Mag positions in mag holster

jproaster · August 24, 2012, 10:40 AM

Two people in the last 24 hours have told me to place my mags (Which are vertically oriented on my belt) so that my index finger would find the bullet tip during quick reloading and thus would be my guide in reloading my glock. In their scheme the bullets would face forward in their holster.

I've tended to place them in the other direction (bullets facing rearward) since my motion requires no twist whatsoever. I kinda understand my thumb is always pointed toward me in the motion.

Your thoughts?

John, who admittedly performed only a quick search for relevant threads.

Shawn Thompson · August 24, 2012, 12:56 PM

At a very early age we as toddler's learned to point, mostly to proclaim what we wanted. Shortly thereafter we learned we could cup our hands touching our fingertips together and make a loop, or a circle. It didn't take us long after that to realize that not only could we take the finger we were pointing with and put it up through the loop in the other hand, and we could do it without looking... consistently. Little did we know at that age that we were actually teaching ourselves how to reload.

With the magazine positioned on a belt with the bullets facing forward, driving your thumb down between your torso and the magazine and gripiping it between your thumb and your traffic driving finger, your index finger will lie nicely down the front. The movement from the belt to the mag well then is a natural and indexable motion than can easily be repeated and without having to look - put your finger in the loop.

Furthermore, this positioning opens up the flat back edge of the magazine to the flat back edge of the magazine well, another solid index point. In Addition, rolling the fingers forward opening up your hand (pointing your fingers down range) while seating the magazine will stretch out the skin on your hand slightly and help prevent getting it pinched between the magazine base plate and the lip of the mag well. And while not life threatening, blood blisters on the palm of your hand just make you feel stupid!

Slopemeno · August 24, 2012, 01:02 PM

Take a moment and watch some videos of other shooters in IDPA/USPA/etc. How many of them have the magazines facing to the rear? Next to none.

Your facing rearward setup makes you twist your had prior to grabbing the mag in the pouch.

NWGlocker · August 25, 2012, 11:29 AM

FYI, trainer/instructor Rob Pincus has his magazines the same way in some of his videos and he has the same arguments as the OP. I'd say use whatever works for you and stay consistent with your reload method.

Index finger is great but it won't work for everyone or every method. Take a horizontal mag pouch for conceal carry, for example (Safariland model 123). I'm hoping to add this to my CCW rig, as well as use it for IDPA

Don P · August 25, 2012, 11:43 AM

Quote:

FYI, trainer/instructor Rob Pincus has his magazines the same way in some of his videos and he has the same arguments as the OP. I'd say use whatever works for you and stay consistent with your reload method.

I concur, what has worked for me and I am comfortable with is bullets facing to the rear in the mag pouch. It works for me and I find having the bullets facing forward to be un-comfortable in doing a re-load.

Try both ways and practice with whichever way feels right to you and personally, screw what everyone else thinks.

BlueTrain · August 25, 2012, 12:26 PM

With my two and only magazine pouches, both double and with flaps, the magazines from either of my two pistols can only be carried one way, back to back. They won't fit any other way. But I find the rearward facing magazine easier to use.

raimius · August 25, 2012, 01:12 PM

Slowly practice both ways. Which is more efficient? Which is more reliable?

Don P · August 25, 2012, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Slowly practice both ways. Which is more efficient? Which is more reliable?

What I'll add to the good above advise is which feels more natural while doing the reload. If it feels natural speed (efficiency) will come with practice

jproaster · August 25, 2012, 08:34 PM

Thanks for the replies. I am going to practice the bullet forward method to give it a chance.

John

**Frank Ettin** · August 25, 2012, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don P

What I'll add to the good above advise is which feels more natural while doing the reload...

What feels natural isn't always the best idea. A big part of training and practice is to overcome instinctive reaction and to learn to automatically do instead what is most appropriate.

For example, when driving a car, one's instinctive reaction in the event of a skid is to apply the brakes. We know that is the wrong thing to do; and so, if one is lucky enough to get some training in high speed driving, one learns to stay off the brake, turn into the skid and, under some circumstances, even gently apply some throttle.

