What OAL for .45 ACP?

yggorf · November 22, 2009, 06:52 PM

I am using Hornady XTP Bullets 45 Caliber (451 Diameter) 185 Grain Jacketed Hollow Point bullets currently loaded to 1.15 OAL. However, I am seeing some failure to feed problems with these. In talking to one gunsmith, he advised I load these to 1.25 OAL -- is that a wise move?

**Unclenick** · November 22, 2009, 07:15 PM

You can try it. If the bullet is still grasped by the brass well-enough, it should be OK. Seating out lowers pressure, where seating deeper raises it, so you are going in the safer direction. Did you inquire about getting your gun modified to feed wide blunt shapes better? I don't know what your gun is, so I don't know if that's a practical consideration or not? Sometimes the magazine feed lips can be modified for more reliable feed, too.

Kyo · November 22, 2009, 08:01 PM

well, your manual will tell you mix/max of AOL. usually the max is 1.275 anyway. 1.15 feels short to me.
I load my 185 grain LSWC to 1.230-1.240
My dad's flat point FMJ's are also 185 and I load them to 1.22x-1.22x
Feeds fine in both our guns. Shoots fine too

Ozzieman · November 22, 2009, 09:21 PM

Hornady's 7th edition lists the 185 Grain HP-XTP #45100 A C.O.L of 1.23.
Go with the book numbers.

Mark whiz · November 22, 2009, 09:31 PM

I load all my .45ACP XTPs (185,200, & 230gr) at 1.245" for 100% reliable feeding in my Springer GI 1911-A1.

Tuzo · November 22, 2009, 09:42 PM

Sierra lists 1.212" for 185 JHP and Lyman lists 1.175." You are not too far off Lyman's specification. My preference is Sierra's 1.212" COAL.

Good luck.

Blue · November 22, 2009, 11:38 PM

Try 1.20 first and see how they feed. If still having problems go to book OAL of 1.23.

Are you guaging with your barrel to see if they are fitting ok?

If still having feed problems even with Book OAL then you might try the Lee FCD to uniform them. Could be something else in your process causing the problem. The FCD will make sure there are no bulges as cartridge is removed from the die after taper crimp is applied.

Let us know how it goes and what you find.

I haven't had this problem but I use 200 gr gold dots and 230gr fmj almost exclusively.

BTW - where did you get the 1.15 you are using now?

Best advice would be to stick to MFR Book value and check out your process further. Might even want to polish your chamber and ramp with JB bore paste.

darkgael · November 23, 2009, 07:30 AM

Not a lead bullet, I load Remington Match JSWCs to 1.150". Over 4.0 grains of Bullseye, they work just fine.
Pete

Walkalong · November 23, 2009, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Hornady's 7th edition lists the 185 Grain HP-XTP #45100 A C.O.L of 1.23.

The factory ones I had all measured between 1.230 and 1.235. Most were in the middle somwhere. That feeds great in my guns with any weight XTP bullet.

yggorf · November 30, 2009, 05:54 PM

I tried seating the Hornady's (mentioned at the top of the thread) to 1.25. When I chambered these, the round got stuck in the chamber with the slide not completely forward. I had to push the slide against a wooden table to get it to release (hand pressure alone would not budge it). When the case was ejected doing this, the bullet stayed lodged in the chamber, so I had to knock that out also.

I then tried 1.20 and got a similar result, but the slide didn't stick quite as bad and the bullet stayed in the case on forced ejection. So I went to 1.19, and things worked fine.

So, although I now have rounds that function correctly, I am wondering why all the books say 1.25 should be OK? Is there some other problem I am having that prevents a normal length round from working?

tom234 · November 30, 2009, 06:41 PM

I always shoot for 1.250" OAL. Never had a problem.

QBall45 · November 30, 2009, 07:56 PM

2 thoughts come to mind.

1. 1.15 oal sounds like a minimum oal. I would take your gun smiths recommendation and start stretching them out a bit. I would not make the jump directly to 1.25. I would work up till I found an oal that feeds reliably. I use 1.20-1.22 with my 200gr lswc cast in a lee TL mould. Play with it like you would make adjustments in finding the right powder charge.

