M1: Does touching operating rod cause malfunctions?

ffs1942 · April 17, 2013, 09:42 PM

Been having some issues with my "new" CMP M1. I have occasional failures for the bolt to retract far enough to chamber another .

Seems ammo related, but when I hold the rifle. my fingers often touch the operating rod.

Could dragging on the operator rod with fingers cause malfunctioms?

NESHOOTER · April 18, 2013, 12:56 AM

Is the rod bent? are you shooting modern ammo? did you buy a gas plug that is ajustable?

'88Scrat · April 18, 2013, 08:17 AM

I'm no expert but it seems unlikely that the friction from your fingers would cause enough loss of momentum to keep the rifle from cycling right.

Ridge_Runner_5 · April 18, 2013, 11:10 AM

I was experiencing similar problems. I disassembled the gun and regreased all the parts in the operating rod, the slide, the bolt, the clip spring and lever, and also put some grease where the op rod comes close to the barrel just in front of the receiver.

It seems to have cleared up the problem for me.

RickB · April 18, 2013, 11:44 AM

Yeah, you are very much supposed to grease the bottom of the barrel, where the guide rod does/might rub on it. I had some short-stroking early on, but considered it "break-in" at the time. No issues over the last few hundred rounds.
A lot of stuff I read about the Garand revolves around bullet weights, powder burn rates, etc., but the book I bought almost goes overboard stressing the importance of GREASING the gun. I guess that's why those little pots of white grease fit perfectly in the butt trap?

4EVERM-14 · April 18, 2013, 02:24 PM

It is possible to slow the op-rod with the fingers of the non trigger hand. It can be done but takes a substantial effort. You would have to squeeze really hard to cause a stoppage. It is also possible that the op rod spring is weak or even broken allowing the rod to travel to quickly causing an override. Ammunition, lubrication, worn parts,gas system anomalies, even operator error are suspect when stoppages occur.

Dfariswheel · April 18, 2013, 03:19 PM

The CMP is well known for taking care of any problems.
You can also ask for help on the CMP forums.

There's a number of reasons for failures to operate, including the need for grease as a lubricant, and replacing the recoil spring.
Many M1 problems are related to worn out recoil springs because the recoil spring is not just a recoil spring. The recoil spring powers the entire rifle including the magazine. Often just replacing the spring cures odd problems.

Another common problem is a gas leak caused by not tightening a loose gas cylinder lock nut tightly.

Best advice is to talk to the CMP and explain the problem. They can help you work through it.

Orlando · April 18, 2013, 05:01 PM

Yes it is possible:
#1 what grade Garand is it?
#2 did you do a complete tear down clean and then properly grease the rifle?
#3what ammo are you useing?
#4 is gas screw tight?
Answer these questions and I can walk you through it
I would suspect as most you never did a complete tear down, clean and grease. Alot of people dont and they are usually the ones that have issues

James K · April 18, 2013, 07:48 PM

AFAIK, CMP checks out their M1's before sale, but there can be other causes of gas leaks besides not tightening the gas cylinder lock screw. Among them are worn barrel bearings, a worn gas cylinder, and a worn or damaged gas piston head.

Jim

stubbicatt · April 18, 2013, 08:02 PM

Quote:

worn barrel bearings says Jim.

Umm... I've stripped many Garand rifles, and I have never, ever, seen bearings on the barrel anywhere. Did I miss something?

Orlando · April 19, 2013, 04:35 AM

Ha, thats a new one on me

You there can be alot more issues that cause short stroking than what I listed
I do find it best to check the simple things first and then go on

Bart B. · April 19, 2013, 07:00 PM

To answer your question, yes.

Once the Garand's op rod has pushed the bolt forward chambering a new rod, never ever touch it unless the clip's empty.

Doing so will do two things:

One is the op rod will change its fit position causing the barrel groups vibrations to change and the muzzle won't shoot the bullet where you expect it to.

The other is the op rod won't go back with the normal force and if it's reduced enough, that'll sometimes cause an over ride on the top round in the clip and it won't load. This is a common problem with folks holding the fore end with their left hand finger tips touching the op rod. Hold it some other way without touching the op rod.

