastern wisconsin Posts: 537	One way to get away from leading might be to make a mould that casts bullets undersized for rifles grooves and paper patch the bullets. You should be able to use somehting like bearing grease or your beeswax/fat concocoction. Another suggestion: If you have a bullet that is the same diameter or slightly larger than the groove diameter than the rifles grooves, you could turn lube grooves using a lathe- make a master bullet to use to make a mould using something like plaster of paris or clay from (I've used similar materials to make fishing lures, just make sure to 'fire' the mould before using to remove the water from it- green clay or plaster will give you explosions). These moulds will be delicate and might not be usable for more than a few bullets. Most Americans who shoot medium bore cast bullets use a gas check fitted the bullets base made of copper to reduce gas cutting of the bullet which causes leading. You might be able to make gas checks from aluminum cans if you can fabricate a set of punches to cut and form the checks. As for alloys, there really isn't anything better than lead that I can think of- solder is usually 50/50 or 60/40 lead/tin over here. All of my bullet casting uses salvaged wheel weights.

February 25, 2007, 03:51 PM	#7
cracked butt Senior Member Join Date: December 22, 2001 Location: southeastern wisconsin Posts: 537	For safety, lead bullets are fairly forgiving as long as you use light loads. Lead bullets are a lot softer than copper (or steel) jacketed bullets and will squeaze down to fit the bore and gooves of your rifle if they are oversized. You'll want to 'slug' the bore of your rifle- use a piece of lead bigger than the bore of your rilfe, grease it up real good, and pound it through the bore using a wooden dowel. This will give you some of the critical dimensions of your rifle bore for sizing bullets. You'll want a bullet that is approximately 0.001" larger than the rifles groove depth, with a nose that has bearing surface also 0.001" larger than the distace across the lands. Bigger is better as long as you can chamber a loaded round, if you start getting too big, the neck of the case will fit too tight in the chamber. Here's a website I'd suggest as a resource- some of the guys there have done just what you are trying to do i only because moulds weren't/aren't available for the rifle that they are shooting. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/