2. The mag. Does the failure to feed problem happen with just 1 mag or all your mags? Any trouble feeding FMJ's?

My guess is that its the OAL. Too short to feed reliable like your smith said.

Good luck, its frustrating when things won't work the way you want. I think this one should be fairly easy for you to fix.

JASmith · November 30, 2009, 10:22 PM

YGGORF described something very close to my own experience. His main comment: "I tried seating the Hornady's (mentioned at the top of the thread) to 1.25. When I chambered these, the round got stuck in the chamber with the slide not completely forward. I had to push the slide against a wooden table to get it to release (hand pressure alone would not budge it). When the case was ejected doing this, the bullet stayed lodged in the chamber, so I had to knock that out also.

I then tried 1.20 and got a similar result, but the slide didn't stick quite as bad and the bullet stayed in the case on forced ejection. So I went to 1.19, and things worked fine."

I had a similar experience when my son's 1911 was fitted with a target barrel, the tighter dimensions resulted previously reliable loads having the same symptoms as he described. When I recovered the bullet that was stuck in the chamber, I discovered that rifling marks had been engraved on the shoulder of the bullet!

After looking carefully at commercial rounds, I noted that they almost all had only about .05" of shoulder forward of the case mouth.

I have since set the OAL so that I have about this much shoulder exposed. Go much deeper and the case mouth doesn't have enough support and I get feeding jams.

wncchester · December 1, 2009, 11:22 AM

Forget book OAL, is isn't a law any more than the powder charges are.

Most handgun bullets that need be crimped, and some that don't, have a crimping groove. Seat so you can crimp in that groove, try it for function and chambering. If it works, it's good.

November 22, 2009, 06:52 PM	#1
yggorf Senior Member Join Date: April 17, 2009 Posts: 125	What OAL for .45 ACP? I am using Hornady XTP Bullets 45 Caliber (451 Diameter) 185 Grain Jacketed Hollow Point bullets currently loaded to 1.15 OAL. However, I am seeing some failure to feed problems with these. In talking to one gunsmith, he advised I load these to 1.25 OAL -- is that a wise move?

November 22, 2009, 07:15 PM	#2
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	You can try it. If the bullet is still grasped by the brass well-enough, it should be OK. Seating out lowers pressure, where seating deeper raises it, so you are going in the safer direction. Did you inquire about getting your gun modified to feed wide blunt shapes better? I don't know what your gun is, so I don't know if that's a practical consideration or not? Sometimes the magazine feed lips can be modified for more reliable feed, too. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle Last edited by Unclenick; November 22, 2009 at 07:22 PM.

November 22, 2009, 08:01 PM	#3
Kyo Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2009 Posts: 897	well, your manual will tell you mix/max of AOL. usually the max is 1.275 anyway. 1.15 feels short to me. I load my 185 grain LSWC to 1.230-1.240 My dad's flat point FMJ's are also 185 and I load them to 1.22x-1.22x Feeds fine in both our guns. Shoots fine too __________________ 1. The gun is *always* loaded. 2. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy. 3. Keep your finger off the trigger unless you are ready to shoot. 4. Be be sure of your target and what is beyond it.

November 22, 2009, 09:31 PM	#5
Mark whiz Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 2004 Location: Wabash, IN Posts: 227	I load all my .45ACP XTPs (185,200, & 230gr) at 1.245" for 100% reliable feeding in my Springer GI 1911-A1. __________________ "Every moving thing that liveth, I give unto you as meat" (Gen 9:3) Aim small.........miss small. Trust God..........but keep your powder dry!

November 22, 2009, 11:38 PM	#7
Blue Senior Member Join Date: June 6, 2009 Posts: 113	OAL Try 1.20 first and see how they feed. If still having problems go to book OAL of 1.23. Are you guaging with your barrel to see if they are fitting ok? If still having feed problems even with Book OAL then you might try the Lee FCD to uniform them. Could be something else in your process causing the problem. The FCD will make sure there are no bulges as cartridge is removed from the die after taper crimp is applied. Let us know how it goes and what you find. I haven't had this problem but I use 200 gr gold dots and 230gr fmj almost exclusively. BTW - where did you get the 1.15 you are using now? Best advice would be to stick to MFR Book value and check out your process further. Might even want to polish your chamber and ramp with JB bore paste. Last edited by Blue; November 22, 2009 at 11:44 PM.

