Want to learn how to load black powder cartridges

[p.mcconnell]

Hi all,

I just bought a Sharps in .45-110. The thing is I’ve always shot muzzle loaders and I’m at the very bottom of the learning curve for cartridge loads. There’s tons of literature out there, but most of what I’ve seen assumes some experience. Does anyone have a recommendation for an “Idiots Guide” to hand loading?

Please, throw a newbie a bone.

TIA

Philip

[Chainsaw.]

Oooh, fun choice, color me envious.

That being said I know squat about reloading BP cartridges past use a drop tube, leave no air gap by filling with wads.

Welcome to the forum.

[HiBC]

I'm no expert.I dabbled.

The SPG Bullet lube Co made a very good basic pamphlet.It turns out the lube you select is pretty critical.Of course,they promote SPG lube.Equally "of course".everyone has an opinion on that.I'll say its good lube,and its not the wrong lube.

Mike Venturino's book "Shooting the Buffalo Rifle"(or something close) is a very good source.I recommend it.

Another Gentleman who wrote extensively on his journey to master loading for the BPCR is Paul Matthews. He wrote several books.There is a wealth of knowledge and experience in them.He is worth exploring. Mr Matthews set out to learn how to make them work.I take it he was an older fellow who found a passion.He wrote several books along the way.

Some folks may have an issue with his style.I'll confess to rolling my eyes occasionally.But thats the price of his experience. He gives you a shovel of rich ore.You pan it for color.

Generally you will need good cast bullets.Over time,you'll probably try a few molds,maybe have a custom made.

Its not as easy to pour a near perfect 45 or 50 cal ,over 400 gr bullet.

Briefly,the heat goes from the lead to the mold.The outer skin sets up first.
As the rest of the lead cools,it shrinks.All the shrink gets pulled from the liquid center.
Result:voids,porosity,etc.

Mr Matthews put a lot of work into learning how to cast good BPCR bullets.

He'll give you some foundation.

If Mt Baldy Bullets is still around,they aren't cheap,but they are good.

And check out Buffalo Arms.They have a website

That will get you a start.

Loading BPCR is different than loading modern cartridges.

If a rookie will follow basic,good reloading practice,and if he has a sound .308 rifle,he can do a basic prep on his brass,select a bullet such as a Sierra Match King from 168 to 175 gr,and charge it with Varget,RE-15,4895,or 4064 ,load it to approx 2.800 length...and unless there is a problem with the rifle,it will shoot pretty good.
Sure,it can get better with tuning,but these loads are reliable in just about any rifle.There is a formula.

BPCR is different. You might duplicat a 1000 yd champion ship load and shoot 8 MOA Don't give up.
Venturino describes pulling his hair out trying to get a 45-90 to shoot.It wouldn't.He tried annealing the necks on his Starline 45-90 brass. Bingo.

No knock on Starline.Same brass has to work in a tube mag 1886 Winchester.

There are a lot of subtleties,and a lot of pet ideas.You can spend years trying and evaluating them all.

Some prefer minimal,if any,neck tension.They thumb seat their bullets.Some want secure,crimped loads.

Ogives,bore ride vs easy loading with fouling,bullet hardness,ogive "slump"

Wads,grease cookies,Is a cigarette paper disc/ wad over the flash hole better?

All subject to debate and "maybe"

Take notes and change one thing at a time.If you get a 10 in pattern at 100 yds,remember Edison's attitude about failure...You eliminated something that does not work.

I'll suggest this: BP fouling eats brass cases.When you go to the range,take a large mouth plastic jug with a secure lid. Put some Simple Green solution in it,sufficient to cover the cases fully.
Even if its with a simple shellholder and knockout punch,deprime at the range.

Chuck all yout brass in the solution at the range.The drive home will slosh things around a bit.

Use a test tube brush or equivalent to brush out the sludge.Get the primer pockets clean ,rinse thoroughly.

Then dry them.

A light spritz of the lanolin based spray case lube won't hurt..

Starline,etc make good brass,but its expensive.You can load it a bunch of times,
Its sad to have it turn green and crunchy.

I just read your post again. I see you have a 45-110.I never fired or loaded one,so take me with a grain of salt.
Powder fouling is one of the struggles.It influences accuracy. Generally,more powder equals more fouling.
You will probably struggle more with fouling with a 45-110 than a 45-70 or 45-90 would
The news is not all bad.Some bullets are more lube grooves and less ogive.
You can seat longer bodied bullets deep to cover all the lube.

Grafs has their own brand of BP,and there is Goex and Swiss.and Scheutzen.You'll have to find what works.

As has been mentioned,no air space and no fluffy filler. You will want some powder compression.How much? Use a drop tube,and BP does not compress much.I'd guess .030 to .060,but you have to work that out.

[reinert]

Are you already reloading for any modern center-fire cartridges? Just wondering. If your journey is just beginning with B.P.C.R., and the reloading for such, call these folks below after looking through their site. The owner and staff are all shooters, and are very knowledgeable as to any questions you'd have regarding your new rifle. They have a very good book selection available, too. Through the years, whenever I've needed anything pertaining to this game, they've always had it, and sent it out promptly. Good knowledgeable folks, with great service.

www.buffaloarms.com

[T. O'Heir]

Buy a copy of the Lyman BP Handbook and Reloading Guide. $23.98 directly from Lyman. $19.49 from Midway. $17.99 via Amazon. Your local gun shop will probably have it too.
Tell you everything you need to know and there's BP rifle and handgun load data.

[p.mcconnell]

I have never loaded center fire cartridge weapons in my life. In fact with the exception of a pair of Pietta 1860 Army pistols all my firearms are flintlock. I’ve got several pre 1800 American long rifles, a short land pattern musket, a pair of rifled horse pistols and my favorite is a pattern 1800 infantry rifle (Baker) built from TRS parts. They are ALL replicas of course.

