3½ inch self-defense shotshell loads ?

Hammer1 · August 28, 2010, 09:21 AM

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Any factory produce 3½ inch 12 gauge loads with 00, 000, or even 0000 buckshot suitable for self-defense loads ?

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kx592 · August 28, 2010, 09:28 AM

most people stick to the 2 3/4" shell of 00 for SD/HD for purposes of recoil. 3-1/2 will give you a good blow back taking your focus off the situation when you could unload some 2 3/4 faster and more accurately.

419 · August 28, 2010, 09:29 AM

Yeah, I use 3.5 inch 00 for deer sometimes. I use Winchester, but I think that several other large companies make it.

If they make it in 000 or 0000, they don't carry it in any of my local stores.

oletymer · August 28, 2010, 02:53 PM

I guess you might need them if you ran into a rhino in your house.

Rampant_Colt · August 28, 2010, 02:58 PM

...or you can just get a 10 gauge

What's wrong with 3" magnum 00 and 000 12 gauge buckshot loads? Not powerful enough? LoL

Hammer1 · August 29, 2010, 10:12 PM

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Hearing about some of the violent home invasions and the types of folks doing it, not sure anything is too powerful.

And this is in communities where there had never been a serious crime ever reported not too long ago.

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Rampant_Colt · August 29, 2010, 11:25 PM

Reduced recoil 12 gauge 00 buckshot will end the hostilities of the biggest, baddest dood in da hood. 3" magnums simply aren't necessary.

If you want to up the ante, I suggest a 12-pellet 00 buckshot load, or even reduced recoil slugs.

The city i live in is quoted by the mainstream media as being more dangerous than Afghanistan

Slopemeno · August 29, 2010, 11:32 PM

The down side of 3" and up defensive ammo is the flash, noise, and recoil go up. 2 3/4" is *plenty*- but offers quicker follow up shots. Youre much more likely to miss and need a follow-up shot.

I worked for a PI back in the 80's who was also a courtroom firearms expert. I got to read a case he was working on where a guy tried to disarm a cop who had a 12 gauge 870( saw the pics, read the police and coroners report). He pulled the gun as hard a he could- the gun fired, striking him next to the navel. The bad guy died instantly. 2 3/4" is plenty.

Frankly- the hot setup is the low recoil 2 3/4" 12 gauge 00 buckshot that's available these days.

drail · August 30, 2010, 06:41 AM

2 3/4 is more than plenty. The longer Magnum rounds were designed for goose hunters trying to bring birds down at long range. Just use any 2 3/4 round and practice until you can place the shot where it needs to go.

hardworker · August 30, 2010, 02:18 PM

The thing most folks don't realize about 3 1/2 inch shells is that the amount of powder is the same, there's just more shot. Using the good old f=ma formula, this means that the velocity of a 3 1/2 shell leaving the barrel will be less than a 3 inch shell of the same shot. Now, if you're blasting birds on the wing you're gonna want more pellets out there doing work but for a house there's really no need. Any 2 3/4 or 3 in buckshot will get the job done. No. 4, 0, 00 etc.

Sphawley · August 30, 2010, 06:26 PM

Anything over 3" is really gonna be over kill, especially in close combat like home defense. You would be much more effective with the 2 3/4.

But like all my other posts in HD I always reccomend the Winchester PDX1. 1oz. rifled slug with copper plated 00 buck on top of it.

Theres not much your not going to stop with this

Dave McC · August 30, 2010, 10:28 PM

A standard 2 3/4 12 gauge load of 9 pellets of 00 has a 99% one shot stop history. What advantage do the bigger loads have over that?

None....

I've experimented with ultra light 6 pellet handloads that pattern nicely and on paper have enough moxie to do the job at typical HD ranges. No kick, fast repeat shots. I may load up some more for informal Prac/Tac matches.

