US Model of 1917 Eddystone

[Rocky23]

Came across this weapon I know very little about its history and value, looking to find info on both. Seems to have all original parts and components. They are all stamped with the #2 and it's serial is 9797 so I know it was made august of 1917 in the start of the mass production for WW1. but other then that not much more. Any thing would b of great help. Thanks in advance

[tobnpr]

Try posting in the Curios and Relics forum, you might get more responses.

[Huffmanite]

Yep, your post belongs in the curios and relics forum.

But, your Eddystone made M1917 is not that uncommon. Entering WWI, the U.S. Springfield and Rock Island arsenals couldn't make enough 1903 rifles to equip our troops, so the M1917 was issued to American soldiers. More of them were used in WWI than the 1903 Springfields. Matter of fact, after WWI, some wanted to replace the 1903 Springfield with the M1917 as the main battle rifle of the U.S. Military. While Remington owned the Eddystone plant, there are Remington and Winchester stamped M1917s too, with the Winchester stamped ones being the rarer. Remington had a contract from the British government to build what was a .276 cal? P14 rifle to replace the .303 Enfield rifle....so Eddystone plant built to make this rifle. Start of WWI, caused British to stay with the .303 cartridge and Eddystone made P14s were .303 rifles. Brits will cancel the contract and Eddystone began building the M1917 rifles, which were chambered in 30-06. the U.S military cartridge. Difference in bolt head and magazine between the P14 and M1917 as the .303 is a rimmed cartridge and the 30-06 is not. Unlike most U.S. rifles, the P14 and M1917 have a left twist bore too. Want to make a custom big bore rifle, the P14 is a nice action to build on and the M1917 action isn't too bad either. It's quite a chunk of metal.

I sold a decent condition still military Eddystone 1917 to a fellow range member for $550 a year or so ago. My price was on the low side. While bore on the rifle was quite good, minor problem with neck area of the chamber. Also, the stock had a problem with a crack in the wrist area....but, I do some decent woodworking and had repaired the crack.

Just google M1917 rifle, quite a bit about the rifle on its history.

[Rocky23]

The odd part about this rifle is I got it off an insurgent in Afghanistan. Who now lets just say is not around anymore cause he was usein it. Want to know if it's worth all the paper work and stuff I have to do to get it back to the US

[globemaster3]

You took a 1917, off an insurgent, in AFG... Man, if that rifle could talk! What kind of condition is it in? Can you post pics?

[kraigwy]

Yes its worth the effort to do the paper work and what other hoops you have to jump through to get it home.

I didn't know they allowed "bring backs" any more. Let us know how this works out.

Anyway, back to the M1917s, great accurate rifles. In original (non-sporterized) condition these rifles are getting rare.

With the advent of the CMP GSM games they are becoming more popular and therefore more expensive.

The M1917s are extremely strong actions and will handle just about any '06 ammo you can find.

The difficulty of the rifle is do to the long bolt and "cock on closing" action they are difficult to shoot in rapid fire. I've found them to be a real wrestling match shooting in the CMP Games. This can be over come with practice.

In truth on the average they aren't quite as accurate as the Springfield, (but neither is any other military bolt gun) but they still are extremely accurate.

It would take quite a bit of space to go into the history an use of the M1917 but there are several books out there that give you that info. I will say the Eddystone is the most common. Remington had the contract to build the '17s but didn't have the capacity to keep up with demand. They bought a locomotive plant at Eddystone and started making the rifles.

The M1917 was originally set up to supply the British with Enfields. But Remington was slow getting started and England expanded their Enfield plants to cover their needs brought on by WWI. When it looked like we were getting into the war we realized we didn't have the rifles to support our expedition forces, We had less then 1 Mil Springfields ( I forgot the exact number) to supply a deployed army of 2.5 Mil, so Remingtion, Eddystone and Winchester were called upon to produce the M1917s. Springfield just didn't have the capacity to produce the numbers needed.

The M1917 were pretty close to being chosen to replace the Springfields as our main battle rifle but politics from the supporters of the Springfield Armory won out, which personally I think was the right decision. Others are of the opinion the M1917 should have won out.

I would do anything necessary to get the rifle back as nothing more then a shooter in CMP matches, they aren't making any more.

But think again, one of your grandchildren shooting the rifle that "grandpa brought back from Afghan". We here those stories of my generation about our fathers and grandfathers' "bring backs" but those stories are few and far between now days.

It would be a great peace to add to your family legacy.

Good luck on getting it back. Keep us informed on your progress. As to price, several years ago I paid $750 for mine w/the Bayonet. Might have been too much back then, but its worth more then that now.

My Eddystone M1917:



Just to add: Odd date for this post as today being the 100 anniversary of the start of WWI.

[Rocky23]

the condition really is not that bad all considering...I took it completely apart and cleaned it because it was really really dirty, took about 7 hours just to get the rust and mud off of it, still needs a lot of work, didn't use anything more then clp, toothbrush, and rags so i didn't mess anything up. but here are some pics

[Rocky23]

I'm gonna have to talk to JAG and Legal to see if i can take it home, their are a lot of stipulations on weather u can or not and a lot of paper work to go with it, hopefully i can. we'll see if it works out.

By the way I'm an Army 18B

[Art Eatman]

Kids and grandkids will appreciate a rifle with a known and provable history.

I have my father's WW II bring-back M1Carbine that he carried through France and Germany. Helps remember the history of those dark years.