An acquaintance let me try their Sharps rifle in .45-90 and it was a lot of fun. Then I happened on one locally and decided to buy. Flinters are fun partially because they’re kind of “fiddley” to shoot consistently and accurately. Hand loading the Sharps ammo allows the (I guess I’m anal retentive) the fun to continue off the range. I’ll probably be terrible at initially but everyone has to start somewhere. Besides, now I get to buy cool tools!

[reinert]

Hopefully, you got some brass with your Sharps when you made the deal. New 45/110 (45 2 7/8ths Sharps Straight) brass may be a bit elusive to find currently...and expensive. Without getting into the basics to build custom, handloaded ammo geared specifically for your particular rifle, you can have some fun with it, safely, while you're learning to build the best accurate rounds for your rifle. And believe me, it takes time, research, $$, the right equipment, and lots of testing at the range.

Looks like you have "the knowledge" on how black powder works with your current m.l. arsenal (and a Rifle Shoppe Baker? Very cool!), and about how fouling plays in those guns. In a black powder cartridge rifle using strictly black powder (no duplexing here) it's all about fouling control, and a properly greased bullet that fits your bore properly (nothing about paper-patched bullets here, just grease-grooved bullets). Those three things are key; fouling control, bullet lube, and the right bullet. HiBC got into info you'll need to read again, too, as you begin your journey. Above all, don't get discouraged, and I'll also say this; if you can stick with this reloading project you're about to take a shot at (pun intended), and end up with quality, custom, accurate ammo using black powder and cast bullets, you'll be able to say loading for anything else is mere child's play, and that's just and only my opinion. So, if I were you (knowing what I know now about this business), and not ever having used a reloading press along with all the other equipment you'll need to acquire down this trail, this is what you MIGHT do to have some fun IF you have some fire-formed brass from your rifle, that hopefully you got with your "new" Sharps.

First, get a good case length guage to make sure your cases aren't too long. If your chamber is cut correctly, 2.8" is maximum for case length in a 110.

Buy a box of 50, pre-lubed, 525 grain Postell bullets, sized @ .458" with a 20:1 lead-tin alloy. Should be fairly easy to find; I'll bet Buffalo Arms has them. Call them yet? Also, if you order bullets from BACO (Buffalo Arms acronym), also get a bag of .45 cal., .060" veggie wads.

Get a hand priming tool; I have a Lee hand tool that I use occasionally, they're fairly cheap (used to be anyway). That's a good first tool to get (IMO), along with your case length guage/caliper. For now, any large rifle primers will do.

Then, of course, black powder. Good ol' 2fg GOEX will serve you very well to start with.

IF you have CLEAN, FIRE-FORMED cases of the correct length for your 110, prime them, measure out 100 grns. of b.p., dump it in the case and put one of the veggie wads over the powder, then tamp that wad down tight against the powder; use an end piece of an old 7/16ths ramrod for the tamper; works good (bet you have that...).

Wipe off the base of the bullet to make sure there's no bullet lube present there. And now this is where it may or may not be "iffy." You SHOULD be able to "finger seat" that .458" Postell bullet in the case mouth to push it TIGHT against the powder charge, with just your fingers. I've done this many times with my 45/70 Sharps. Using this method, you don't need a die set at all, just the priming tool. To test this "finger seating" business, take one of your Postell bullets, wipe it completely clean of all grease, and see if it will fit in the case mouth of an empty case; you'll know then if the method should work prior to having all your cases prepped with primer, powder and wad. A little resistance on trying to seat the bullet isn't a bad thing, either. Just keep in mind that you don't want to deform the bullet whatsoever when seating; I've used a leather pad to seat bullets in the palm of my hand for some extra help.

NOTE: You may have a bit of trial and error to find the right powder charge to use if 100 grains won't allow you to seat the Postell bullet so that all the grease grooves are covered/contained in the case AND TIGHT AGAINST THE POWDER CHARGE; NO AIR SPACES. Once you've got a round loaded as such, you should be ready to take it to the range. Your new rounds SHOULD chamber properly with a bit of freebore; that's what you want for these "fun" rounds. But first, you'll also need this stuff:

A range rod with a proper .45 cal. jag, appropriately sized 100% cotton cleaning patches, some black powder solvent, and a blow tube, preferably made from one of your fire-formed cases. Blow tubing is an art unto itself; more stuff to learn! Remember the comment on fouling control? That's all about the blow tube, unless you swab between shots, and that's something you can find out about later. Too much here already! Then, when you get home, you have to clean your rifle, and your cases. Rifle's easy to clean, cases take way more time. Won't get into that here, either. As Old Bear Claw Chris Lapp told the greenhorn Jeremiah, "You've got work to do." YouTube will show you an awful lot; this is only a beginning; stay after it and don't get overwhelmed. Learn all you can, and question what I've put down here. All this stuff has worked for me when I started out.

BTW, I have two Sharps rifles, both Shilohs, one a Hartford model in 45/70 (my hunting Sharps), and 45/90 long range express I use for the gong games I play a few times during the summer months. I use black powder exclusively in both rifles, cast bullets I mould myself, and the blow tube method with all my shooting done competitively. Since 2001, I've only missed two "Quigley" matches; always an experience that anybody who's into B.P.C.R. should participate in at least once (IMO). Quite the experience, every year.

One last comment here, does your buddy with the 45/90 reload? Sounds like there might be your first source for info on your journey. Also, if you can find anyone in your area that's into B.P.C.R. seriously, find that guy! There's so much involved, especially if you've never done any cartridge reloading....yet!


Good luck, Philip!


I also hope if anyone else on TFL can add or subtract to what I've posted here, have at it.

And again; www.buffaloarms.com