November 22, 2009, 09:21 PM	#4
Ozzieman Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2004 Location: Northern Indiana Posts: 6,117	Hornady's 7th edition lists the 185 Grain HP-XTP #45100 A C.O.L of 1.23. Go with the book numbers.

November 22, 2009, 09:42 PM	#6
Tuzo Senior Member Join Date: June 14, 2007 Location: Louisiana Posts: 797	Sierra lists 1.212" for 185 JHP and Lyman lists 1.175." You are not too far off Lyman's specification. My preference is Sierra's 1.212" COAL. Good luck.

November 23, 2009, 07:30 AM	#8
darkgael Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2006 Location: Homes in Brooklyn, NY and in Pennsylvania. Posts: 5,473	OAL Not a lead bullet, I load Remington Match JSWCs to 1.150". Over 4.0 grains of Bullseye, they work just fine. Pete __________________ “Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports ... all others are games.” Ernest Hemingway ... NRA Life Member

November 30, 2009, 05:54 PM	#10
yggorf Senior Member Join Date: April 17, 2009 Posts: 125	I tried seating the Hornady's (mentioned at the top of the thread) to 1.25. When I chambered these, the round got stuck in the chamber with the slide not completely forward. I had to push the slide against a wooden table to get it to release (hand pressure alone would not budge it). When the case was ejected doing this, the bullet stayed lodged in the chamber, so I had to knock that out also. I then tried 1.20 and got a similar result, but the slide didn't stick quite as bad and the bullet stayed in the case on forced ejection. So I went to 1.19, and things worked fine. So, although I now have rounds that function correctly, I am wondering why all the books say 1.25 should be OK? Is there some other problem I am having that prevents a normal length round from working?

November 30, 2009, 06:41 PM	#11
tom234 Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 2008 Location: Kansas Posts: 753	I always shoot for 1.250" OAL. Never had a problem.

November 30, 2009, 07:56 PM	#12
QBall45 Senior Member Join Date: April 5, 2008 Location: South Central Minnesota Posts: 584	2 thoughts come to mind. 1. 1.15 oal sounds like a minimum oal. I would take your gun smiths recommendation and start stretching them out a bit. I would not make the jump directly to 1.25. I would work up till I found an oal that feeds reliably. I use 1.20-1.22 with my 200gr lswc cast in a lee TL mould. Play with it like you would make adjustments in finding the right powder charge. 2. The mag. Does the failure to feed problem happen with just 1 mag or all your mags? Any trouble feeding FMJ's? My guess is that its the OAL. Too short to feed reliable like your smith said. Good luck, its frustrating when things won't work the way you want. I think this one should be fairly easy for you to fix.

November 30, 2009, 10:22 PM	#13
JASmith Senior Member Join Date: September 27, 2009 Posts: 157	YGGORF described something very close to my own experience. His main comment: "I tried seating the Hornady's (mentioned at the top of the thread) to 1.25. When I chambered these, the round got stuck in the chamber with the slide not completely forward. I had to push the slide against a wooden table to get it to release (hand pressure alone would not budge it). When the case was ejected doing this, the bullet stayed lodged in the chamber, so I had to knock that out also. I then tried 1.20 and got a similar result, but the slide didn't stick quite as bad and the bullet stayed in the case on forced ejection. So I went to 1.19, and things worked fine." I had a similar experience when my son's 1911 was fitted with a target barrel, the tighter dimensions resulted previously reliable loads having the same symptoms as he described. When I recovered the bullet that was stuck in the chamber, I discovered that rifling marks had been engraved on the shoulder of the bullet! After looking carefully at commercial rounds, I noted that they almost all had only about .05" of shoulder forward of the case mouth. I have since set the OAL so that I have about this much shoulder exposed. Go much deeper and the case mouth doesn't have enough support and I get feeding jams. __________________ Nevermore... http://shootersnotes.com

December 1, 2009, 11:22 AM	#14
wncchester Senior Member Join Date: December 1, 2002 Posts: 2,832	Forget book OAL, is isn't a law any more than the powder charges are. Most handgun bullets that need be crimped, and some that don't, have a crimping groove. Seat so you can crimp in that groove, try it for function and chambering. If it works, it's good.