[kraigwy]

18B..............you guys have a lot more leeway then us grunts. You should be able to pull if off.

[Rocky23]

LOL, yea in some aspects but I'm trying to get it home leagaly. PPL think we're special but we got all the same rules as everyone else.

[hammie]

@Rocky23: You guys ARE special. We owe a great amount of gratitude and respect to all our men and women in uniform, serving now and in the past. So thank you for your service and your sacrifices.

Given your M17's history and the personal event surrounding its acquisition, I hope you're able to get it home.

Plus, the Enfield's are decent shooters. I shoot my P14 a lot. For one thing, the chamber is cut properly and it doesn't eat brass like my #4 SMLE.

[kilimanjaro]

I have a couple original M1917s, and a 'sporter' like you captured. Great rifles, and the cut-down one is a handy deer rifle.

Hope they let you bring it home.

Thank you for defending me. I'd do it myself, but too old for humping the barren hills of the Hindu Kush.

[Rocky23]

My job is just like everyone else's. It's just a job to me, pays the bills and provides for my family. Just happens to b something I love to do, "hunting". Coming across this Rifle was one of the weirdest things I've seen here. We get prolly 20-30 different types of weapons every time we go out. But coming back with something from the US, that was a first. I'm gonna do everything I can to get it back. However thanks for all the support guys.

[tahunua001]

ok well, worth is kindof subjective here. on one hand, it's a 'wartime bring back" meaning that it's service in war can be verified by at least one, first person account and probably by your paperwork to be authorized to take it home.

actual monetary value is quite low. it's been sporterized, or cut down, notice that the stock on Kraigs extends almost completely to the muzzle while yours ends about halfway down the barrel. this was done by somebody to make the rifle lighter and easier to carry for extended periods of time. they also threw away the upper handguard and the retention ring for it, along with the bayonet lug/front stock band. the rifle is also missing almost all of its finish, they were originally blued, yours looks almost like white steel at this point. it's quite pitted. as far as sentimental value goes, this rifle is off the charts but for actual monetary value goes it's probably worth less than $200. in original condition like Kraigs rifle, they go for upwards of $800.

[Unlicensed Dremel]

I love those rifles. Look up "bomb-proof" in the dictionary, and there is a 1917 with a Mosin.

[globemaster3]

Incredible! You might still be able to find a stock and parts to bring it back to original configuration. At least nobody cut off the rear sight ears.

[Mike Irwin]

Does anyone else think that the markings in Rocky's second picture look.... wrong?

The letters look to be oddly spaced...

The S in US looks like it's taller than the U.

I've never seen a descender on the top bar of the 7.

And it looks like the F and 1 (of 1917) are smashed so tightly together that there's no space between them.

This is what the marking normally looks like:

http://cdn.theboxotruth.com/wp-conte...4/06/e71-6.jpg

Could this be a Khyber Pass copy?

[kraigwy]

Mike may be right, I didn't look that close. I was thinking more of the "bring back" aspect.

If it is a "Khyber Pass copy" then to me bringing home that rifle would be more valuable then an unmodified M1917.

Can you imagine years from now, some guy dragging out grandpa's Khyber Pass made rifle. The history alone would be priceless.

Guess that's the Military History Buff in me showing.

Here is the lettering on my M1917 to compare with the OP's. One would have to really examine the rifle to tell for sure but I think its exciting if it could be a Khyber Pass copy.

[gyvel]

Does anyone else think that the markings in Rocky's second picture look.... wrong?

I think you're on to something there, Mike. The periods after "U" and "S" are not correctly placed either. Also, although I can't be sure, it looks like the stock wasn't inletted for the handguard retainer collar.

If they're capable of making something that complex, my hat's off to them.

[mapsjanhere]

Kraig, you need to edit the wikipedia entry on the M1917, according to them Eddystone only made 1.18 M M1917, and your serial number is 1.21 M.

[Jim Watson]

The spacing between Model 1917 and Eddystone is wider on the OP's than others I find pictures of.

I think a Darra 1917 would be a great war trophy. I don't know that I would shoot it much if any; they do neat work with mystery metals.

I wonder why they would bother. I mean they have been making SMLEs and AKs that are standard equipment in that region, why copy an obsolete US rifle?

[gyvel]

I wonder why they would bother. I mean they have been making SMLEs and AKs that are standard equipment in that region, why copy an obsolete US rifle?

My guess would be the prestige of owning an "American" rifle.

[Mike Irwin]

I have never heard of a Khyber Pass copy of an American bolt action rifle at all.

I can't even conceive as to how any got over there to be copied, unless the British shipped to that area the M1917s that we sent them during World War II.

[James K]

1. The markings are definitely "off". I have no idea of the origin of the rifle and won't even speculate without better pictures and information.

2. Eddystone made over 1,376,000 Model 1917's. If it says otherwise, Wikipedia is wrong. (Not for the first or only time; it is a good quick reference, but not one to depend on as the only source.)

3. Obviously, the OP can find many Eddystone Model 1917's in the U.S., but that is the ONLY one he captured in Afghanistan. If it is a fake or copy, that is not bad, it is even better because it is unique, not one of 1.3+ million.

4. It is my understanding that GIs have been allowed to bring back guns that qualify for antique or Curio and Relic status. That rifle is not an antique, but would be a C&R. If I were the OP, though, I would assume the markings are correct for "bringback" purposes. If they are not, then the question may arise as to when it was made, etc., etc. If they are correct, and you get my point, bringing it back might be easier.

Jim