IMR4895 isn't metering well... what to use instead?

[DarthNul]

I've had very limited powder choices for my .223 Rem loading. I got a few pounds of IMR4895 when my local reloading store got a shipment.

I worked up a load with 62gr Nosler varmageddon bullets that shoots pretty well and I hoped to use it for weekly highpower league. THe problem is that I trickled every charge when I was working up the load but I want to meter the production runs.

My Hornady measure doesn't work well at all with the 4895. Most drops are OK but every 15-20 drops yields one that is 1 1/2 to 2 grains light. I expected my Lee auto-disk to do better, and it does, but I'm still seeing a .6 gr extreme spread.

I don't know if I can do anything to fix this other than spending a lot of time trickling, or finding a similar performing powder that meters better. A powder that does not need hotter or magnum primers (like H335 does) would be preferred since primers are also hard to get and all I have on hand is CCI small rifle.

Any suggestions?

[Brian Pfleuger]

The first question is, does it matter?

Are all dispensed charges in the safe zone?

If so, how does that ammo shoot?

[DarthNul]

THe metered loads shoot well about half of the time. If I shoot ten groups of three shots each, half the groups are great: .2" to .6". The other half of the groups suck. All groups shot at 100 yards, AR-15, 18" heavy barrel with 1 in 8 twist.

[Jimro]

Well, off the top of my head I think CFE223 or AR-Comp are the best contenders.

Also in the running Win748, BLC-2, PowerPro-2000 MR or Power Pro Varmint.

All will meter better than IMR4895, although no guarantees on group size.

Jimro

[hooligan1]

Well Brian some of us handloaders count on hitting our weights "dead nuts", although there are experienced competition shooters that swear <1> grain is no problem...

DarthNul, can you dispense while lighly tapping dispenser with a small diameter dowel like just bigger than a bottlerocket stick, it may help the kernels from bulking up like they do sometimes in my RCBS Uniflow.. Remember ever so lighlt tapping, it may quale the necessity of trickling, maybe not...

[Boomer58cal]

Try one of these...http://www.midwayusa.com/product/699...-powder-baffle

I made one at home with some tin snips. It helps a lot but I still trickle every load. I've loaded several thousand rounds of
223 with 53g V-max for my Bro's Bushmaster AR-15. 26.0g's of IMR-4895 shoots 1/2 moa in his box stock Bushmaster. I trickled every load within the tenth of a grain. The baffle got me within a half a grain. Half a grain is good enough for government work but I'm too OCD for that.

Boomer

[jwrowland77]

Try Win 748 or Power Pro 2000-MR. Both meter well and pour like water.

[Brian Pfleuger]

Originally Posted by hooligan1

Well Brian some of us handloaders count on hitting our weights "dead nuts", although there are experienced competition shooters that swear grain is no problem...

DarthNul, can you dispense while lighly tapping dispenser with a small diameter dowel like just bigger than a bottlerocket stick, it may help the kernels from bulking up like they do sometimes in my RCBS Uniflow.. Remember ever so lighlt tapping, it may quale the necessity of trickling, maybe not...

Yes, we do and I am one but I also know it's not necessary. Is an extreme spread of 0.6 too much?

I don't know until it gets shot.

5 rounds at -0.3, 5 rounds at 0, 5 rounds at +0.3

Have someone else put the groups in unknown order.

Put up 3 targets. Shoot them "round robin" style.

Then if you really want to know, do it again, except mix all the loaded cartridges together and take out a random 5 for each group.

Technically, 5 is too small a number but few of us are going to waste 180 bullets to get a "real" answer.

Even that test really only answers the question at that charge range. A 0.6gr spread at a grain higher charge might be completely different.

Switching powders may be effective but there's no guarantee that a different powder will shoot better just because it meters better.

Shooting those bullets might be a "waste". Switching powders might be a "waste".
Roll your dice and take yer chances.

[RC20]

The answer is to get an electronic powder measure dispenser!

Don;'t over-think this, powder is scarce and its your chance to buy a great tool

My take is the RCBS is tops and Hornady is next (or versa visa).

I like the precision of the powder charges being very close so will get the RCBS or Hornady if it gets rated equal (whatever is less expensive).

But that said, W748 meters well. Still there are always the stick powders that are annoying and still shoot good or are the right one for the gun and the electronic powder dispensers really are a great way to go (and remove all that fiddly stuff with trying to find out if it makes any difference or not as you need to do it with each load, eliminates it as a factor (I.e. it has no negative and can be a positive but removes all doubt its an issue!)

[DarthNul]

Try one of these...http://www.midwayusa.com/product/699...-powder-baffle

Boomer58Cal: My Hornady powder measure came with the baffle so that's already done.

I don't think I'm going to get the Hornady measure to do any better. It's not so much a problem of variations from drop to drop with that measure, it's more a matter of one out every dozen or so drops being too light to even be in the ballpark.