April 18, 2013, 02:24 PM	#6
4EVERM-14 Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 2006 Location: Pennsy Posts: 720	It is possible to slow the op-rod with the fingers of the non trigger hand. It can be done but takes a substantial effort. You would have to squeeze really hard to cause a stoppage. It is also possible that the op rod spring is weak or even broken allowing the rod to travel to quickly causing an override. Ammunition, lubrication, worn parts,gas system anomalies, even operator error are suspect when stoppages occur. __________________ David NRA Benefactor Member Distinguished Rifleman #731 Presidents 100

April 17, 2013, 09:42 PM	#1
ffs1942 Member Join Date: December 14, 2010 Posts: 79	M1: Does touching operating rod cause malfunctions? Been having some issues with my "new" CMP M1. I have occasional failures for the bolt to retract far enough to chamber another . Seems ammo related, but when I hold the rifle. my fingers often touch the operating rod. Could dragging on the operator rod with fingers cause malfunctioms?

April 18, 2013, 12:56 AM	#2
NESHOOTER Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 2009 Posts: 517	Is the rod bent? are you shooting modern ammo? did you buy a gas plug that is ajustable?

April 18, 2013, 08:17 AM	#3
'88Scrat Senior Member Join Date: July 11, 2011 Location: Kansas Posts: 549	I'm no expert but it seems unlikely that the friction from your fingers would cause enough loss of momentum to keep the rifle from cycling right. __________________ BOOM

April 18, 2013, 11:10 AM	#4
Ridge_Runner_5 Senior Member Join Date: February 8, 2008 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 1,925	I was experiencing similar problems. I disassembled the gun and regreased all the parts in the operating rod, the slide, the bolt, the clip spring and lever, and also put some grease where the op rod comes close to the barrel just in front of the receiver. It seems to have cleared up the problem for me.

April 18, 2013, 11:44 AM	#5
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,518	Yeah, you are very much supposed to grease the bottom of the barrel, where the guide rod does/might rub on it. I had some short-stroking early on, but considered it "break-in" at the time. No issues over the last few hundred rounds. A lot of stuff I read about the Garand revolves around bullet weights, powder burn rates, etc., but the book I bought almost goes overboard stressing the importance of GREASING the gun. I guess that's why those little pots of white grease fit perfectly in the butt trap?

April 18, 2013, 03:19 PM	#7
Dfariswheel Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2001 Posts: 7,478	The CMP is well known for taking care of any problems. You can also ask for help on the CMP forums. There's a number of reasons for failures to operate, including the need for grease as a lubricant, and replacing the recoil spring. Many M1 problems are related to worn out recoil springs because the recoil spring is not just a recoil spring. The recoil spring powers the entire rifle including the magazine. Often just replacing the spring cures odd problems. Another common problem is a gas leak caused by not tightening a loose gas cylinder lock nut tightly. Best advice is to talk to the CMP and explain the problem. They can help you work through it.

April 18, 2013, 05:01 PM	#8
Orlando Senior Member Join Date: May 2, 2009 Posts: 352	Yes it is possible: #1 what grade Garand is it? #2 did you do a complete tear down clean and then properly grease the rifle? #3what ammo are you useing? #4 is gas screw tight? Answer these questions and I can walk you through it I would suspect as most you never did a complete tear down, clean and grease. Alot of people dont and they are usually the ones that have issues

April 18, 2013, 07:48 PM	#9
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	AFAIK, CMP checks out their M1's before sale, but there can be other causes of gas leaks besides not tightening the gas cylinder lock screw. Among them are worn barrel bearings, a worn gas cylinder, and a worn or damaged gas piston head. Jim

April 19, 2013, 04:35 AM	#11
Orlando Senior Member Join Date: May 2, 2009 Posts: 352	Ha, thats a new one on me You there can be alot more issues that cause short stroking than what I listed I do find it best to check the simple things first and then go on

April 19, 2013, 07:00 PM	#12
Bart B. Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Posts: 8,927	To answer your question, yes. Once the Garand's op rod has pushed the bolt forward chambering a new rod, never ever touch it unless the clip's empty. Doing so will do two things: One is the op rod will change its fit position causing the barrel groups vibrations to change and the muzzle won't shoot the bullet where you expect it to. The other is the op rod won't go back with the normal force and if it's reduced enough, that'll sometimes cause an over ride on the top round in the clip and it won't load. This is a common problem with folks holding the fore end with their left hand finger tips touching the op rod. Hold it some other way without touching the op rod.