GRRR! (I tried lead bullets again)

[nyetter]

When I first started loading for the .38, I tried some D&J cast bullets. They were of a typical DEWC style, with colored wax lube. Anyway I hated them, each shot produced a huge cloud of smoke (which my range's vent system couldn't well handle). Content to pay extra for plated bullets, I wrote off lead.

For whatever reason, I figured I'd give lead another shot. Maybe the D&J just had the world's smokiest lube or something. So I bought...
Hornady 148gr HBWC - 250ct
Remington 148gr HBWC - 100ct
Speer 148gr HBWC - 500ct

The Hornadys have a checkered surface that holds a powdery lube. They are very slick, so much so that I felt I could nearly seat them with finger pressure. The Remingtons have this awful, nasty, flaky lubricant that gets your hands dirty as all get-out. The bases are also slightly oversized, and my normal amount of mouth flare wasn't large enough to start them. Unwilling to readjust my dies, I just set them on top for seating, which worked fine aside from a bit of lead and lube being scraped off. The Speers have an invisible, sticky-feeling lubricant. They were the cleanest to handle and produced the nicest-looking loaded rounds.

My preliminary results shooting 10rds each over 2.8gr Bullseye...
Hornady - lots of smoke, cleanest holes I've ever seen in a target, good accuracy
Remington - even more smoke, best accuracy by far
Speer - least smoke, worst accuracy
Rainier (control) - accuracy on par with Hornady, zero smoke

GAH! Why oh why did the best results have to come from the biggest PITA? I'm certainly going to do some more experimentation, but at this point I'm nearly sorry I bothered to try. I have no idea how people tolerate shooting lead on a consistent basis. 6 rounds put enough smoke in the air to obscure the target, never mind its effect on my breathing!

[zanthope]

I've recently purchased an aftermarket barrel for my Glock 30 so that I could shoot inexpensive lead at the range. Lead bullets are approximately 1/3 the cost of jacketed for a .45 ACP.

I agree the smoke is an unhealthy, unwelcome factor in shooting lead. AFAIK, there is no getting away from it.

I would never consider shooting these indoors. Even if I could tolerate it, I would be uneasy about what I might be inflicting upon others nearby who might have asthma or emphysema, or a high sensitivity to air pollution.

For me, it's jacketed inside, lead outside.

[444]

"I have no idea how people tolerate shooting lead on a consistent basis. 6 rounds put enough smoke in the air to obscure the target, never mind its effect on my breathing!"

Because we shoot them outside ?

I haven't shot on an indoor range for years. The last time I did, they did not allow lead bullets. You had to shoot jacketed bullets due to airborne lead contamination.

[nyetter]

I guess I'm in a bad position then, as the nearest outdoor range... in fact, the only outdoor range in the area to my knowledge, is very far away, costs quite a bit more, and doesn't allow rapid fire. There's a gravel pit in the hills we go to, but it's an hour's drive and we lose the benefit of automated target carriers.

[shu]

You can try

http://precisionbullets.com/

the plastic coated ones. Price is OK. Got some 9mm roundnose to try. They shoot OK in my Beretta 92FS and Glock26. Many time I peel off a sliver of lead when seating the bullets - probably because I try to keep the case mouth flare to the bare minimum.

I am leaning toward standardizing on plated bullets as the best compromise of price and workability.

But try the plastic ones make yr own decision.

[Pampers]

Under-bullet/over-powder wads have long been the solution to bullet lube smoke. In black powder days, cardboard or "vegetable fiber" wads were used. I have used wool fiber Wonder Wads, but find NECO Poly Wads, which are polypropolene with moly on one surface, to do the best job.

While nothing, except the polymer coated Precision bullets mentioned by shu, will completely eliminate smoke from cast bullets, the alternative is greater expense, and barrel errosion. In fact, for various reasns, you probably CAN'T wear out a modern barrel with cast bullets.

[labgrade]

Well hell, nyetter, you're using too much powder! Use 2.7 grs Bullseye with that Horn HBWC & you'll be all set. Everyone knows that.

Seriously. I dunno. The 2.7 load w/Horns is my 90%+ load all my .38/.357 shooting. Never noticed it being smokey in the least.
'Course, me too ... don't recall ever shooting indoors at all (well, fun stuff anyway ... )

[444]

nyetter
I feel your pain. I am lucky enough to be able to shoot in the great outdoors. When I lived in the city I was a member of a club where I could shoot outside and it wasn't all that far away, but I did shoot quite a bit in indoor ranges usually because that is what other people wanted to do. I never liked the fact that there wasn't good light. But, shooting on an indoor range is better than not shooting at all.
I was shooting some home cast bullets today lubed with liquid Alox. They were certainly smokey. And I would imagine this would not be the way to go indoors.

[braindead0]

You might consider Meistercast or Lasercast bullets, I use both for IDPA (.357 revolver) and have shot these in indoor matches without any really excessive smoke.

[Selfdfenz]

What Shu said.

E-mail Precision and see if they will whip up a box of 10-20 bullets for you to try. If these don't suit you stop trying.
S-

[tonyz]

I am in the same boat as you. Over the years i have searched for that cleanest, lowest leading, most accurate bullet! This has been a real job. I have used and still use the above mentioned Precision bullets. There is little or no smoke, they are one of the most accurate bullets I have used. They also are very clean to handle. I know that you would be very happy with them.
I still use west coast plated bullets too as they are very accurate and produce even less lead gas then the Precision bullets . I have a medical condition the requires as little lead as possable entering my blood stream.

If you have any question email me.

[email protected]

Tony