If I can get the Autodisk measure to do just a little better, I'll go with that. If not, I'll have to trickle the remainder of my IMR4895 and hope something that meters well becomes obtainable before spring.

[FrankenMauser]

Most of the Reloader powders have a very short, fat granule. They meter better than the 4895 'logs'.
And, most (all?) of the Ramshot powders are spherical powders. They meter very nicely.

A few recent threads have expressed difficulty in locating Ramshot TAC. So, it may be getting more popular. But... TAC or X-Terminator would be the first things I tried to locate, if I was in your position.

[NWPilgrim]

My best loads for 62 gr FMJ and 62 gr TSX are with BL-C2 and H335. Great powders--if you cna find them. If not then trying a differnt measuring method may be best, either the electronic or Auto-Disk (works fine with Varget and H4895).

[sourdough44]

With those 62 grn bullets I'd go right to TAC. Meters great and all the rest is good too.

[cryogenic419]

You running a LNL AP with the LNL measure by chance? Kind of in the same predicament, Varget meters like crap in that thing for .223. I've been looking at Tac, a lot of people seem to be swearing by it.

Or you can go the route I went for all my highpower loads...RCBS Chargemaster combo. Yeah its pricey but man has it helped with dishing out consistant powder drops.

[HiBC]

I load Re-15 behind 77 gr bullets.My brother uses Benchmark behind 60 gr Nos Varmint Ballistic tips.

My Hornady measure works well for me.

All I do is bring the handle to a definite bump at the end of travel,both direstions.,and I pause a second at each stop.Thunk,pause,thunk,pause.

[Mike Irwin]

IMR powders are exceptionally forgiving to variations in weight as long as loading density is uniform.

Test it and make sure you need to replace it.

[jcinnb]

I find reloading a great sport in itself. When I find powders metering poorly, I set the measure low, weigh the charge and then trickle up to the exact amount.

I am obviously a simpleton but I get a kick out of moving that balance needle up to zero.

I understand this is not for the guy in a hurry.

Good luck.

[Boomer58cal]

4895... 72 years and still kicking

[iraiam]

I use several powders that don't meter well in any powder measure, in these cases I weigh each charge and dump it down the funnel where the powder measure should be.

I haven't quite built up enough justification for a chargemaster yet

[Jeff2131]

Im a nut for imr4320! I havent shot and checked groups on paper(not really interested) but i can tell you that it meters VERY well, is a medium burn rate, and im consistantly nailing a three inch steel target at 100yards, 28 out of 30 times. I shoot a standard AR using a 55gr hp flat base. I forget what the charge is off the top of my head but i keep it 1gr under published max. I also use this powder for my .308's and does an equally impressive job nailing a 3" steel target at 150 yards, scoped. Oh, and the 100 yard AR shot is without a scope, just a cheap $60 reddot. Give this powder a chance as it is a great powder that can be used with alot of different calibers.

[Hunter Customs]

Im a nut for imr4320!

Jeff2131, IMR 4320 is my favorite 223 powder in my bolt guns.
I was really shocked today when chronographing some 250 Savage loads I loaded for my Savage 99.

For the heck of it I checked one of my 223 bolt guns that has a heavy 20 inch barrel, the load I shoot in this rifle is 27.2 grs of IMR4320 under a Sierra 55 gr HPBT game king bullet, these loads went thru the Chrono a little over 3300FPS.

I've killed a lot of coyotes with this rifle and load, many of them out to 300 yards.

Best Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com

[Ole 5 hole group]

I've shot a lot of 335 with Fed 205 primers and never had any type of problem. Don't know the twist on your rifle but I like VV N135 for the 77 grain bullets - seems like 20.5 grains is the ticket for my AR and it meters very well in the LnL.

[DarthNul]

You running a LNL AP with the LNL measure by chance? Kind of in the same predicament, Varget meters like crap in that thing for .223.

The LNL measure is "stand-alone". I have an auto-disk on top of a modified Lee Pro 1000.

I did all the tests on a single stage LNL press and trickled them all. I want to use the progressive for production runs.

I'm going to start from scratch tonight and just run 100 or so cases through the Pro 1000 without seating any bullets. Then I'll measure all the charges. I might have had an issue where the auto-disk didn't quite slide the disks all the way forward. I don't know if the extra fraction of an inch mattered but I'll find out.

I also got an RCBS collet type bullet puller. I plan to pull 10 from each box of 100 that are already loaded and check for consistency.

I have 2 pounds of AA 2230 and a bit of TAC on hand. I'll run some tests with those too. I'm hoping the 2230 works good because it may be a very long time before I can get any TAC: My local reloading store guy says he doesn't expect to see any more TAC in "this lifetime or the next".

[oneoldsap]

W-748 or BL-C2