Problems with my old/new 3 screw Super Blackhawk

FoghornLeghorn · June 10, 2013, 10:15 AM

I recently purchased a 3 screw Super Blackhawk. I took it to the range today and at 25 yards, it's shooting about 12 inches high. If I adjust the rear sight down as far as it will go, it binds the cylinder. As in, the cylinder will not move.

The load was a 44 mag case, 7.0 grains Unique, 240 grain copper plated Ranier bullet.

As far as it shooting high, would a competent gunsmith know how much of the front sight to remove?

Second, is it normal that it's possible to bind the cylinder with the rear sight elevation screw?

PetahW · June 10, 2013, 12:16 PM

.

FWIW, any reduction in front sight height will result in raising the POI.................

I've owned several different SBH's since the 1970's, and have never found that the sight's elevation screw bound the cylinder from turning - But then, I also never needed to fully depress the rear sight to zero one of them, either.

R U sure that you're keeping a firm enough grip on the gun, that the shots are not being thrown artificially higher than normal ?

IDK about Unique-flavored loads - but if your load is relatively slow, compared to the factory loads the sight were designed to zero for, they may have a longer barrel time, which along with the barrel's upward recoil motion, put that Unique load's POI much higher than it would if the loads were driven faster.

.

Bob Wright · June 10, 2013, 12:27 PM

You can hve your gunsmith install a higher front sight and ramp. Ruger makes several different heights.

Or cut off you blade and mill out a groove and install a new front sight blade. This will eliminate having to reblue the barrel.

You can file the rear blade down, but as much adjustment as you seem to need, doubt you can file it down enough.

And, as noted, a faster stepping load will bring your groups down, too.

But no, your gunsmith can only make a rough guess, your actal fine tunung is up to you.

Bob Wright

UncleEd · June 10, 2013, 12:52 PM

7 grains unique with your bullet seems fairly mild for a .44 Mag. You shouldn't be getting a great deal of recoil. It's more on the lines of a .44 Special, I think.
But using a plated bullet you really shouldn't push it much more.

Try a 200 grain bullet with the same load; you'll get less barrel time for the bullet and you'll find it'll shoot lower as a result of less barrel rise.

Next range session, see if someone else has your problem...Maybe a range officer or friend you respect.

Have you shot single actions a lot in the past? They do react differently with their plow handles compared to a DA revolver, i.e. a Smith .44 or Ruger Redhawk. It matters a lot if you're shooting single or two handed and how tight your grip is.

As for binding the cylinder, you're rear sight screw is down right on top of the cylinder. You tighten too much and you're going to get a screw mark on the cylinder.

I'm betting the gun is A-OK and you shouldn't start altering it via a gunsmith.

giaquir · June 10, 2013, 12:59 PM

I have Ruger single actions, 2 3 screws and a Vaquero.
I can't tell you how many I have bought and sold.
As far as Unique,I use it for all my revolvers
and Bullseye for all my semis.
My Ruger single actions now and gone ,357's-41-44's-45colts (fixed siights)-
all have been spot on with Unique.
Never had to adjust more than a couple cubits.
There may be another problem unless you're not
using factory sights.

Bob Wright · June 10, 2013, 01:33 PM

This is one of my Super Blackhawks that has a pinned in front sight. I believe you can see the pin in the ramp. Keith Warner, of Memphis, milled off the front sight and fit a new, higher blade for me.

My Ruger Single Actions are sighted in with the rear sight at about mid-height with my favorite loads. I file either the front or rear blade to zero in. This leaves me enough adjustment for different loads.

Bob Wright

FoghornLeghorn · June 10, 2013, 02:26 PM

Quote:

unless you're not using factory sights.

Dunno about the front sight, but the rear sight isn't stock. It's a white outline and I suspect that the rear sight blade is the problem. I suspect somebody (I just bought the gun) stuck in a rear sight blade without matching it to the front sight ramp.

Bob, I'll take that Ruger off your hands. I'll trade you a perfectly good watchdog for it. Only thing, she's hard of hearing and blind in one eye.