The 8 pellet R/R loads seem to have little bad data about lack of stopping. Try those on some Ermy targets (Watermelons) and see if they do enough damage to reassure you.

zippy13 · August 30, 2010, 10:56 PM

Let's not overlook possible reduced mag capacity when using the longer shells, it's a factor to consider. It's just one reason most folks stick with 2 3/4-inch shells.

Sphawley · August 30, 2010, 11:23 PM

Good point zippy, thats something really easy look over and forget...

Nnobby45 · August 31, 2010, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Let's not overlook possible reduced mag capacity when using the longer shells, it's a factor to consider. It's just one reason most folks stick with 2 3/4-inch shells.

Another is faster follow up shots---even better with LE Tac low recoil (which also offer the advantage of tighter patterns).

mathman · August 31, 2010, 07:54 AM

3 1/2" buckshot?

YIKES!! I guess if you absolutely want to do a complete remodel in your house....then go for it.

I think the 3" buckshot loads hurt too much to shoot.

jhog1 · August 31, 2010, 08:12 AM

I use 3 1/2" #2's for pond and cornfield protection, seems to work pretty good

Old Grump · August 31, 2010, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Any factory produce 3½ inch 12 gauge loads with 00, 000, or even 0000 buckshot suitable for self-defense loads ?

Define suitable for self defense load. Is your neighborhood plagued with 350 pound heavily armored meth head axe killers? Just curious because if you are could I suggest an 8 gauge.
http://media.teamxbox.com/dailyposts.../23shotgun.jpg
http://www.undeadreport.com/wp-conte...ne-shotgun.jpg

You will have to make your own shells but you can tailor them to your hearts content or you can buy the Winchester Super X kiln shells, trim the brass shoulder so you can chamber them but you might want to reload those before you shoot them, the full loads will hurt you as much or more than the target.

ADB · August 31, 2010, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Hearing about some of the violent home invasions and the types of folks doing it, not sure anything is too powerful.

Here's the best advice I can offer you: turn off the evening news.

Among the things that you won't learn on the evening news are these: the violent crime rate in the US has dropped by a third in the last 15-20 years, and the US is safer today than it's been in close to 50 years.

They won't tell you that the number of "hot" burglaries in the US is very low, specifically because burglars don't want to get their brains splattered all over the walls. Your house is ten times more at risk when you're not there than when you are.

They won't tell you that the number of people who break into houses while high on drugs is extremely low, or the fact that being loaded to the gills doesn't make someone bulletproof. A guy on crystal meth who's shot with 2 3/4 inch buckshot will drop dead just the same as a guy who's not on crystal meth.

What the evening news WILL do is scare the s--t out of you, because scared people stay tuned to find out the latest. If they're not keeping you in a state of suspended terror worrying about what you don't know and they might be able to tell you, then they're not getting as much money for their commercials. It sounds pretty horrible to say, and it is. But scaring people is big business.

TylerD45ACP · August 31, 2010, 06:32 PM

3 1/2 inch seem to big for me. I like 2 3/4 to 3 inch. I think the 3 1/2 loads are too much and offer marginal performance over the other rounds.

Nnobby45 · August 31, 2010, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Hearing about some of the violent home invasions and the types of folks doing it, not sure anything is too powerful.

The increasing frequency of violent home invasion robberies isn't a call to increase the power of already efficient weaponry.

Since such robberies usually involve multiple assailants, I think the already sufficiently powerfull 2 3/4" 00 buck is a much better choice than a weapon that's excessively powerful and that makes quick followup shots more difficult.

00 buck, including the low recoil variety, has already proven itself in such situations and it's efficacy isn't an issue----except here on this thread, I guess.

NightSleeper · September 1, 2010, 09:28 AM

My 3 1/2 inch shells are for turkey or goose hunting only. 2 3/4 is all you need against the two-legged baddies.