Pretty much the standard is bullets forward. Why that's the standard was well described by Shawn Thompson in post 2:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shawn Thompson

...With the magazine positioned on a belt with the bullets facing forward, driving your thumb down between your torso and the magazine and gripiping it between your thumb and your traffic driving finger, your index finger will lie nicely down the front. The movement from the belt to the mag well then is a natural and indexable motion than can easily be repeated and without having to look - put your finger in the loop.

Furthermore, this positioning opens up the flat back edge of the magazine to the flat back edge of the magazine well, another solid index point. In Addition, rolling the fingers forward opening up your hand (pointing your fingers down range) while seating the magazine will stretch out the skin on your hand slightly and help prevent getting it pinched between the magazine base plate and the lip of the mag well...

When doing something in a particular way has articulable advantages, it's often a good idea to train and practice to do it that way.

Nanuk · August 25, 2012, 11:53 PM

I carry mine as the OP does (bullets to the rear). For me it is the best reload, no twisting or jamming. I have been doing it that way for 25 years and I am not changing now.

TheNocturnus · August 26, 2012, 12:25 AM

My spare mag sits with the bullets pointing behind me. It is easier for me to grab the mag and reload that way. To each their own. Do what is more comfortable to you, not what someone else does.

ClydeFrog · August 26, 2012, 08:35 AM

Gun writer & ex-cop: Dave Spaulding wrote a few gun press articles about magazine changes and fast reloading techniques.
Check online for website links to his work.
I'd also say the fast index finger method may work best.

NWGlocker · August 26, 2012, 09:47 AM

With my current competition gear, my bullets face forward and I use the index finger on the bullet side of the magazine method. That being said, I don't think bullets facing the rear should be considered incorrect. The conventional wisdom of "majority rules" doesn't mean it will work for the individual. What if that person has arthritis or an injury that limits their range of motion, for example? The other issue is we're talking about bullets forward with a shallow pouch, on the hip, that allows you to get a full grip on the magazine. Not everyone is going to have that setup (IWB conceal, MOLLE mag pouch, pants pocket carry).

This is an ergonomics argument that's almost impossible to fully explain in words, but i think if you're trying to factor in the amount of twist in the hands, the magazine, and the fingers, it's really a wash between the two methods.

Anyone have any videos and stopwatches?

August 24, 2012, 10:40 AM	#1
jproaster Senior Member Join Date: November 14, 2010 Location: SE Tennessee Posts: 239	Mag positions in mag holster Two people in the last 24 hours have told me to place my mags (Which are vertically oriented on my belt) so that my index finger would find the bullet tip during quick reloading and thus would be my guide in reloading my glock. In their scheme the bullets would face forward in their holster. I've tended to place them in the other direction (bullets facing rearward) since my motion requires no twist whatsoever. I kinda understand my thumb is always pointed toward me in the motion. Your thoughts? John, who admittedly performed only a quick search for relevant threads.

August 24, 2012, 12:56 PM	#2
Shawn Thompson Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2009 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 101	At a very early age we as toddler's learned to point, mostly to proclaim what we wanted. Shortly thereafter we learned we could cup our hands touching our fingertips together and make a loop, or a circle. It didn't take us long after that to realize that not only could we take the finger we were pointing with and put it up through the loop in the other hand, and we could do it without looking... consistently. Little did we know at that age that we were actually teaching ourselves how to reload. With the magazine positioned on a belt with the bullets facing forward, driving your thumb down between your torso and the magazine and gripiping it between your thumb and your traffic driving finger, your index finger will lie nicely down the front. The movement from the belt to the mag well then is a natural and indexable motion than can easily be repeated and without having to look - put your finger in the loop. Furthermore, this positioning opens up the flat back edge of the magazine to the flat back edge of the magazine well, another solid index point. In Addition, rolling the fingers forward opening up your hand (pointing your fingers down range) while seating the magazine will stretch out the skin on your hand slightly and help prevent getting it pinched between the magazine base plate and the lip of the mag well. And while not life threatening, blood blisters on the palm of your hand just make you feel stupid! __________________ Qui non proficit deficit Last edited by Shawn Thompson; August 24, 2012 at 01:32 PM.