Also, as far as the load being too light. I have two model 29-2 revolvers, and the load shoots just fine. I've also owned several SBH revolvers in the past, and never had this problem.

I'm going to take the gun to a local gunsmith to have the barrel shortened to 4 5/8 inches and I'll have him fix the sight problem as well.

g.willikers · June 10, 2013, 03:31 PM

Sight change formula, from the web:

D1 / R1 = D2 / R2

For rear sight adjustments:
D1 is the distance between point of aim and point of impact.
R1 is range from front sight to target.
D2 is the height the rear sight must change by.
R2 is the distance between front and rear sights.

For front sight adjustments:
D1 is the distance between point of aim and point of impact.
R1 is range from rear sight to target.
D2 is the height the front sight must change by.
R2 is the sight radius distance between front and rear sights.

newfrontier45 · June 10, 2013, 03:53 PM

If I were having it shortened anyway, I'd opt for something like the Weigand interchangeable front sight system or that from Alpha Precision.

James K · June 10, 2013, 04:03 PM

A common cause of a handgun shooting high is resting the gun on a bench or sandbag, or letting the gun butt or barrel touch a rest. The best results are usually obtained when resting the wrists on a sandbag having nothing touch the gun but the hand(s).

Jim

newfrontier45 · June 10, 2013, 04:05 PM

I agree on resting the butt but most pros rest the frame/barrel junction on a pile of bags while resting the forearms (not elbows) on the bench. This is how I have always done it and it does not alter the point of impact.

But gloves do.

FoghornLeghorn · June 10, 2013, 05:04 PM

I was using a two handed standing position. We used to call it the Weaver stance? My S&W 66-1 w/2 1/2 inch barrel grouped/shot nicely. As did my Mk 1 Ruger 22. Ditto my Sig SAS DAK P239.

I think I'll check out the sight options recommended by newfrontier.

Thanx for all the responses. Truly.

Bob Wright · June 10, 2013, 07:48 PM

giaquir said:

Quote:

Never had to adjust more than a couple cubits.

How many clicks in a cubit? That's a powerful lot of adjustment!

Bob Wright

June 10, 2013, 10:15 AM	#1
FoghornLeghorn Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 2011 Posts: 961	Problems with my old/new 3 screw Super Blackhawk I recently purchased a 3 screw Super Blackhawk. I took it to the range today and at 25 yards, it's shooting about 12 inches high. If I adjust the rear sight down as far as it will go, it binds the cylinder. As in, the cylinder will not move. The load was a 44 mag case, 7.0 grains Unique, 240 grain copper plated Ranier bullet. As far as it shooting high, would a competent gunsmith know how much of the front sight to remove? Second, is it normal that it's possible to bind the cylinder with the rear sight elevation screw?

June 10, 2013, 12:52 PM	#4
UncleEd Senior Member Join Date: April 13, 2013 Location: N. Georgia Posts: 1,150	7 grains unique with your bullet seems fairly mild for a .44 Mag. You shouldn't be getting a great deal of recoil. It's more on the lines of a .44 Special, I think. But using a plated bullet you really shouldn't push it much more. Try a 200 grain bullet with the same load; you'll get less barrel time for the bullet and you'll find it'll shoot lower as a result of less barrel rise. Next range session, see if someone else has your problem...Maybe a range officer or friend you respect. Have you shot single actions a lot in the past? They do react differently with their plow handles compared to a DA revolver, i.e. a Smith .44 or Ruger Redhawk. It matters a lot if you're shooting single or two handed and how tight your grip is. As for binding the cylinder, you're rear sight screw is down right on top of the cylinder. You tighten too much and you're going to get a screw mark on the cylinder. I'm betting the gun is A-OK and you shouldn't start altering it via a gunsmith. Last edited by UncleEd; June 10, 2013 at 12:59 PM.