Jonathan1977 · September 1, 2010, 09:54 PM

3 1/2 inch shells?? What are you expecting to defend your house from? A charging moose with antlers? :-P

Pezo · September 3, 2010, 09:30 AM

Tactics and training are what you need. Heavier than 2.75" shells is not necessary and may inhibit your ability to make effective hits. I'd keep 2.75" 00 buck and some 2.75" slugs on hand. Get a dog for alert.

dsa1115 · September 3, 2010, 10:03 AM

I'm of the opinion that 2 3/4 shells are plenty for home defense, and I think preferable because of the lower recoil. Inside of 25 feet, your not going to get much spread anyway, and even bird shot is going to be a lot of lead tightly spaced. Buckshot indoors can over penetrate, recoils more, and at close ranges with a 12 gauge, smaller shot can be just as effective. I have a preference for #4's.

August 28, 2010, 09:21 AM	#1
Hammer1 Senior Member Join Date: July 17, 2004 Posts: 214	3½ inch self-defense shotshell loads ? . Any factory produce 3½ inch 12 gauge loads with 00, 000, or even 0000 buckshot suitable for self-defense loads ? .

August 28, 2010, 02:58 PM	#5
Rampant_Colt Senior Member Join Date: March 17, 2006 Location: Parts Unknown Posts: 1,478	reduced recoil buckshot for the win ...or you can just get a 10 gauge What's wrong with 3" magnum 00 and 000 12 gauge buckshot loads? Not powerful enough? LoL __________________ member of an elite paramilitary organization: Eagle Scouts

August 29, 2010, 11:25 PM	#7
Rampant_Colt Senior Member Join Date: March 17, 2006 Location: Parts Unknown Posts: 1,478	Reduced recoil 12 gauge 00 buckshot will end the hostilities of the biggest, baddest dood in da hood. 3" magnums simply aren't necessary. If you want to up the ante, I suggest a 12-pellet 00 buckshot load, or even reduced recoil slugs. The city i live in is quoted by the mainstream media as being more dangerous than Afghanistan __________________ member of an elite paramilitary organization: Eagle Scouts

August 30, 2010, 10:56 PM	#13
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	Reduced mag capacity Let's not overlook possible reduced mag capacity when using the longer shells, it's a factor to consider. It's just one reason most folks stick with 2 3/4-inch shells.

August 31, 2010, 07:54 AM	#16
mathman Senior Member Join Date: January 15, 2005 Location: SoCal Posts: 1,531	3 1/2" buckshot? YIKES!! I guess if you absolutely want to do a complete remodel in your house....then go for it. I think the 3" buckshot loads hurt too much to shoot. __________________ Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear to be bright until you hear them speak.

August 28, 2010, 09:28 AM	#2
kx592 Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2009 Posts: 645	most people stick to the 2 3/4" shell of 00 for SD/HD for purposes of recoil. 3-1/2 will give you a good blow back taking your focus off the situation when you could unload some 2 3/4 faster and more accurately.

August 28, 2010, 09:29 AM	#3
419 Member Join Date: June 21, 2010 Posts: 46	Yeah, I use 3.5 inch 00 for deer sometimes. I use Winchester, but I think that several other large companies make it. If they make it in 000 or 0000, they don't carry it in any of my local stores.

August 28, 2010, 02:53 PM	#4
oletymer Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2005 Posts: 338	I guess you might need them if you ran into a rhino in your house.

August 29, 2010, 10:12 PM	#6
Hammer1 Senior Member Join Date: July 17, 2004 Posts: 214	. Hearing about some of the violent home invasions and the types of folks doing it, not sure anything is too powerful. And this is in communities where there had never been a serious crime ever reported not too long ago. .

August 29, 2010, 11:32 PM	#8
Slopemeno Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2007 Posts: 2,663	The down side of 3" and up defensive ammo is the flash, noise, and recoil go up. 2 3/4" is plenty- but offers quicker follow up shots. Youre much more likely to miss and need a follow-up shot. I worked for a PI back in the 80's who was also a courtroom firearms expert. I got to read a case he was working on where a guy tried to disarm a cop who had a 12 gauge 870( saw the pics, read the police and coroners report). He pulled the gun as hard a he could- the gun fired, striking him next to the navel. The bad guy died instantly. 2 3/4" is plenty. Frankly- the hot setup is the low recoil 2 3/4" 12 gauge 00 buckshot that's available these days.

