Reloading For The 1895G

[Edward429451]

I have a Lee 405g mould, some 350g RN (Hornady), and some REM 405 JFP's. In order to stay with the Marlins COAL max of 2.550 I had to bury the cannelure. I lightly crimed them on the ojive.

If I stay with the cannelure on the jacketeds or crimp groove on the cast, they're too long.

Will the Marlin handle longer lengths and still function or did I do right to seat to 2.550 and crimp them to the ojive?

Couldn't find nothing with the search function.

[steveno]

all loads in the 45-70 Marlin have to be held to the 2.550 max oal

[Edward429451]

That's what I thought so went ahead and crimped them on the ojive. It seemed hard to believe that all those 405's out there and can't be used in a Marlin.

While I've only seen three types, is there .458 bullets out there that wont be overly long yet allow me to crimp on the cannelure?

[steveno]

I also had a Ruger #1 in 45-70 and I crimped the 405 remington in the first groove. I didn't think anything about it when I bought the guide gun. I had to take gun apart at the range to get the longer rounds out of the magazine. the guide gun is a well made gun but I think the stock design sucks. with any load the Ruger #1 is a lot more comfortable to shoot so I got rid of the guide gun

[Gatofeo]

The Speer 400 gr. jacketed softpoint for the .45-70 has two canellures. One for crimping for the Marlin, the other canellure for crimping for the Ruger single-shots.
This bullet will solve your problem.
I've been shooting the Marlin 95 since I bought mine new in 1977. Back then, I used the Winchester softnose. Its cannelure was just right for the Marlin. Winchester stopped offering that bullet as a component years ago and I have only a few left.
But the Speer 400 gr. is readily available and I have an ample supply of them. Haven't tried the Remington, Nosler or Barnes bullets. Not much desire to.
I no longer hunt, so I don't often load jacketed bullets. I prefer to load the Lyman 457193 (420 gr. lead) over 2400 or IMR3031 for a plinking load.
A word of warning!
There are many, many load recommendations for the Marlin 95 on the internet and some are downright dangerous.
Always, ALWAYS check any internet load against a reputable, recently published reloading manual or the internet site of a powder or bullet manufacturer.
If some jackleg tells you, "I use 57 grains of Hoopla powder under a 450 grain bullet and she shoots sweet!" --- don't take that at face value.
Check his recommendation! Chances are he's a one-eyed, three-fingered idjit.

Many people are inflicted with "Magnumitis" today. They can't STAND a 400 gr. bullet "loafing" along at 1,300 or 1,400 feet per second. Somehow, they've got it in their feeble minds that a bullet at "only" that speed is wholly unsuitable for deer, elk, bear and moose.
To which I reply, "Steer poddy!"
The old-timers, using nothing but black powder, took every big game on this continent with lead bullets "loafing" along at 1,300 fps or less.
Resist the temptation to "Magnumize" your Marlin 95. It will last longer because you won't be straining it with loads producing high pressures.

Another word of warning: Don't use loads listed in books or articles more than 20 years old. Today's powders, though they bear the same name, are not the same formula as they once were.
For example, the old Hercules-made Unique and 2400, or the old DuPont IMR3031 or IMR4198 are not quite the same powders as today's Alliant-made Unique or 2400 or IMR-made 3031 or 4198.
Use the freshest loading data you can find.

And steer clear of Elmer Keith's old, recommended load of 53.0 grains of IMR3031 under a 405 gr. jacketed bullet in the .45-70. You'll often see it quoted.
I tried this load back in the late 1970s and found it too powerful for my Marlin. Cases extracted stickily and primers were flattened. I later determined that 50.0 grains of IMR3031 was Maximum in my rifle --- but that was with the old DuPont-made 3031. Today, I'd start at 45.0 grains of IMR-made 3031 and work up a half-grain or grain at a time.
Frankly, I haven't fired a load this stout in many years. Not much need to.
When I vacation at my cabin in British Columbia, in grizzly country, I bring some stout loads for the Marlin as a cabin gun. Never had a bear incident but better to be prepared.
I haven't fired the Guide Gun but handled a few. Seems light to me. I much prefer the regular length rifle. With 400 gr. bullets at 1,400 or so, recoil is not a factor.

[steveno]

the two grooves in the Speer 400 grain only apply to very early Ruger #1S. My #1S was made in 1989 and you can't use the "so called Ruger groove" in it. the grooves are clearly explained in the Speer manuals

[Edward429451]

Good post Gatofeo. No magnumitis here. I did use an old load book for data for the rounds I've loaded so far, but the powder is old also, Dupont. I had a sealed can of 4198 that was given me. Looks & smells good and no dust when poured. Just to be used for some plinking loads to get used to the rifle and until I can get ahold of some fresh RX7, and brass. I rejected a lot of the used brass I had and loaded some of the rest with starting loads.

I've read so much about the 45/70 lately that my head hurts! You're right, a lot of conflicting data out there. Some loads I've found were listed for Marlins but were clearly level 3 loads. Nine different load books shed some light on the situation.

[Unclenick]

I still have part of a box of Remington commercial loads with their 405 gr. soft point. Grabbing one round out of the box, the OAL is 2.540". The case is 2.093". The lip shows what appears to be only a light taper crimp. No bullet cannelure is visible. However, the case itself has a cannelure just behind the base of the bullet. It seems to me someone used to sell a tool for making that case cannelure. Don't know how much help it is in keeping the bullet forward? My main point is that Remington seats deeper than the canelure, so you can too. Try a Lee Factory Crimp die if you are concerned about setback.

Nick

[Edward429451]

I have a Corbin hand cannelure tool. I tried to mark some brass with it once and it didn't work so well. It doers bullets real good though. I'm going to pick up a Lee FCD today if they have one.

[garryc]

I have some 45-70 loads with speer 400gr bullets, 52.0 grains H322. Speer lists a max of 49gr at 28000 but hodgon shows 52. I took my 1895 guide to alaska with me when I went fishing two years ago. I had 30 rounds. I still have 23 of them. The load showed no pressure signs and was safe, but, let me tell you, firing one of those is an experiance you won't forget. That load is ok if a bear invites you do dinner but way too powerfull for most the hunting you would use the gun for. I found 48grains to be a great load, still powerful but not brutal. CH makes a canneler tool thats not as pricy as corbin

[Doug in Alaska]

I shoot 405 gr. Cast Performance and 525 gr. Beartooth Pile-Drivers in my Marlin Stainless Guide Gun. Both these bullets are gas checked. I use 51 gr. of H322 in the 405 gr. and 41 gr. of H322 in the 525 gr. load. Both are extremely accurate and I crimp in the crimp groove on both bullets, this gives me 2.550 OAL.