June 10, 2013, 03:31 PM	#8
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Sight change formula, from the web: D1 / R1 = D2 / R2 For rear sight adjustments: D1 is the distance between point of aim and point of impact. R1 is range from front sight to target. D2 is the height the rear sight must change by. R2 is the distance between front and rear sights. For front sight adjustments: D1 is the distance between point of aim and point of impact. R1 is range from rear sight to target. D2 is the height the front sight must change by. R2 is the sight radius distance between front and rear sights. __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

June 10, 2013, 12:16 PM	#2
PetahW Senior Member Join Date: September 19, 2008 Posts: 4,678	. FWIW, any reduction in front sight height will result in raising the POI................. I've owned several different SBH's since the 1970's, and have never found that the sight's elevation screw bound the cylinder from turning - But then, I also never needed to fully depress the rear sight to zero one of them, either. R U sure that you're keeping a firm enough grip on the gun, that the shots are not being thrown artificially higher than normal ? IDK about Unique-flavored loads - but if your load is relatively slow, compared to the factory loads the sight were designed to zero for, they may have a longer barrel time, which along with the barrel's upward recoil motion, put that Unique load's POI much higher than it would if the loads were driven faster. .

June 10, 2013, 12:27 PM	#3
Bob Wright Senior Member Join Date: July 10, 2012 Location: Memphis, Tennessee Posts: 2,989	You can hve your gunsmith install a higher front sight and ramp. Ruger makes several different heights. Or cut off you blade and mill out a groove and install a new front sight blade. This will eliminate having to reblue the barrel. You can file the rear blade down, but as much adjustment as you seem to need, doubt you can file it down enough. And, as noted, a faster stepping load will bring your groups down, too. But no, your gunsmith can only make a rough guess, your actal fine tunung is up to you. Bob Wright

June 10, 2013, 12:59 PM	#5
giaquir Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2006 Location: Deerfield,New Hampshire Posts: 512	I have Ruger single actions, 2 3 screws and a Vaquero. I can't tell you how many I have bought and sold. As far as Unique,I use it for all my revolvers and Bullseye for all my semis. My Ruger single actions now and gone ,357's-41-44's-45colts (fixed siights)- all have been spot on with Unique. Never had to adjust more than a couple cubits. There may be another problem unless you're not using factory sights.

June 10, 2013, 01:33 PM	#6
Bob Wright Senior Member Join Date: July 10, 2012 Location: Memphis, Tennessee Posts: 2,989	This is one of my Super Blackhawks that has a pinned in front sight. I believe you can see the pin in the ramp. Keith Warner, of Memphis, milled off the front sight and fit a new, higher blade for me. My Ruger Single Actions are sighted in with the rear sight at about mid-height with my favorite loads. I file either the front or rear blade to zero in. This leaves me enough adjustment for different loads. Bob Wright

June 10, 2013, 03:53 PM	#9
newfrontier45 Junior member Join Date: February 23, 2012 Posts: 921	If I were having it shortened anyway, I'd opt for something like the Weigand interchangeable front sight system or that from Alpha Precision.

June 10, 2013, 04:03 PM	#10
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	A common cause of a handgun shooting high is resting the gun on a bench or sandbag, or letting the gun butt or barrel touch a rest. The best results are usually obtained when resting the wrists on a sandbag having nothing touch the gun but the hand(s). Jim

June 10, 2013, 04:05 PM	#11
newfrontier45 Junior member Join Date: February 23, 2012 Posts: 921	I agree on resting the butt but most pros rest the frame/barrel junction on a pile of bags while resting the forearms (not elbows) on the bench. This is how I have always done it and it does not alter the point of impact. But gloves do.

June 10, 2013, 05:04 PM	#12
FoghornLeghorn Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 2011 Posts: 961	I was using a two handed standing position. We used to call it the Weaver stance? My S&W 66-1 w/2 1/2 inch barrel grouped/shot nicely. As did my Mk 1 Ruger 22. Ditto my Sig SAS DAK P239. I think I'll check out the sight options recommended by newfrontier. Thanx for all the responses. Truly.