August 30, 2010, 06:41 AM	#9
drail Junior member Join Date: February 2, 2008 Posts: 3,150	2 3/4 is more than plenty. The longer Magnum rounds were designed for goose hunters trying to bring birds down at long range. Just use any 2 3/4 round and practice until you can place the shot where it needs to go.

August 30, 2010, 02:18 PM	#10
hardworker Senior Member Join Date: August 4, 2010 Posts: 820	The thing most folks don't realize about 3 1/2 inch shells is that the amount of powder is the same, there's just more shot. Using the good old f=ma formula, this means that the velocity of a 3 1/2 shell leaving the barrel will be less than a 3 inch shell of the same shot. Now, if you're blasting birds on the wing you're gonna want more pellets out there doing work but for a house there's really no need. Any 2 3/4 or 3 in buckshot will get the job done. No. 4, 0, 00 etc.

August 30, 2010, 06:26 PM	#11
Sphawley Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2010 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 272	Anything over 3" is really gonna be over kill, especially in close combat like home defense. You would be much more effective with the 2 3/4. But like all my other posts in HD I always reccomend the Winchester PDX1. 1oz. rifled slug with copper plated 00 buck on top of it. Theres not much your not going to stop with this

August 30, 2010, 10:28 PM	#12
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	A standard 2 3/4 12 gauge load of 9 pellets of 00 has a 99% one shot stop history. What advantage do the bigger loads have over that? None.... I've experimented with ultra light 6 pellet handloads that pattern nicely and on paper have enough moxie to do the job at typical HD ranges. No kick, fast repeat shots. I may load up some more for informal Prac/Tac matches. The 8 pellet R/R loads seem to have little bad data about lack of stopping. Try those on some Ermy targets (Watermelons) and see if they do enough damage to reassure you.

August 30, 2010, 11:23 PM	#14
Sphawley Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2010 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 272	Good point zippy, thats something really easy look over and forget...

August 31, 2010, 08:12 AM	#17
jhog1 Senior Member Join Date: April 11, 2010 Location: Rensselaer Co NY Posts: 221	I use 3 1/2" #2's for pond and cornfield protection, seems to work pretty good

August 31, 2010, 06:32 PM	#20
TylerD45ACP Senior Member Join Date: July 16, 2010 Posts: 1,654	3 1/2 inch seem to big for me. I like 2 3/4 to 3 inch. I think the 3 1/2 loads are too much and offer marginal performance over the other rounds. Last edited by TylerD45ACP; September 3, 2010 at 01:39 PM.

September 1, 2010, 09:28 AM	#22
NightSleeper Senior Member Join Date: April 6, 2008 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 449	My 3 1/2 inch shells are for turkey or goose hunting only. 2 3/4 is all you need against the two-legged baddies. __________________ *I have rounds yet to fire before I sleep ...*

September 1, 2010, 09:54 PM	#23
Jonathan1977 Member Join Date: September 1, 2010 Location: Canada Posts: 19	3 1/2 inch shells?? What are you expecting to defend your house from? A charging moose with antlers? :-P

September 3, 2010, 09:30 AM	#24
Pezo Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2005 Location: Vernors and orange barrels. Posts: 661	Tactics and training are what you need. Heavier than 2.75" shells is not necessary and may inhibit your ability to make effective hits. I'd keep 2.75" 00 buck and some 2.75" slugs on hand. Get a dog for alert.

September 3, 2010, 10:03 AM	#25
dsa1115 Senior Member Join Date: March 10, 2010 Location: Illinois Posts: 444	I'm of the opinion that 2 3/4 shells are plenty for home defense, and I think preferable because of the lower recoil. Inside of 25 feet, your not going to get much spread anyway, and even bird shot is going to be a lot of lead tightly spaced. Buckshot indoors can over penetrate, recoils more, and at close ranges with a 12 gauge, smaller shot can be just as effective. I have a preference for #4's.