August 25, 2012, 12:26 PM	#6
BlueTrain Senior Member Join Date: September 26, 2005 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 6,141	With my two and only magazine pouches, both double and with flaps, the magazines from either of my two pistols can only be carried one way, back to back. They won't fit any other way. But I find the rearward facing magazine easier to use. __________________ Shoot low, sheriff. They're riding Shetlands! Underneath the starry flag, civilize 'em with a Krag, and return us to our own beloved homes! Buy War Bonds.

August 25, 2012, 11:53 PM	#11
Nanuk Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2005 Location: Where the deer and the antelope roam. Posts: 3,082	I carry mine as the OP does (bullets to the rear). For me it is the best reload, no twisting or jamming. I have been doing it that way for 25 years and I am not changing now. __________________ Retired Law Enforcement U. S. Army Veteran Armorer My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon.

August 26, 2012, 12:25 AM	#12
TheNocturnus Senior Member Join Date: May 29, 2011 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,097	My spare mag sits with the bullets pointing behind me. It is easier for me to grab the mag and reload that way. To each their own. Do what is more comfortable to you, not what someone else does. __________________ My EDC: Gun Wallet Brain (Use this one the most)

August 24, 2012, 01:02 PM	#3
Slopemeno Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2007 Posts: 2,663	Take a moment and watch some videos of other shooters in IDPA/USPA/etc. How many of them have the magazines facing to the rear? Next to none. Your facing rearward setup makes you twist your had prior to grabbing the mag in the pouch.

August 25, 2012, 11:29 AM	#4
NWGlocker Member Join Date: January 2, 2011 Location: Pacific NW Posts: 20	FYI, trainer/instructor Rob Pincus has his magazines the same way in some of his videos and he has the same arguments as the OP. I'd say use whatever works for you and stay consistent with your reload method. Index finger is great but it won't work for everyone or every method. Take a horizontal mag pouch for conceal carry, for example (Safariland model 123). I'm hoping to add this to my CCW rig, as well as use it for IDPA

August 25, 2012, 01:12 PM	#7
raimius Senior Member Join Date: January 27, 2008 Posts: 2,199	Slowly practice both ways. Which is more efficient? Which is more reliable?

August 25, 2012, 08:34 PM	#9
jproaster Senior Member Join Date: November 14, 2010 Location: SE Tennessee Posts: 239	Thanks for the replies. I am going to practice the bullet forward method to give it a chance. John

August 26, 2012, 08:35 AM	#13
ClydeFrog Junior member Join Date: May 1, 2010 Posts: 5,797	David Spaulding, mag reloading methods... Gun writer & ex-cop: Dave Spaulding wrote a few gun press articles about magazine changes and fast reloading techniques. Check online for website links to his work. I'd also say the fast index finger method may work best.

August 26, 2012, 09:47 AM	#14
NWGlocker Member Join Date: January 2, 2011 Location: Pacific NW Posts: 20	With my current competition gear, my bullets face forward and I use the index finger on the bullet side of the magazine method. That being said, I don't think bullets facing the rear should be considered incorrect. The conventional wisdom of "majority rules" doesn't mean it will work for the individual. What if that person has arthritis or an injury that limits their range of motion, for example? The other issue is we're talking about bullets forward with a shallow pouch, on the hip, that allows you to get a full grip on the magazine. Not everyone is going to have that setup (IWB conceal, MOLLE mag pouch, pants pocket carry). This is an ergonomics argument that's almost impossible to fully explain in words, but i think if you're trying to factor in the amount of twist in the hands, the magazine, and the fingers, it's really a wash between the two methods. Anyone have any videos and stopwatches?

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