WERLEY ST.JAMES LONDON DOUBLE SHOT.

pepemarine · February 18, 2001, 10:24 PM

I OWN A SIDE BY SIDE SHOTGUN THAT READS WERLEY ST. JAMES LONDON. I DON´T HAVE ANY OF INFO ON THIS GUN. ITS A 12 GA. WITH 26 INCH BARRELS IN 85% CONDITION . VERY SIMPLE ENGRAVING. ANY DATA IS WELCOME.

Harley Nolden · February 19, 2001, 02:41 PM

pepemarine:
I don't have the specifics on your shotgun, however, It sounds like you may have what is termed a "hardware gun." That is it was made by a major company, for a hardware commpany, or an import through a major importer here in the United States. Here is the story on "Hardward Guns."

CRESCENT ARMS

This Company mfg’d good quality, inexpensive side by side and single Bbl shotguns and was founded in 1883. They were bought by the H&D Folsom Arms Company of New York, importers and distributors of firearms and sporting goods.

After the purchase of Crescent, the Folsom Company was able to offer a complete range of shotguns, imported English French, Belgium and American made Crescents. By the turn of the century Crescent Arms produced huge quantities of “Hardware Guns” it produced guns under direct contract to distributors, mail order housed and hardware distributors with any brand name the customer requested. Crescent also produced guns for its parent company, as Folsom house brands that were sold to customers that did not want their own brand name.

By the lat 1890's Crescent was producing basically five grade of dbl bbl shotguns offering a model for most tastes. The Crescent /Folsom Arms Company continued this type of business until 1930 when it merged with Davis Warner Arms Corp and became the Crescent-Davis Arms Corp. In 1932 it assets and machinery were bought by Stevens Arms Company, a victim of changing tastes and the depression.

HJN

James K · February 20, 2001, 02:57 AM

That gun might be one of the many cheap Belgian guns marked with English-sounding names to make the buyer think he was getting a quality gun. I can find no record of a "Werley" in London or anywhere else, but note the similarity to "Webley", the famous English gun making firm.

Remove the barrels and look on the frame where they close and also on the bottoms of the barrels and see if there are any marks. If you see something that looks like a tower and an oval with the letters E L G, you have a Belgian gun. If not, describe any marks you do see, and they might help identify at least the origin of the gun.

I don't know how old the gun is, but if it is from around the last turn of the century, it very likely has Damascus barrels and should not be fired under any circumstances.

Jim

pepemarine · February 23, 2001, 12:01 AM

JIM KEENAN
THE GUN HAS A DIAMOND WITH A C ON TOP A 12 AND TWO TYPES OF CROWNS ONE WITH TINES AND THE OTHER HAS AROUND TOP. OTHER SIMBOLS LIKE A SINGLE STAR LOOKS TO BE TO IDENTIFY THE CHOKE ON THE BARREL,AND THERE´S ALSO A DOUBLE STAR ON THE OTHER BARREL. PLEASE HELP AS I´M WRITING FROM OLD MEXICO AND WE DON´T HAVE ANY LITERATURE ABOUT IT. THANX.

fal308 · February 24, 2001, 06:46 AM

Is there any markings or lettering above or below the crowns? The crowns most likely are the proof markings. Many countries used a variation of a crown for proof markings. Also if you could be more specific about the descriptions of the crowns perhaps it may be of more use.

James K · February 25, 2001, 06:43 PM

The diamond with the gauge (12 in this case) over C was used by both England and Belgium. Both also used crowns. As fal308 says, we need more info. Take off the barrels and look at the bottom of the barrels and the locking lugs ("lumps"). Any markings at all may be useful. A magnifying glass is helpful in cases like this.

Jim

February 23, 2001, 12:01 AM	#4
pepemarine Member Join Date: February 18, 2001 Location: old mexico Posts: 94	markings on the werley JIM KEENAN THE GUN HAS A DIAMOND WITH A C ON TOP A 12 AND TWO TYPES OF CROWNS ONE WITH TINES AND THE OTHER HAS AROUND TOP. OTHER SIMBOLS LIKE A SINGLE STAR LOOKS TO BE TO IDENTIFY THE CHOKE ON THE BARREL,AND THERE´S ALSO A DOUBLE STAR ON THE OTHER BARREL. PLEASE HELP AS I´M WRITING FROM OLD MEXICO AND WE DON´T HAVE ANY LITERATURE ABOUT IT. THANX.

February 18, 2001, 10:24 PM	#1
pepemarine Member Join Date: February 18, 2001 Location: old mexico Posts: 94	I OWN A SIDE BY SIDE SHOTGUN THAT READS WERLEY ST. JAMES LONDON. I DON´T HAVE ANY OF INFO ON THIS GUN. ITS A 12 GA. WITH 26 INCH BARRELS IN 85% CONDITION . VERY SIMPLE ENGRAVING. ANY DATA IS WELCOME.

February 19, 2001, 02:41 PM	#2
Harley Nolden Staff In Memoriam Join Date: January 8, 1999 Location: Brunswick,GA USA Posts: 1,884	pepemarine: I don't have the specifics on your shotgun, however, It sounds like you may have what is termed a "hardware gun." That is it was made by a major company, for a hardware commpany, or an import through a major importer here in the United States. Here is the story on "Hardward Guns." CRESCENT ARMS This Company mfg’d good quality, inexpensive side by side and single Bbl shotguns and was founded in 1883. They were bought by the H&D Folsom Arms Company of New York, importers and distributors of firearms and sporting goods. After the purchase of Crescent, the Folsom Company was able to offer a complete range of shotguns, imported English French, Belgium and American made Crescents. By the turn of the century Crescent Arms produced huge quantities of “Hardware Guns” it produced guns under direct contract to distributors, mail order housed and hardware distributors with any brand name the customer requested. Crescent also produced guns for its parent company, as Folsom house brands that were sold to customers that did not want their own brand name. By the lat 1890's Crescent was producing basically five grade of dbl bbl shotguns offering a model for most tastes. The Crescent /Folsom Arms Company continued this type of business until 1930 when it merged with Davis Warner Arms Corp and became the Crescent-Davis Arms Corp. In 1932 it assets and machinery were bought by Stevens Arms Company, a victim of changing tastes and the depression. HJN

February 20, 2001, 02:57 AM	#3
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	That gun might be one of the many cheap Belgian guns marked with English-sounding names to make the buyer think he was getting a quality gun. I can find no record of a "Werley" in London or anywhere else, but note the similarity to "Webley", the famous English gun making firm. Remove the barrels and look on the frame where they close and also on the bottoms of the barrels and see if there are any marks. If you see something that looks like a tower and an oval with the letters E L G, you have a Belgian gun. If not, describe any marks you do see, and they might help identify at least the origin of the gun. I don't know how old the gun is, but if it is from around the last turn of the century, it very likely has Damascus barrels and should not be fired under any circumstances. Jim

February 24, 2001, 06:46 AM	#5
fal308 Staff Alumnus Join Date: October 12, 1998 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,992	Is there any markings or lettering above or below the crowns? The crowns most likely are the proof markings. Many countries used a variation of a crown for proof markings. Also if you could be more specific about the descriptions of the crowns perhaps it may be of more use.

February 25, 2001, 06:43 PM	#6
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	The diamond with the gauge (12 in this case) over C was used by both England and Belgium. Both also used crowns. As fal308 says, we need more info. Take off the barrels and look at the bottom of the barrels and the locking lugs ("lumps"). Any markings at all may be useful. A magnifying glass is helpful in cases like this. Jim